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Stuff that are canon but that you wish wasn't

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The credit for the idea to this topic goes to marco9966, who casually mentioned the idea in another thread.

So what canonical elements of the Sonic universe do you wish didn't exist or were different?

For me, the number one thing is totally the "the classic games are a different dimension" thing, but I've already went on about that in other threads recently...

I also kinda wish that the characters official ages could have been different, by which I mean they could have been older. As a rule of thumb, I feel that most characters could have easily been 10 years older than they are. Sonic would have been 25, Amy 22, Vector 30, ect.

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I can tolerate "the classic games are a different dimension" thing when it's elaborated to mean that the events of Sonic Generations altered the timeline and split it off due to paradox, but I wish they didn't have a rule of making some characters exclusive to Classic or Modern Sonic.

Beyond that: Shadow the Hedgebhog.  So many of its additions to the backstory in SA2 make so little sense that I wish they'd just amputate it.  It's not exactly something Sega seems willing to revisit anyway, but as they haven't revisited SA2's version of the events either, I consider Shadow the Hedgehog to still be causing damage.

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I guess one that people are still hung up over is Blaze's involvement in 06. Not that she wasn't fun to play, but storywse her role should've gone to an original character if they weren't going to explain her presence.

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22 minutes ago, DabigRG said:

I guess one that people are still hung up over is Blaze's involvement in 06. Not that she wasn't fun to play, but storywse her role should've gone to an original character if they weren't going to explain her presence.

Would have been so fun to have a Gold the tenrec-type character in the games

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4 minutes ago, Marco9966 said:

Would have been so fun to have a Gold the tenrec-type character in the games

Assuming they brought her back, yeah.

Although Gold's backstory wouldn't really jive with that of Solaris.

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27 minutes ago, DabigRG said:

I guess one that people are still hung up over is Blaze's involvement in 06. Not that she wasn't fun to play, but storywse her role should've gone to an original character if they weren't going to explain her presence.

They explained her presence by not having her recognize Sonic. Not the same Blaze basically...which makes even less sense.

2 minutes ago, Marco9966 said:

Would have been so fun to have a Gold the tenrec-type character in the games

Why is her design so gorgeous?

tMSy6OS.png

 

1 minute ago, DabigRG said:

Assuming they brought her back, yeah.

Although Gold's backstory wouldn't really jive with that of Solaris.

Then make it jive.

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26 minutes ago, Scritch the Cat said:

I can tolerate "the classic games are a different dimension" thing when it's elaborated to mean that the events of Sonic Generations altered the timeline and split it off due to paradox, but I wish they didn't have a rule of making some characters exclusive to Classic or Modern Sonic.

Beyond that: Shadow the Hedgebhog.  So many of its additions to the backstory in SA2 make so little sense that I wish they'd just amputate it.  It's not exactly something Sega seems willing to revisit anyway, but as they haven't revisited SA2's version of the events either, I consider Shadow the Hedgehog to still be causing damage.

I don't think that would change anything. They have been trying to seperate shadow from his backstory kinda for years. And they are kind of still doing it now . I legit wouldn't be surprised if there was a 3d sonic type reboot shadow is more focused on aliens than anything else. I don't think removing it fixes the problem, the problem is they don't like sa2 shadow. There would just be more stuff they come up with later to effectively do the same thing shadow's game was trying to do

 

On topic

28 minutes ago, DabigRG said:

I guess one that people are still hung up over is Blaze's involvement in 06. Not that she wasn't fun to play, but storywse her role should've gone to an original character if they weren't going to explain her presence.

This

and

The concept of silver from the future? Its something they have largely seemed to have abandoned anyway... so fuck it. Just make him blazes friend , from blazes world and be done with it

 

 

3 minutes ago, MainJP said:

 

Then make it jive.

Why would sega do that at all, is the question you should ask yourself

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I’m baffled that Sonic stories continuously treat dimension and timeline as the same thing, interchangeably. That’s what made Blaze’s story all twisted up, when 06 and Rush came out within a year of each other. It’s like, they made this mistake already.

I would want classic and modern Sonic to remain the same Sonic, one from the past and one from the future. But I’d rather not need to have a second Sonic for classic gameplay. Like others have said in different threads, it might be a branding thing, but if it is it’s way off target from what people were asking for.

I’d also ask that Chronicles be dropped from the canon, although it likely already can’t be canon given it’s place in any timeline. I’m not a detractor of Chronicles, I liked it and wanted a sequel to improve on the areas they clearly dropped the ball (audio), but it’s a shame to see a Sonic RPG hit a wall and go nowhere. I just wish it never happened so that they could start over with that concept.

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2 minutes ago, Badnik Zero said:

I’m baffled that Sonic stories continuously treat dimension and timeline as the same thing, interchangeably. That’s what made Blaze’s story all twisted up, when 06 and Rush came out within a year of each other.

