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The only way you can get away with it imo is going by how Tyson Heese portrays these characters; exaggerated actions and expressions to convey their characters.And even then, an entire game like that probably wouldn't fly. I'd say do what I just said, but keep the dialogue to an absolute minimum. Less exposition the better, just keep it limited to some banter and that's it. 

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38 minutes ago, Kuzu said:

The only way you can get away with it imo is going by how Tyson Heese portrays these characters; exaggerated actions and expressions to convey their characters.And even then, an entire game like that probably wouldn't fly. I'd say do what I just said, but keep the dialogue to an absolute minimum. Less exposition the better, just keep it limited to some banter and that's it. 

What about how BOTW handled it? There is dialogue, there are VAs. But mostly dialog boxes and expressions. It actually complimented that game fairly well because that game had less of a story that past zelda games and was much more about pure exploration gameplay. 

Just a suggestion, not saying I think it should go this way. I really don't know tbh. 

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I'd like to say I predict another Sonic Mania after its success but I don't see it happening unfortunately. From what I gather, the Mania developers seem to have moved on. I might be wrong though

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Honestly the fact that Sega did not immediately green light a sequel to Sonic Mania is what I find the most odd. My most wildest prediction what I hope will never happen is they reboot the entire franchise based off the Sonic Movie (Using the movie design and ben schwartz voicing Sonic) or just a dramatic change in general. Most people tend not to like a lot of things from the 2010's Sonic games so it might be the right time.  

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5 hours ago, Roger_van_der_weide said:

"Speaking to Famitsu magazine Sonic Series Producer Takashi Iizuka stated that SEGA had effectively done "everything" it could with Sonic Mania."

"What do the fans expect us to do at this point, just make up new levels out of thin air? We've already used up all the damn levels!"

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4 hours ago, Whatever the WhoCares said:

Or are they talking about the game rather than the concept?

I think they're talking about the game itself. The interview is all about going from a downloadable title to retail packaged title as the Mania Plus expansion. In that sense, they have done everything they can do with Sonic Mania.

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At the moment, right out of the gate, I'd need to be impressed by a teaser that instilled some hope into me that we didn't wait 4+ years for another, almost shamelessly asset flipped, "the-game-plays-itself", two to three hour experience. 

Asking for what I really want, which is something that showcased the in-game cutscenes and character model animations as something out of one of those Tyson Hesse cartoons, seems extraordinarily far-fetched right now despite the day-dreams I keep having about it. You look at Wreck-It Ralph, the Sonic Movie, and even the notoriously bad Rise of Lyric and you can't help but wonder why Forces looks as terrible as it does. That war scene was embarrassing. Avengers: Endgame it was not.

I mean, for god's sake Rise of Lyric did it. Rise of Lyric did it. 

There's a part of me that's also bracing myself to be excited for the first 30 seconds of the new trailer and then seeing something that smacks me over the head with a metal chair back down to reality like the Forces trailer did.

Back then, I had just seen the Mania trailer for the 2D fans and then it was my turn. Sonic's there, serious stuff is happening, he's going in for the save on the burning city, everything's good, and then seconds before the trailer is done, it says Sonic needs the help of a friend and I foolishly, FOOLISHLY thought they were talking about the infamous sidekick character from the popular Sonic the Hedgehog series, Miles Tails Prower. Stupid me. How dare I assume Sonic's gonna get to work with his best friend, adopted brother, and third most recognizable character in the Sonic series behind Sonic and Eggman respectively. Fuck that noise, we need another Sonic up in this bitch.

I promised myself when I started typing this that I wasn't going to go down the bitter angry fanboy route but it just slipped out of me. I apologize everyone. 

Uh. Anyway, I'd like a nicely animated, actual 3D Sonic game that told a coherent story that cared about what was going on. I don't care if it's boost or adventure despite preferring adventure. I really do just want them to make a damn Sonic game and not worry about what string to attach. If they wish to nostalgia pander, that's fine, but do it with something that's actually nostalgic. It's literally impossible for Green Hill and Chemical Plant to be nostalgic now. Seeing Tails' house in the Mystic Ruins, Station Square, or fucking Hang Castle would grant more reverence and surprise at this point. 

Also, I'd like a new Sonic anime... but a regular old action cartoon will do fine. If it's an anime, the opening might not suck balls this time though. Just sayin.

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On 5/8/2020 at 10:23 PM, Spooky Mulder said:

I think they're talking about the game itself. The interview is all about going from a downloadable title to retail packaged title as the Mania Plus expansion. In that sense, they have done everything they can do with Sonic Mania.

