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3 hours ago, StaticMania said:

You mean that one line in the scene that has unfortunate connotations that most people took from it?

Yeah, though it's not (necessarily) the writers' fault people will read things in the most uncharitable or literal way possible sometimes. Whenever people bring up that line as a point of contention it feels like they've never heard of hyperbole before.

 

I don't really have an opinion on "new Amy" because I feel the difference is a bit exaggerated. I try to stay out of the arguments about it but for years now I've been baffled by the complaints that she "doesn't have a crush on Sonic anymore," because that's simply not true?

Forces was kind of weird in that the characters often didn't really seem to have their usual personality most of the time (just compare to Generations for example), but it did still come up. It comes up in IDW too for that matter, in particular when it's relevant. Everyone's...um...a bit busy right now if we're focusing on the current arc in particular, so I think we can forgive not dedicating a panel or two to her robotically turning to the audience and reminding us of the number one thing everybody already knows about her.

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15 minutes ago, Kuzu said:

I figured this out years ago and it still bugs the fuck out of me how similar they are. 

Oh, it's something you can acknowledge the overlap in pretty quick, but your eye still widens a bit when you actually pay it any attention. 

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9 minutes ago, Celestia said:

Yeah, though it's not (necessarily) the writers' fault people will read things in the most uncharitable or literal way possible sometimes. Whenever people bring up that line as a point of contention it feels like they've never heard of hyperbole before.

 

I don't really have an opinion on "new Amy" because I feel the difference is a bit exaggerated. I try to stay out of the arguments about it but for years now I've been baffled by the complaints that she "doesn't have a crush on Sonic anymore," because that's simply not true?

Forces was kind of weird in that the characters often didn't really seem to have their usual personality most of the time (just compare to Generations for example), but it did still come up. It comes up in IDW too for that matter, in particular when it's relevant. Everyone's...um...a bit busy right now if we're focusing on the current arc in particular, so I think we can forgive not dedicating a panel or two to her robotically turning to the audience and reminding us of the number one thing everybody already knows about her.

I think Sonic Boom kind of reinforced that perception tbh, where her crush is severely downplayed. And then in Lost World they try to make drama out of her "confessing". It's weird how they've been treating those traits, so I can understand how fans feel like she lost traits that she once had when they're not really the focus of the character anymore.

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11 minutes ago, Celestia said:

so I think we can forgive not dedicating a panel or two to her robotically turning to the audience and reminding us of the number one thing everybody already knows about her.

How often do they expect it to come up really?

I said this a little while ago that...generally her crush only ever comes up like once or twice at most, almost always her introduction.

The exceptions - at the time when people say she was at her worst - being Battle, Rush, and Sonic Nex Gen.

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3 minutes ago, Kuzu said:

I think Sonic Boom kind of reinforced that perception tbh, where her crush is severely downplayed. And then in Lost World they try to make drama out of her "confessing". It's weird how they've been treating those traits.

I didn't understand the complaints about that either! Undoubtedly it's possible the current English writers didn't know she's already made her feelings very clear (I doubt that considering they wrote for Gens lol) but I didn't read it that way at all. Like I think it makes sense for her to say it as possibly the last things she'll get to say to him.

But yeah, Boom is probably the main thing. It's like how I (mostly) disagree with complaints about Knuckles but Boom Knuckles does literally embody all of it, up to eleven.

...I try to forget Boom happened.

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I'm just looking at the profiles for Amy and Boom Amy on Sonic News Network, and some stuff does stand out.

They note that Amy was originally meant to be more tomboyish, but seemed to lose that trait as time went on. "Temperamental, bossy, overbearing, and stubborn" are traits used to describe her around the Sonic Adventure era, as well as optimistic, hopeful, and cheerful. Sonic Free Riders marked a turn towards being even bossier and more infatuated with Sonic, while "starting from Sonic Lost World, Amy appears to have matured. Although Amy maintains her crush on Sonic, she has learned more self-control over her demeanor towards him, and is now more caring and level-headed."

With Boom Amy, she's supposed to be a natural leader and organizer (something that's carried over to IDW), but is also a perfectionist. "She is overall sweethearted and has ballerina-like gracefulness, but also a capable and tough cookie," and one trait I rather liked that didn't seem to be explored nearly enough is her expertise in archaeology. In a world like Sonic's, Boom or otherwise, I think that's a pretty cool trait to have.