I would want classic and modern Sonic to remain the same Sonic, one from the past and one from the future. But I’d rather not need to have a second Sonic for classic gameplay. Like others have said in different threads, it might be a branding thing, but if it is it’s way off target from what people were asking for.

I’d also ask that Chronicles be dropped from the canon, although it likely already can’t be canon given it’s place in any timeline. I’m not a detractor of Chronicles, I liked it and wanted a sequel to improve on the areas they clearly dropped the ball (audio), but it’s a shame to see a Sonic RPG hit a wall and go nowhere. I just wish it never happened so that they could start over with that concept.

I think the only thing canon from chronicles at this point is a lawsuit

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  • Sonic 06 as a whole

 

...

 

Alright, jokes apart (Despite not a total lie), the first things it was what you mentioned, Classic Sonic being another dimension/younger version of Sonic. At the same time they have different personalities, S3&K is directly connected with Adventure (Specially with Knuckles), with that I also kinda wish Sonic Forces wasn't canon  and Sonic Mania was a direct sequel to Sonic & Knuckles.

But I think the biggest WTF? Sonic moment I've ever experienced was Sonic marrying with Sally and actually having a son and a daughter called Manik and Sonia.

59971a2019ebf6d0d0dcb2b026543322.jpg

I also wish very much Werehog wasn't a thing, even loving so much Sonic Unleashed levels (Even the PS2 ones).

 

Man I thought this was going to be hard but the list just goes on in my head...

 

Wish "Modern" Eggman kept the same characteristics of Classic "Robotnik", if this can be considered some kind of "uncanon".

Sonic Schoolhouse and Sonic Labyrinth if that counts.

Maybe Sonic X as I don't watch it in full but many people have hate over it.

I used to like Chip when I was younger, kinda wish he still was alive (If is that how it works).

 

---

 

Without looking the area you posted, I thought this was in general, not only Sonic so I'll say this anyways. I'm starting to wish Star Wars Sequels aren't canon and the Thrawn Trilogy (I'm reading the first book) back to be the real sequel of the story. Oh, and Jar Jar Binks, of course.

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This might be a slightly controversial answer, but literally every game from 2003 up until 2007, with the possible exception of the Advance and Rush games.  I just don't care for any of the games released during this period narratively or gameplay-wise.  I don't like the way the Chaotix were re-introduced, which influences how they are still characterized in the few appearances they have today.  Don't like how Cream was developed, even though I was really looking forward to her debut when I first saw her in the gallery on Mega Collection, don't like some of the obvious bads like Shadow and Sonic '06.  Generally speaking, even though it was springboarded by one of my favorite games in the series (SA1), even in this post-Sonic 4, post-Sonic Boom, and post-Sonic Forces timeline, these four years are still by and far my most disliked era of Sonic.  If I woke up one morning and forgot everything about that particular era (again minus the exceptions already noted above), I don't feel like I'd have lost anything too important.

2007 is about the time the series started to shape up for me.  Secret Rings wasn't particularly good, but I don't have any SIGNIFICANT qualms about the story or characters until Shattered Crystal and Rise of Lyric, which are pretty much as non-canon as non-canon can be, and Forces which is... well, less said about that, the better.

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7 minutes ago, MainJP said:

They explained her presence by not having her recognize Sonic. Not the same Blaze basically...which makes even less sense.

I know, right? :lol:  

7 minutes ago, MainJP said:

 

Why is her design so gorgeous?

tMSy6OS.png

Because she was created by Evan Stanley, who seemingly really likes Silver and did a whole fan series around him years beforehand.

7 minutes ago, MainJP said:

Then make it jive.

How though?

The thing with most Mobian characters, minus the artificial Shadow, is that they and their abilities are just something that is. There's no real story behind Sonic being fast, Tails being able to fly, Knuckles being to glide, or Silver being telekinetic. Which is generally fine since how they came to be isn't as important as them simply being.

Gold, from what I recall, is a telepath that has the backstory of coming from another dimension and being groomed by the Council of [whatever city]--a council that probably wouldn't be around in Crisis City, nevermind get screentime. At least with Blaze, people had a pre-established idea of her being a princess who was bullied for her powers over flames.

And that much detail is out of theme with the backstory regarding the Duke committing heresy, Solaris being splitting in half from being experimented on, and Elise having to live with the burden that comes with having Iblis sealed in her. 

(I forgot where I was going at this point, but you get the idea.)

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22 minutes ago, MainJP said:

Yeah, I guess they wouldn't. Same way they put Blaze in the game even though that made zero sense.

Yep

And they don't wanna touch anything from 06 anyway. So if they did bother bringing in comic stuff her whole story would just be different, or they just wouldn't care.

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30 minutes ago, Shadowlax said:

 I don't think removing it fixes the problem, the problem is they don't like sa2 shadow.

Which is ironic considering that's what people liked in the first place.

 

31 minutes ago, Shadowlax said:

 

The concept of silver from the future? Its something they have largely seemed to have abandoned anyway... so fuck it. Just make him blazes friend , from blazes world and be done with it

 

That wouldn't really work with the time traveling theme they had for that game.