This is why you ignore all mindless "iizuka bad" seething. 

 

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I mean, if you want to knock Iizuka/ST's thought process for in regards to lack of ideas, his comments about Mighty and Ray intended to be "sealed characters" that would never be used again (in the same Famitsu interview, I think?) is a stronger point to rebut.

I wouldn't be shocked if neither he or Sonic Team were interested in making more Genesis Sonic games though.

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On 5/8/2020 at 12:43 PM, Roger_van_der_weide said:

I think Iizuka mentioned in an interview he has no idea what to do with a Mania 2.
Wait, let me check...
"Speaking to Famitsu magazine Sonic Series Producer Takashi Iizuka stated that SEGA had effectively done "everything" it could with Sonic Mania."

There's the exact words. So he ran out of ideas with Mania.
Which baffles me. Just let the Mania development team worry about the specific content of a Mania 2, I bet they have tons of level ideas.


Now, this is totally my speculation, but he comes across to me as someone who can only look at Mania as a Sonic Generations 2 kind of deal, the whole idea that you could make another Classic style game that's entirely new experience seems alien to them.
At least that's how his "we've done everything we could do" comes across. "Hey, we did Green hill and chemcial plant zone, What else is there?"

At the very least this fuels my suspicion that the concept of "Just make a damn Sonic game" is not a possible option in their mind.
There always has to be some kind of grand gimicky crazy angle and theme to each game that's the true focus and identity of each game, with the Sonic gameplay just awkwardly plastered on as an afterthought.
Hence why only when their wacky sceme of the week just HAPPENS to involve something Sonic esque, like Boost or Nostalgia, we get something resembling a proper Sonic game, but whenever their zany sceme of the week is something weird and alien, the entire game is going to be another Frankenstein monster of conflicting bodyparts.


But that's just my interpretation.
If anything, I really wish someone interviewed him more indepth about his thoughts on Mania. I'd love to see his opinion on why Sonic 4 got lukewarm reception where Mania exploded. I have severe doubts he understands what Mania is other then nostalgia parade #72.

I kinda get where he's coming from. 

The Sonic franchise is basically stagnant. It hasn't moved forward in any meaningful way since....Sonic Colours really. Everything since then has been tinged with an excess of nostalgia, and sorely lacking in any substance.

The only game to not do this was Mania, but that game is still ultimately playing on Nostalgia, even though it has the technical and creative substance behind it. It at the very least attempts to take what Sonic 3 and Knuckles built and expand on it in some way. New levels, new mechanics, and a return of long lost characters with new play styles. 

But even with all that its cashing in on "the classics were great" mentality - perhaps reminding all those dumb bandwagony fucks that yes, Sonic was indeed good back on the Genesis/MegaDrive. 

The actual 3D 'main series' games have gone backwards since Generations. Lost World was a cute little attempt at trying something different, but it seemed a half-baked attempt that was criticised just enough to put the fear into SEGA to go back to Generations' playstyle - except in Forces it was worse in every meaningful capacity.

If I were Iizuka I would be pretty jaded about the whole situation. 

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On 5/8/2020 at 11:23 PM, Spooky Mulder said:

I think they're talking about the game itself. The interview is all about going from a downloadable title to retail packaged title as the Mania Plus expansion. In that sense, they have done everything they can do with Sonic Mania.

You would be surprised at what lengths idiots will go to take words out of context, just to crap on Iizuka and company in these parts.

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I don't think anyone here has done this tho', as you don't even need to take stuff out of context to crap on Iizuka's incompetencies and lack of direcion with the Sonic franchise, which few good decisions are arguibly stuff anyone on their right mind would do in his place, while his bad decisions are usually stuff he insists in pushing down people's throats, despite major feedbacks from the fanbase telling him otherwise ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

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1 hour ago, Nina Cortex Jovahexeon said:

Oh you've had quite the history in the past of doing that.

Almost everything having to do with Sonic Mania coming to mind, especially with you trying to downplay the fact that he allowed and helped that game to be good.

Like other folks have said to you in the past, you reeeeally should learn how to talk to people before quoting them, mate. You're basically admitting you came here to take a random jab at people by calling them idiots, at the fact that "someone" did that to Iizuka before. It just kills your point. Maybe next time you should also consider mentioning the people you're referring to instead of being a coward if you're meant to directly attack someone in the end.

On the subject at hand, Iizuka did nothing to Mania anyone on his position wouldn't. In fact, he could've done more for it, instead of the just the very basic. He did not made Sonic Mania good. Taxman and the rest of the team did.

