How niche is Sonic, or are his fans just waiting for a reason to return?

[Sonic Fan J]

Topic is the question obviously, but for a bit of context here a trend I've been noticing being used to argue against or for certain decisions is that Sonic has become a niche franchise that no one cares about anymore. This argument has been used to explain away the movie disregarding near everything about the franchise it is adapting, for why character driven spinoffs won't work, why the budgets of recent games have been minimal, the need to constantly reinvent the wheel, etc, etc. and yet during the SXSW panel today I was fairly positive that I heard Aaron Weber announce during the panel that Sonic Dash has reached 350 million downloads (If someone could fact check this for me since at the time of this posting I couldn't find that moment again). If this number is correct then that would mean that the game has been downloaded more times than the official population of the USA. Even if one accounts for multiple downloads from the same person you are still looking at dozens of millions of people which is anything but a niche number.

So, considering the above I represent the thread question; how niche is Sonic, or are his fans just waiting for a reason to return?

[Wraith]

 

It's treated as common knowledge around here that Sonic is on the decline but it's a metric I find hard to actually measure. Game sales are definitely down this decade from the last but I think just as much of that can be attributed to the poison that was the Wii U than anything else. Forces's numbers will tell the real story if we ever get to see them. I doubt it sold as much as the previous games anyway but we'll have to see. 

Whether theyre really on the decline or not the games definitely have a barebones feeling to them now that suggest less resources were being pumped into them at the turn of the decade. Sales were still fine when this stared though so I like to attribute this to Sonic Colors's success. They learned they could make critical darlings for much less than the resources they dumped into the likes of 06 and Unleashed.

This place is less crowded than it used to be along with other old community stomping grounds but a lot of fans and artists are just fine taking up a centralized platform to talk about the series instead. I know plenty of dissatisfied fans that have left the Fandom for greener pastures but it's hard to say how much the younger fans are filling in for the ones who left. 

I think it's an exaggeration to calm Sonic niche regardless. I think its fair to say his popularity is on the decline but this place tends to exaggerate the negative to comical degrees sometimes due to their perspective. 

[Rowl]

Sonic isn't really a niche franchise in my eyes. Not at all. Viva Pinata and Grabbed by the Ghoulies are niche, since not many people did heard of those games. Heck, I would even say, that games like DKC, Banjo-Kazooie, F-Zero, and Metroid more niche franchises compare to Sonic are. Sonic is a property that is always present every year. And the reason for this is because people keep him relevant somehow: Fanarts, fanfics, fan videos, animated TV shows, the upcoming movie, officially animated shorts form Sega that they can put on their Youtube channel, fan movies like those made by Dorkly, the official Sonic Twitter account, the official comics from Archie (formerly) and now IDW, youtube celebrities like the GameGrumps who make fun of the series (they are now playing SA2 on their channel), popular memes like the Sanic and Uganda Knuckles etc. all of those things keep the series alive.

No other series in the world is so much involved in other things besides the own game series than Sonic. Hardcore fans will always come back to Sonic, since they love the characters so much. This luxury has no other game series. If the next Crash or Spyro game fails, then yeah, they are once again gone, maybe forever, because there is nothing to come back for. People love those games because they are good games. Sonic, on the other hand, doesn't need to have good games to sell, he just needs everything else that surrounds the games.

So yeah, short story, Sonic is in my eyes no niche, since so many people know him from some were.  

[Tornado]

Sonic is niche enough that the games get curb stomped in coverage and sales every time there's a Mario release even within the vicinity of a Sonic release; but they are still big name 3D platformers that sell in decent numbers when virtually every other franchise in that genre has been dead for approaching two console generations now.

[Milo]

Personally speaking, when I’ve been defining Sonic as a niche series as of late, it’s almost always been with the dichotomy that I’m referring Sonic the video game series, as opposed to Sonic the all-compassing brand. In that context I think the niche association absolutely applies, even when factoring in general brand awareness—general audiences may recognize and even like Sonic; but that market, by and large, hasn’t been going out to buy the series’ games for years, based on the sales info we have on our hands.

And while I don’t think Sonic the all-encompassing brand is obscure, I do argue that the general reputation of the series‘ cornerstone products (or lack of it) does have a impact on how the public approaches the rest of the franchise. The Sonic brand is widely recognized; but for arguably half of the time the series is recalled in common circles, it’s not in the ways the fans might desire for it to be remembered.

[Dr. Detective]

Yeah. I did read an article online once that highlighted the idea that, regardless of personal opinion on the games and their quality, Sonic's probably still around mostly because he's... kind of the only series out there doing stuff quite like this. Like, the action-adventure mascot platformer thing. Mario, Yoshi, and Kirby have got their own flavor of it but it's a very different one from Sonic and I don't see much out there holding that position. 

I mean, Crash and Spyro got some re-releases so... there's that. I suppose.

Sonic's lucky as fuck. I don't know if anyone's worked that out yet. If he were just another FPS shooter, battle-royale game, or online service he'd probably be in the gutter right now. And he also probably wouldn't be a hedgehog or look or act anything like Sonic but I think you get the point. 

When something's out there that isn't really like anything else, it has a chance at standing on its own two feet, especially if it's already made a name for itself. That's why franchises that came out all those years ago to try and copy Call of Duty didn't fair as well as Call of Duty because the people already had Call of Duty. 

And now stuff like Anthem and Fallout 76 are trying and failing to follow a trend in an oversaturated market with very bad results. Anthem will be lucky if people even remember it was a thing in a couple of years at the rate its going. 

Plus, for some reason, there's a lot of people where I live who still recognize and like Sonic. 

