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What's the beef with Cream the Rabbit?


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Being more serious than my previous post, Cream honestly strikes me as a better suited to being a side character to the Chaotix. We’ve had past media where Vector and the others interact with Vanilla, and having an innocent child have her own little role in part of the more grounded Chaotix stories involving detective work would arguably be a lot easier to make her work than trying to make her passive personality fit into the ultra high octane action film-esque Side of the Sonic series. Plus she could probably bounce off of Charmy more easily than Amy, since her possible capacity for politeness judo to Charmy’s hyperactivity is there.

Mind you this assumes that the Chaotix ever get anything like that and that they ever have any more detective orientated stories as opposed to be shoved into the main action series, so make of that what you will.

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6 minutes ago, SenEDDtor Missile said:

Being more serious than my previous post, Cream honestly strikes me as a better suited to being a side character to the Chaotix. We’ve had past media where Vector and the others interact with Vanilla, and having an innocent child have her own little role in part of the more grounded Chaotix stories involving detective work would arguably be a lot easier to make her work than trying to make her passive personality fit into the ultra high octane action film-esque Side of the Sonic series. Plus she could probably bounce off of Charmy more easily than Amy, since her possible capacity for politeness judo to Charmy’s hyperactivity is there.

Mind you this assumes that the Chaotix ever get anything like that and that they ever have any more detective orientated stories as opposed to be shoved into the main action series, so make of that what you will.

Huh. You know, I never really thought about that one much.

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*Unnecessary nitpick*

Why did you use her Riders pic as an example?

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23 minutes ago, Tornado said:

She's great when you want to play a Sonic game without actually looking at the screen.

SonicTeam:"Shit-- they're onto us!!"

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I don't hate Cream, but she is definitely the prime example of a character that was only created for one specific niche (filling out Amy's team) and the developers never thought of what to do with her afterward. Even in her "major" appearances, she never really stands out aside from being a pacifist in a series where everyone has some type of crazy fighting ability. 

So yea, she kind of legitimizes a lot of the complaints about the series having an over-bloated cast because she really has no role to fill that can't be filled by anyone else. 

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1 minute ago, Kuzu the Boloedge said:

I don't hate Cream, but she is definitely the prime example of a character that was only created for one specific niche (filling out Amy's team) and the developers never thought of what to do with her afterward. Even in her "major" appearances, she never really stands out aside from being a pacifist in a series where everyone has some type of crazy fighting ability. 

So yea, she kind of legitimizes a lot of the complaints about the series having an over-bloated cast because she really has no role to fill that can't be filled by anyone else. 

She frankly would probably work better in smaller scale conflicts imo. Hence why I figured above she’d be better as a side character to the Chaotix along with her mom in more grounded detective stories than tagging along with Amy in every conflict.

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I mean, the fact that people didn't realise she was missing until now, when it has been several years (8 years), really says a lot about how much people care for her.

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5 minutes ago, SenEDDtor Missile said:

She frankly would probably work better in smaller scale conflicts imo. Hence why I figured above she’d be better as a side character to the Chaotix along with her mom in more grounded detective stories than tagging along with Amy in every conflict.

She doesn't need to be tied to the Chaotix; let the Chaotix have their own thing. But I do agree Cream doesn't really need to be a major character.

 

I've long held the opinion that certain characters just....aren't suited for larger roles and Cream and the Chaotix are two of the examples I can use. Its not that I don't like them, its more that I feel they lack a lot of traits that would get people interested unless you're a diehard fan. 

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12 minutes ago, Kuzu the Boloedge said:

I don't hate Cream, but she is definitely the prime example of a character that was only created for one specific niche (filling out Amy's team) and the developers never thought of what to do with her afterward.  

I remember hearing somewhere that she was specifically created for the anime series, Sonic X. (Like how Sticks was created for Boom) Sonic Team decided last minute to put her in Advance 2 to coincide with the release of the anime, replacing Amy's role in the game. 

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1 hour ago, Pawn said:

I'd rather Marine replaced her, if Amy must have a sidekick.