I've seen people here say she's "no fun," but "sensible" is the word used here, and seems right, especially when you remember some of the stuff the others got up to (Sonic and Knuckles' wheelbarrow run comes to mind). Peppiness and optimism seem to carry over from her original counterpart

There's other stuff, but on the whole, it just feels like there's more to Boom Amy than Game Amy. Of course, unless we were to count Sonic X as Game Amy, we spend so little time with her by comparison that it's no wonder that she doesn't seem as well-rounded as the character who was a part of 112 different stories in around a two-year period or so. Ditto with the comic version.

But then, when you see how they've changed other characters and made them less likeable at times in the games (looking at you, Shadow and Knuckles), it's little wonder I favor other versions more than the "main" one.

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3 hours ago, DabigRG said:

...Is that you, Skeletomaton?

I honestly have no clue who you're talking about 😆 It is curious to me though that my rant reminded you of someone else.

52 minutes ago, Kuzu said:

Firstly, I want to thank you for clarifying what you meant and not getting even more angry and making this topic awkward. But onto actually addressing your points.

It's interesting that you see Amy as an "antagonist" with the way that you described her,  but I'm not sure I necessarily agree with it. In the most basic literary sense, an antagonist is a character that opposes the protagonist in some way, someone for him to overcome. That's not really how I would describe Amy. She never opposes Sonic, intentionally or otherwise. Her role is more akin to that of a standard Damsel In Distress to force Sonic to act. If we look at Sonic & Amy as the antithesis to Mario & Peach; Mario rescues Peach from Bowser in a classic "hero saves damsel from a reptilian creature"; the audience cares because they wish to see the damsel safe and for the hero to earn her affection, which we see when Peach usually rewards Mario with a kiss or cake after the game is over. Sonic & Amy on the other hand are...different. As her creators have said, Sonic is not interested in Amy or getting any type of reward for saving  her. Sonic saves Amy because he's heroic at the end of the day, but more often than not, Sonic is more concerned with stopping whatever Eggman is plotting while rescuing Amy feels kind of secondary. It's notable that in Sonic CD,  Amy herself only appears twice, while the game puts all of its attention on Metal Sonic as an antagonist for Sonic to overcome (hence all of those projectors that you see) and as a result, Amy feels like an afterthought; the player's focus isn't on rescuing her, but defeating Metal Sonic. So from the get-go, Amy already feels like an afterthought which isn't exactly a good first impression for a character that's going to continue recurring for years to come. And Amy would kind of reprise those roles in the Adventure games, being a damsel that forces Sonic to act. This isn't to say that she doesn't do anything else, but that's her main contributions to the main plot. The game is aware of it too because in both games, she expresses annoyance at how she's always rescued and that she never gets to do anything. You yourself described her as a hindrance and an obstacle to Sonic, but the thing is, that's not an endearing character trait...at least to the series' primary demographic of young boys. A character that's a hindrance and that the main character is actively annoyed at encountering can only be described as "The Load"

And note, this is not say that Amy is a bad character because she's a liability. She arguably still maintained audience sympathy by virtue of being a lovable and positive character that tried her best despite not quite being on the boys' level. But then her character became much more aggressive and obnoxious through stuff like Sonic X, and that audience sympathy was slowly evaporating. So now she's a liability and an unpleasant character, those aren't exactly the traits you want in a character that's supposed to be one of the good guys. To give a comparison, it's similar to the reception that Sakura Haruno of Naruto fame gets (the two characters bear an uncanny resemblance at that...), an obnoxious and violent character who's only contribution is standing on the sidelines while the boys handle the real work. It's to the point where Sakura is a meme for how badly the story treats her and how unpopular she is within the fandom. Thankfully Amy never got to that point because she was sidelined after a while, but still. But yea, that's why Amy tends to get a frosty reception; it's not that her character is bad or uninteresting, but her role just simply doesn't allow her many moments to shine, especially if you claim that she's meant to be a hindrance and a liability, you can't really expect a character like that to be that popular with the audience unless her personality was lovable enough to counteract it and even then, it would be ideal for her to actually have meaningful contributions that actually help Sonic. (like the 06 example). This is why Tails has endured, because even if he's not as capable as Sonic, he can help out in his own way that benefits him and his personality is likable. 

But I'm not done yet, because now I'm going to address Knuckles and why fandom generally gives him more narrative importance. 

----

Unlike Amy, Knuckles was an antagonist in his debut; there's no way around that, his first appearance has him stripping you of the power that you earned from Sonic 2 and then laughing at your misfortune and then spends the entire game screwing with Sonic (aka you, the player) and hindering his progress through the game. Similar to what I described with Metal Sonic, this gives Sonic and the player an extra incentive to want to beat Knuckles. So when Knuckles is betrayed by Eggman, and he leaves the sanctity of his island to Sonic, you kind of feel sorry for him, because while he was a jerk, he was just used by Eggman. And after the main conflict was over, Knuckles goes through his own scenario of keeping his island safe, and this time he does it without Sonic's help and succeeds, which establishes that he's just as capable as Sonic and serves to redeem him in the eyes of the player. That's why Knuckles enjoys so much reverence in the fanbase, even if it's mostly nostalgia; because he's the first truly dynamic character the series had going from an antagonist, to an ally, and finally becoming a hero in his own right all in his debut game. Comparing Amy and Knuckles, the latter just leaves a lasting impression on you.