Again, Sonic's really lucky. SEGA or Sonic Team or whoever's in charge need to hurry and make him worthwhile again. It's certainly not too late.

[MetalSkulkBane]

I guess he's niche if you compare to more popular genres, like RPG (Skyrim, Final Fantasy), or shooters (Call fo Duty, Resident Evil) and of course Sandbox (GTA, Minecraft).

But as far as platformers and mascots go? Popularity wise he's still at the top 5. He's too old, with too many games and surprising amount of spin-offs (cartoons, comic) to ignore.

Honestly, his fandom is probably why he still makes money, despite me less-than stellar games. Crash was put in coma for less than Rise of Lyric.

I mean look, https://www.fanfiction.net/game/  Of all video game franchises, Sonic is 4th in terms of fanfics, and Kingdom Hearts and Pokemon are kinda cheating. It doesnt' translate 1:1 to popularity (I'm sure Uncharted fans are less eager to writing fics), but gives some impressions regardless.

[Multikaris]

Given the number of fans who DIDN’T return for Mania, I thought for the longest time that it was too late, until I saw that the series was making new fans, to recoup the many lost forever. 

[The 3rd Option]

8 hours ago, Rowl said:

And the reason for this is because people keep him relevant somehow: Fanarts, fanfics, fan videos, animated TV shows... fan movies like those made by Dorkly, the official Sonic Twitter account, ... youtube celebrities like the GameGrumps who make fun of the series (they are now playing SA2 on their channel), popular memes like the Sanic and Uganda Knuckles etc. all of those things keep the series alive.

Since you brought this up, it seems that the fans (and non-fans like Game Grumps, ironically) are doing a better job keeping Sonic alive than Sega itself is doing. A lot of the success at keeping Sonic relevant is very grassroots. Hell, the biggest success in keeping Sonic alive with Sega's hand in it was produced by a group of hired fans.

That's what impresses me about the Sonic fandom. They may fight and argue and complain all the time, but they're doing the best job of keeping Sonic in the public eye when Sega's output is very hit-or-miss.

Maybe that really is the solution for Sonic. Hire more fans like Taxman and Stealth who can build the series out of what they loved in the first place. It might lead to stagnation, and it won't work forever, yes, but perhaps it's the best thing to do for now.

[Rowl]

Well, people just love the character of Sonic so much. This is what keeps him alive. It was the character that sold the games but never the games themselves. Even Mario and Zelda would have died out if they started with that many bad games in their lineups. But not Sonic. The character is just to be loved by fans.

[Tarnish]

Depends on compared to what. When AAA games like Battlefield V and such call 7 million units sold in a few months disappointing/underperforming and a Sonic game is considered a mega success if it sells 3 million units over years, yeah Sonic is definitely more niche.

[Red Hot Jack]

I think the fans stick around for big things like main games, especially nostalgia, so Mania… and if there was something to cater to Adventure fans, I'm pretty sure Unleashed and Generations sold a lot over the years.

The budget right now is lower because of commercial failures such as Lost World and Boom, which were exclusive to a dying console like the Wii-U, but it still hurt Sonic. Still, doesn't mean they can't make good games and Mania Plus and Team Sonic Racing can prove that.

Also, If fans love Sonic there should be a reason, for me it's his charisma, like he's a spitfire, impulsive, funny at times (depending on the writing), impatient and cocky, rebel, all those things, it's my favorite character and not just because I'm attached to him as a childhood icon. But yeah, he's niche nowadays.

[Foxthefox1000]

Sonic ain't at all niche. Sure, the games don't sell too well, but for how large the fandom is and how widely known the brand is? He's still got some vitality. 

Yes, he's kinda popular for being hilariously cheesy and having bad games, but infamy is still publicity.

Game Grumps, as a channel, have had a decline of viewers over time from their peak with Ocarina of Time; yet SA2: Battle has brought in half a mil in just under two days. With Gane Grumps, it's more of a symbiotic relationship in keeping them both relevant and popular, yet also proving that the mere title alone is enough to bring back a good portion of viewers for them.

[UpCDownCLeftCRightC]

4 hours ago, Tarnish said:

Depends on compared to what. When AAA games like Battlefield V and such call 7 million units sold in a few months disappointing/underperforming and a Sonic game is considered a mega success if it sells 3 million units over years, yeah Sonic is definitely more niche.

The (home) video game market today is much larger than it was in the early to mid 90s (although your comparisons do work for today).

In the early to mid 90s, sonic was one of the prominent franchises in existence and still wasnt selling 7 million per at his peak. Today if he had the same reputation, he easily would (not suggesting that will happen again).

But interesting thoughts in this thread. Sonic is truly in a strange position where his brand has gotten so recognizable over the years that he's hard to kill off, hes so imbedded in the pop culture conscience. But his games reputation hasnt been good so the sales dont reflect the public's awareness of him; Mania was the first game in a long time to truly break that trend.

 

I don't know what SEGA plans to do about this but I sort of have the impression that the SOA branch knows and cares about this since Sonic has always been more relevant here in the west. I hope they understand exactly what they need to do now and have the space to focus on fixing this problem.

[Tarnish]

10 minutes ago, UpCDownCLeftCRightC said:

I don't know what SEGA plans to do about this but I sort of have the impression that the SOA branch knows and cares about this since Sonic has always been more relevant here in the west. I hope they understand exactly what they need to do now and have the space to focus on fixing this problem.

I wouldn't be surprised if SEGA only kept making Sonic games to keep the brand in people's minds, while making most of the money from the Sonic merch and not the games. As long as people buy the latest trinkets, the games are only secondary to remind people that there's gonna be new merch for the new game.