Marine was created to bounce off of Blaze and work in tandem with her arc, so I'm gonna have to disagree there. Amy doesn't really need a 'sidekick' but if you wanted to try one anyway I think Cream's reigned in manners contrasts with Amy's more headstrong tendencies fine. They had an angle there that came up in Heroes a few times but they didn't really use it outside of that. She was dumped about as soon as she started showing up, really.

That kinda brings me to my next point. I don't really like Cream but she's already a character who sits in the background if she even shows up so I'm not sure what people in this topic want from her. Do they want her to appear more so they can actually do something with her or would they just complain about that? Does she need to be wiped completely from her background NPC role? Why care about her either way at that point? They've already "fixed" the problem with her by wiping her from the main series after Heroes and only using her to fill spinoff games up. 

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1 minute ago, Wraith said:

Marine was created to bounce off of Blaze and work in tandem with her arc, so I'm gonna have to disagree there. Amy doesn't really need a 'sidekick' but if you wanted to try one anyway I think Cream's reigned in manners contrasts with Amy's more headstrong tendencies just fine. 

I don't really like Cream but she's already a character who sits in the background if she even shows up so I'm not sure what people in this topic want from her. Do they want her to appear more so they can actually do something with her or would they just complain about that? Does she need to be wiped completely from her background NPC role? Why care about her either way at that point? They've already "fixed" the problem with her by wiping her from the main series after Heroes and only using her to fill spinoff games up. 

I've actually talked with someone who is a diehard Cream fan (for some reason...) and most of it is feeling she "has potential" and wants to see it realized. So honestly, I think a lot of people just have a bit of unrealistic expectations for certain characters and then get disappointed when they aren't met. A self-fulfilling prophecy. He wants Cream to have a bigger role and think it sucks Sega won't give it to her, but when Sega does use Cream, its now how he which legitimizes his complaints even more.  

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I'm not going to judge people for being fans of a minor character, when I for one am like that. 

I'm saying that I don't care for Cream and she's perhaps the only one along the Zeti that I would not miss, although we need villains desperately.

The only way I want Cream back into the series is with a redesign and a relaunch, maybe? Plus more energy and personality but that basically turns her into a different character. More something like Bo Peep in Toy Story 4 as it seems. Seems like a fitting comparison!

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3 minutes ago, Kuzu the Boloedge said:

I've actually talked with someone who is a diehard Cream fan (for some reason...) and most of it is feeling she "has potential" and wants to see it realized. So honestly, I think a lot of people just have a bit of unrealistic expectations for certain characters and then get disappointed when they aren't met. A self-fulfilling prophecy. He wants Cream to have a bigger role and think it sucks Sega won't give it to her, but when Sega does use Cream, its now how he which legitimizes his complaints even more.  

I was more talking about the people who are indifferent or hate her. She's long been dumped, so there's nothing to say, really.

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5 minutes ago, Wraith said:

I was more talking about the people who are indifferent or hate her. She's long been dumped, so there's nothing to say, really.

Yea, I don't...have any positive or negative feelings about her either way. When she shows up she doesn't do anything of note, so I'm not really seeing why I should care about her, and her absence doesn't exactly make me wish  she'd come back so...

There's really not much to add lol. I don't know what OP is talking about because if anything, people are more indifferent to her than hate her outright. And if you do hate her...well...oh well. 

8 minutes ago, Jack the Shadow said:

I'm not going to judge people for being fans of a minor character, when I for one am like that. 

I'm saying that I don't care for Cream and she's perhaps the only one along the Zeti that I would not miss, although we need villains desperately.

The only way I want Cream back into the series is with a redesign and a relaunch, maybe? Plus more energy and personality but that basically turns her into a different character. More something like Bo Peep in Toy Story 4 as it seems. Seems like a fitting comparison!

Yea, that's the main reason I prefer the Zeti; you can talk about how  bad they are as you want, but the series does lack a set of villains. 

 

But for the love of me, I cannot be bothered to care about Cream lol

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17 minutes ago, Kuzu the Boloedge said:

She doesn't need to be tied to the Chaotix; let the Chaotix have their own thing. But I do agree Cream doesn't really need to be a major character.