Unfortunately, as you said, Knuckles doesn't enjoy that level of reverence in subsequent appearances and I feel it's mostly a combination of Sega trying to satisfy the fans of the character that want him to appear more, and not really making the effort to integrate his personality and role properly in Sonic's adventures. But the narrative role that Knuckles gets revered for so much despite his constant mishandlings is that he serves as a foil to our protagonist; foils serve the main narrative purpose of contrasting and highlighting traits that our protagonist doesn't have. You see stuff like Knuckles' strength being compared to Sonic's speed, or how Knuckles is described as a stationary mountain to Sonic's free-roaming spirit, and they have the classic Red & Blue dichotomy. Unlike Tails and Amy, who have more ancillary (but no less important!!) roles in Sonic's adventures as a sidekick and a damsel, Knuckles is capable all on his own (as his theme song so proudly describes...) and can stand on equal footing with Sonic as an ally, being the closest thing to "The Lancer". The contrasts between him and Sonic is what drives intrigue about him from fans, and that's generally what writers like Ian Flynn focus on when he's used. That's not to say he's all important and needs to appear all of the time and it doesn't necessarily make his character more important than Amy's, I'm just explaining why the fandom in general tends to put him on a pedestal regardless if he actually deserves it or not. Fandoms are weird.

 

Personally speaking, both Amy and Knuckles can serve different narrative roles and neither are particularly more important than the other; it all depends on how they're written and integrated. Both characters have been on the backburner lately though, so it's kind of hard to say what their narrative roles are when everything has been revolving around Sonic & Tails lately. 

Amy's reputation at that point wasn't exactly good at that point in time, so I'm not shocked people took it the wrong way. 

See, I find it interesting when you describe antagonist as a malicious force when an antagonist doesn't have to be. For example, depending on the story a broken bridge could be the antagonist. That said, the Load trope actually describes Amy really well and explains where a lot of the hate for her character comes from. It makes me again say that if Tails is Robin than she needed to become Batgirl, and considering her character is supposed to be someone who follows Sonic ceaselessly a bit of competence would not have hurt her more early on. Without doing that though as you said, you have the damsel problem which is not particularly amusing after the nth time. If one considers her from a comedy angle though her antics and getting into trouble or making situations worse though could have been used to make her sympathetic. But even then, without being a "companion" from the Hero's Journey approach to story telling she will be an antagonist. A well meaning one who whose earnest efforts and playful optimism despite her failures should make her sympathetic. It's why her being a bubbly character full of endless energy, optimism, and good cheer is so important to making her work. Even though her actions can create trouble for Sonic, her personality and earnest efforts should make you cheer for her instead. So yeah, she's the Load, but that doesn't have to be a problem, and it still gives her more narrative importance than she is given credit for.

Onto Knuckles, it's really sad that I can never read why Knuckles is liked without shaking my head because more often than not if he performs the role he is supposed to he wouldn't even interact with Sonic at all. That doesn't particularly surprise me though since Knuckles fan, like Shadow fans, complain when his character is wasted. But that's what happens when a character isn't designed to be a companion. It also doesn't help that that the rivalry side is one of the shallowest rivalries that you can find. What exactly is Knuckles rivaling Sonic at anyway? Sonic is a hero either for his own amusement or because his personal sense of justice has been triggered. So there is nothing to support a rivalry there. Knuckles can brag all he wants about being the better hero while ignoring the duty that makes him the better hero, but Sonic isn't going to care because that isn't something he feels competitive about. The only thing that Sonic is known to feel competitive about is his speed and that's because that is where his pride lies. Everything else is business or pleasure, but his speed is his pride and being challenged there is where rivalries can take root. Knuckles doesn't put Sonic's speed in question, and because of that the rivalry they have is completely one-sided which isn't a good look for Knuckles to me. So sure he's a foil to Sonic when he has reason to be there, but when does he have a reason to be there outside of spinoffs? Most times he doesn't, and so no matter what he brings, what he brings also is a disservice to his character. But that is a character design flaw and one rooted in him not being written to be someone who follows Sonic. I've defended Knuckles in the past and have suggested any number of ways to address that problem of his that doesn't disservice his character, but more often than not I'm ignored because him appearing more often than overrides why until he is completely wasted in the story. It's an ugly cycle and Knuckles doesn't deserve it. Really he needs his own spin off games and should only really interact with Sonic in spinoffs. Honestly though I feel that way about a lot of characters in the franchise.