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1 hour ago, Jango said:

On the subject at hand, Iizuka did nothing to Mania anyone on his position wouldn't.

So, why try and minimize his efforts? It doesn't really do your arguments any favors if you're going to try and accuse him of strictly just bad decisions.

As has been stated before hand, Iizuka didn't even really have much say regarding Sonic Forces even which has been acknowledged as the lesser game.

1 hour ago, Jango said:

In fact, he could've done more for it, instead of the just the very basic.

I mean, helping strengthen the game into the bigger experience it was, and even contributing some of the ideas like having the Death Egg bot as the boss of Green Hill Act 2, isn't as "basic" as you imply it to be. It's fine if you don't like the guy, but don't conveniently forget details.

Again, as much as some forget, Iizuka's position at the moment does not wield the power over the Sonic franchise that ill-informed parties believe him to have.

The man's contributed more good than bad. And he really doesn't always have a choice with a lot of the more corporate and controlling bits with the Sonic franchise. And he certainly did what more cynical people in his position wouldn't have done with more of his good decisions, green-lighting Sonic Mania as it is, chief along them.

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I think a lot of people should do some reading on Iizuka's actual contributions to this franchise. He's not had a perfect run by any means, but he deserves appreciation for helping to keep Sonic alive and fulfilling the desires of fans during SEGA years of turmoil. At worst, you can probably knock him for corporate speak at times, especially when directly pressed for answers by fans. But I think that's pretty standard. At times I used to knock him in the past but Ive learned to appreciate him a lot more because he has been one of the few consistent voices among the higher ups that actually does care about what happens to Sonic. 

 

 

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2 hours ago, UpCDownCLeftCRightC said:

he has been one of the few consistent voices among the higher ups that actually does care about what happens to Sonic. 

I feel like, because he is the head of SONIC Team, he's either has all the sayings, or none of it, which, one way or another, resulted in misdirections over the past years. Besides Sonic Mania, we didn't had a great Sonic game since Generations, as far as I remember. They're either sub-par or half-assed. Many people take it because we love this blue bastard at the end (althought I only have bought Sonic Mania and Mania Plus in the past 9 years, but that's me). Consistency, both in quality and speech, is far from this franchise. Iizuka is juggling with Sonic at best. I won't deny the man does try, but damn he needs to make up his mind and listen to feedback beyond a surface level. I can't imagine which kind of crazy gameplay they're cooking next. More wisps? More boost and automation? Or are they're gonna bring parkour back? Who knows... 

As for Mania... I mean. He had literally the easiest job. He could've just give his blessing to Christian and go take a vacation, it's not like he's just a random dude taking the reins of Sonic. He and Simon had already worked on 3 very successful Sonic ports at that point, which proved their deep knowledge of the classic formula and how to wisely add new stuff to old games. Heck, they got the thumbs up from Yuji Naka himself for their vision of Sonic 2's Hidden Palace Zone. "-OK, but maybe it's not that simple, there's many logistics involved, also, it's SEGA's flagship IP, you'd expect them acting protective". I mean, after Sonic Boom and what Big Red Button did? Nah, man. No way. 

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20 minutes ago, Jango said:

feel like, because he is the head of SONIC Team, he's either has all the sayings, or none of it,

That's the mistake a lot of people make in thinking what Iizuka is actually responsible for.

He's more so in charge of stuff going on with the American division than the main Japanese division. Circling back to how he really didn't have anything to do with Forces and its development. 

And considering how SEGA of Japan tends to treat its American counterpart, it's no surprise the American side hasn't gotten as many chances to shine.

A lot of the less savory choices have been made by SEGA higher ups.

Iizuka just tends to get blamed because more often than not, he has to play mouthpiece for a lot of Sonic project stuff.

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9 hours ago, Nina Cortex Jovahexeon said:

He's more so in charge of stuff going on with the American division than the main Japanese division. Circling back to how he really didn't have anything to do with Forces and its development. 

And considering how SEGA of Japan tends to treat its American counterpart, it's no surprise the American side hasn't gotten as many chances to shine.

A lot of the less savory choices have been made by SEGA higher ups.

Iizuka just tends to get blamed because more often than not, he has to play mouthpiece for a lot of Sonic project stuff.

So let me get this straight Iizuka can be praised for green lighting on Sonic Mania but when the mainline games are coming out to a mediocre release, all of a sudden he can't be blamed because he has more control over the spin offs than he does over the mainline games?

Lets say the next Sonic Team games comes out and it's really good do we praise Iizuka or SEGA of Japan?

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