 

I've long held the opinion that certain characters just....aren't suited for larger roles and Cream and the Chaotix are two of the examples I can use. Its not that I don't like them, its more that I feel they lack a lot of traits that would get people interested unless you're a diehard fan. 

I only suggested she be used with the Chaotix because their core gimmick of being detectives with money issues usually allows for more grounded and down to earth situations that would work better with the relatively passive Cream. Plus Vector’s own interest in Vanilla (even if only in Sonic X canon) could add another layer to the relationship.

I was really only thinking about how she’d work better in smaller scale conflicts more than trying to glue her to any specific group.

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25 minutes ago, Jack the Shadow said:

I mean, the fact that people didn't realise she was missing until now, when it has been several years (8 years), really says a lot about how much people care for her.

To be fair, that applies to most of the characters and she still reappeared among them when they were actually used. It was with Forces that her absence was became a little odd.

25 minutes ago, Myst said:

I remember hearing somewhere that she was specifically created for the anime series, Sonic X. (Like how Sticks was created for Boom) Sonic Team decided last minute to put her in Advance 2 to coincide with the release of the anime, replacing Amy's role in the game. 

Yeah, I saw that too and honestly, I'm gonna go ahead and say it might've just been a rumor, with the only thing giving it any legitimacy is the whole Sonic X embargo Archie went through for a while.

She's was originally conceptually as a variety of different animals to be a sidekick for Amy in Heroes, but it was decided that she would already be familiar with the audience as a way of freshening the sooner released Advance 2. Additionally, the whole reason that she's developed a reputation as a Game Breaker is because they decided to make her a character younger and/or novice players could use more comfortably.

 

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I hate pacifism, I hate the absurdity of a pacifist taking up a space in a fighting game roster, and finally, I hate the contrived notion that a deliberately cute character has to be a pacifist when her pet chao is also deliberately cute and a powerful fighter.  Maybe Japanese audiences like kawaii stuff enough to forgive all that but I have my doubts that the pacifism actually helps anything; Pokemon is also popular in Japan out of kawaii appeal and Pokemon fight as a central premise.  I think it would have been a better idea just to skip Cream as the middlewoman and bring in chao fighting, integrated with the chao garden mechanics; you wouldn't inherently have a game-breaker like cheese to help you fight through the levels and bosses, but you could power up a chao to that point if you worked hard enough.

Also as already stated, Cream's persona doesn't lend itself to a series centered on action, especially since the series started sawing off everything that didn't fit with that ideal starting in Sonic Unleashed.  The chao are among the things that got thrown out or massively deephasized, since raising them involves slowing down abd waiting around.  As many have said, more people are apathetic towards Cream than hate her, but the people who like her and like chao are not the sort of people who will necessarily like the series, since it's main focus is so different; thus they can't necessarily sell media nearly as well as they could in media where they were the main focus.

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2 minutes ago, SenEDDtor Missile said:

I only suggested she be used with the Chaotix because their core gimmick of being detectives with money issues usually allows for more grounded and down to earth situations that would work better with the relatively passive Cream. Plus Vector’s own interest in Vanilla (even if only in Sonic X canon) could add another layer to the relationship.

I was really only thinking about how she’d work better in smaller scale conflicts more than trying to glue her to any specific group.

Yes, but Cream doesn't have much to do with that? She lives a pretty well off life with her mother. 

Its not that I don't agree with what you're saying, I'm just kind of struggling to think of how. If anything, I can only see such a scenario being written as a footnote surrounding a much larger conflict surrounding Sonic. Like "A blink and you'll miss it" moment in a game. 

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21 minutes ago, Wraith said:

Marine was created to bounce off of Blaze and work in tandem with her arc, so I'm gonna have to disagree there. Amy doesn't really need a 'sidekick' but if you wanted to try one anyway I think Cream's reigned in manners contrasts with Amy's more headstrong tendencies fine. 

Pretty much.