That might work in subsequent appearances, though.

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Sonic is such an episodic series that it's rare that a previous installment affects a new one in any significant capacity. It's hard for me to think about how rewrites and decanonizations could affect the series when there's no real overarching narrative. If you don't like a new Sonic character or concept you could at least be rest assured that the status quo would get rid of it or at least shove it into the background by the time the next game rolled around. 
 

 


 

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31 minutes ago, Shadowlax said:

Why would sega try to make it jive

Uh, probably because in that situation, they'd be the ones responsible for Gold's existence and thus could do that if they wanted.

Not that they likely would.

31 minutes ago, Badnik Zero said:

I’m baffled that Sonic stories continuously treat dimension and timeline as the same thing, interchangeably. That’s what made Blaze’s story all twisted up, when 06 and Rush came out within a year of each other. It’s like, they made this mistake already.

Eh, not really.

06 erasing itself basically eliminated any rational idea of Blaze being from anywhere but the Sol Dimension initially. And there was apparently some DLC/sequel with Silver that got canned, so they probably could've explained whatever there.

In other news,

32 minutes ago, Badnik Zero said:

 

I would want classic and modern Sonic to remain the same Sonic, one from the past and one from the future. But I’d rather not need to have a second Sonic for classic gameplay. Like others have said in different threads, it might be a branding thing, but if it is it’s way off target from what people were asking for.

Technically speaking, an alternate timeline can be treated as a separate dimension depending on what time traveling framework you're adhering to.

34 minutes ago, Solister said:
  •  

But I think the biggest WTF? Sonic moment I've ever experienced was Sonic marrying with Sally and actually having a son and a daughter called Manik and Sonia.

59971a2019ebf6d0d0dcb2b026543322.jpg

 

Eh, it made sense for what Archie had been doing from the getgo. It was founded on the SatAM Bible, after all.

Sonia and Manik were just a cute shoutout to Underground(or a wordplay on Sonic Mania).

34 minutes ago, Solister said:

Wish "Modern" Eggman kept the same characteristics of Classic "Robotnik", if this can be considered some kind of "uncanon".

 

What do you mean?

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51 minutes ago, DabigRG said:

Sonia and Manik were just a cute shoutout to Underground(or a wordplay on Sonic Mania).

Yeah, I got it was a reference for Underground. (The Second case is a bit unlike as this comic is (at least) from 2013 (When released in my country) and Sonic Mania wasn't even in the concept at the time.

53 minutes ago, DabigRG said:

What do you mean?

If we look deep in Robotnik's characteristics in the Classic Era (Note: Here referencing Robotinik as Classic Eggman (1991-1998) and Eggman as Modern Eggman (1998-onwards).) we have a very intelligent evil scientist (Which had even the power to launch a space base (Death Egg) and why not, won Sonic every time you finished a game in bad ending) but deep inside had a soul of a goofy. The main scene which comes in my mind thinking on it is this (Despite not actually ever released):

Since Adventure, Eggman won a characteristic of only being an evil greed scientist and loose completely his humor. Not going to say it was completely wrong as Classic Sonic can be seen as something more childish and Adventure as something more teenage, but I miss it sometimes, specially after '06 which is when I believe he lost all his charismatics.

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The series doesn't really follow canon anymore, so I'm not too bothered about it.

I do wish that the games integrated Knuckles' Chaotix into the canon more though. Heroes rebooting the Chaotix is closely tied to this. Aside from a few fannods, it's almost completely erased from the timeline. And while Chaotix isn't a good game, I still think it's as worthy as representation as Sonic CD.

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1 minute ago, Splash the Otter said:

Eggman being a human, certain character design elements, Big and Rouge in general

If you don't mind can you explain these three in particular?

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1 minute ago, Solister said:

Yeah, I got it was a reference for Underground. (The Second case is a bit unlike as this comic is (at least) from 2013 (When released in my country) and Sonic Mania wasn't even in the concept at the time.

If we look deep in Robotnik's characteristics in the Classic Era (Note: Here referencing Robotinik as Classic Eggman (1991-1998) and Eggman as Modern Eggman (1998-onwards).) we have a very intelligent evil scientist (Which had even the power to launch a space base (Death Egg) and why not, won Sonic every time you finished a game in bad ending) but deep inside had a soul of a goofy. The main scene which comes in my mind thinking on it is this (Despite not actually ever released):

Since Adventure, Eggman won a characteristic of only being an evil greed scientist and loose completely his humor. Not going to say it was completely wrong as Classic Sonic can be seen as something more childish and Adventure as something more teenage, but I miss it sometimes, specially after '06 which is when I believe he lost all his charismatics.

Where have you been the past eleven years?

ThoseObedientAlbertosaurus-max-1mb.gifSonic%2BColors%2B-%2B05.jpgtumblr_pu6p8oQ1vr1u7nw9jo4_r1_500.gifsource.gif

latest?cb=20180612175221tenor.giftenor.gif

 

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