24 minutes ago, Jack the Shadow said:

I mean, the fact that people didn't realise she was missing until now, when it has been several years (8 years), really says a lot about how much people care for her.

 

21 minutes ago, Wraith said:

They had an angle there that came up in Heroes a few times but they didn't really use it outside of that. She was dumped about as soon as she started showing up, really.

That kinda brings me to my next point. I don't really like Cream but she's already a character who sits in the background if she even shows up so I'm not sure what people in this topic want from her. Do they want her to appear more so they can actually do something with her or would they just complain about that? Does she need to be wiped completely from her background NPC role? Why care about her either way at that point? They've already "fixed" the problem with her by wiping her from the main series after Heroes and only using her to fill spinoff games up. 

Incorrect: Battle, Rush, and by legacy a few of the Archie comics still ran off of that aspect. Additionally, Cream herself was actually one of the most appearing major characters for a while alongside Rouge and Shadow. 

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39 minutes ago, Wraith said:

Marine was created to bounce off of Blaze and work in tandem with her arc, so I'm gonna have to disagree there. Amy doesn't really need a 'sidekick' but if you wanted to try one anyway I think Cream's reigned in manners contrasts with Amy's more headstrong tendencies fine. They had an angle there that came up in Heroes a few times but they didn't really use it outside of that. She was dumped about as soon as she started showing up, really.

That kinda brings me to my next point. I don't really like Cream but she's already a character who sits in the background if she even shows up so I'm not sure what people in this topic want from her. Do they want her to appear more so they can actually do something with her or would they just complain about that? Does she need to be wiped completely from her background NPC role? Why care about her either way at that point? They've already "fixed" the problem with her by wiping her from the main series after Heroes and only using her to fill spinoff games up. 

You're right about Marine and I wouldn't really pair her with Amy for that reason. I'd rather have her around than Cream is all.

And maybe the following question isn't aimed at me, but - I'm not really bothered if she shows up in a game or not, since her role is unlikely to be significant. The OP asked for reasons people don't like her, so I shared some.

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17 minutes ago, Jack the Shadow said:

 

The only way I want Cream back into the series is with a redesign and a relaunch, maybe? Plus more energy and personality but that basically turns her into a different character.

 

8 minutes ago, Scritch the Cat said:

I hate pacifism, I hate the absurdity of a pacifist taking up a space in a fighting game roster, and finally, I hate the contrived notion that a deliberately cute character has to be a pacifist when her pet chao is also deliberately cute and a powerful fighter.  Maybe Japanese audiences like kawaii stuff enough to forgive all that but I have my doubts that the pacifism actually helps anything; Pokemon is also popular in Japan out of kawaii appeal and Pokemon fight as a central premise.  I think it would have been a better idea just to skip Cream as the middlewoman and bring in chao fighting, integrated with the chao garden mechanics; you wouldn't inherently have a game-breaker like cheese to help you fight through the levels and bosses, but you could power up a chao to that point if you worked hard enough.

Okay, I guess this finally gives me something vaguely uncommon to talk about here: I sometimes feel like with Cream, people are making certain "problems" with her character out to be far larger and more severe than they actually are.

I'm gonna get my list from the front page again and go down it to address the holes and leaps of logic. But I'll go ahead and say this much: there's nothing wrong with mild mannered girl characters and pacifists in general.

 

17 minutes ago, Jack the Shadow said:

More something like Bo Peep in Toy Story 4 as it seems. Seems like a fitting comparison!

Yeah, what the hell is that about?

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I think the no cream thing is overblown, honestly. She appears in the mobile games, and was playable in the most recent Mario and Sonic game. She missed Forces and TSR, but both games were missing characters from the casts. She'll probably never have her Advance Glory days back, but she's still there.

.Like, did Omega fans think he was going to be retired because he was replaced by a generic robot in free riders and wasn't in Generations?

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For the most part, I don't care for Cream, but I did grow familar with her in the mid-00's, so I wouldn't mind seeing her return in a Heroes style game, racing title, or some other sort of spinoff game. Just keep her out of the games that have an Unleashed/Forces/Adventure kind of storytelling.

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