But I guess steering back on topic, I agree that Amy is a Load type character, but she is also a well meaning antagonist. Her bubbly personality and endless energy combined with her good cheer should make her efforts sympathetic, with her spouts of bratiness justifying when she does fail. She should reward the audience regardless of her failures though because her effort combined with her good cheer fueled by her bottomless energy and optimism should make her endearing and fun to watch. It's why she serves as comic relief as well, because when she appears you are supposed to know that at least for a bit you get to focus on fun silliness and remember to have a good time. But as the series has wanted to turn Sonic into a standup comedian and his audience values only results and never effort, no less doesn't find an earnest and cheerful personality endearing, Amy has been stripped of her foundation and is now completely interchangeable. There is nothing of her left in most cases except for vague references to who she once was trying to be tied together by anything but her foundation. That everyone equates her crush with the core of her character is a gross misreading of her, but considering how great the storytelling in this franchise is that's only to be expected. It's just a shame to me though that most people I see absolutely ignore that her foundation is that of endless energy and optimism. Because they don't see they completely misread her character, both officially and among the consumer base. And she's so much fun too when she's done right.

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9 minutes ago, Sonic Fan J said:

I honestly have no clue who you're talking about 😆 It is curious to me though that my rant reminded you of someone else.

See, I find it interesting when you describe antagonist as a malicious force when an antagonist doesn't have to be. For example, depending on the story a broken bridge could be the antagonist. That said, the Load trope actually describes Amy really well and explains where a lot of the hate for her character comes from. It makes me again say that if Tails is Robin than she needed to become Batgirl, and considering her character is supposed to be someone who follows Sonic ceaselessly a bit of competence would not have hurt her more early on. Without doing that though as you said, you have the damsel problem which is not particularly amusing after the nth time. If one considers her from a comedy angle though her antics and getting into trouble or making situations worse though could have been used to make her sympathetic. But even then, without being a "companion" from the Hero's Journey approach to story telling she will be an antagonist. A well meaning one who whose earnest efforts and playful optimism despite her failures should make her sympathetic. It's why her being a bubbly character full of endless energy, optimism, and good cheer is so important to making her work. Even though her actions can create trouble for Sonic, her personality and earnest efforts should make you cheer for her instead. So yeah, she's the Load, but that doesn't have to be a problem, and it still gives her more narrative importance than she is given credit for.

Onto Knuckles, it's really sad that I can never read why Knuckles is liked without shaking my head because more often than not if he performs the role he is supposed to he wouldn't even interact with Sonic at all. That doesn't particularly surprise me though since Knuckles fan, like Shadow fans, complain when his character is wasted. But that's what happens when a character isn't designed to be a companion. It also doesn't help that that the rivalry side is one of the shallowest rivalries that you can find. What exactly is Knuckles rivaling Sonic at anyway? Sonic is a hero either for his own amusement or because his personal sense of justice has been triggered. So there is nothing to support a rivalry there. Knuckles can brag all he wants about being the better hero while ignoring the duty that makes him the better hero, but Sonic isn't going to care because that isn't something he feels competitive about. The only thing that Sonic is known to feel competitive about is his speed and that's because that is where his pride lies. Everything else is business or pleasure, but his speed is his pride and being challenged there is where rivalries can take root. Knuckles doesn't put Sonic's speed in question, and because of that the rivalry they have is completely one-sided which isn't a good look for Knuckles to me. So sure he's a foil to Sonic when he has reason to be there, but when does he have a reason to be there outside of spinoffs? Most times he doesn't, and so no matter what he brings, what he brings also is a disservice to his character. But that is a character design flaw and one rooted in him not being written to be someone who follows Sonic. I've defended Knuckles in the past and have suggested any number of ways to address that problem of his that doesn't disservice his character, but more often than not I'm ignored because him appearing more often than overrides why until he is completely wasted in the story. It's an ugly cycle and Knuckles doesn't deserve it. Really he needs his own spin off games and should only really interact with Sonic in spinoffs. Honestly though I feel that way about a lot of characters in the franchise.

But I guess steering back on topic, I agree that Amy is a Load type character, but she is also a well meaning antagonist. Her bubbly personality and endless energy combined with her good cheer should make her efforts sympathetic, with her spouts of bratiness justifying when she does fail. She should reward the audience regardless of her failures though because her effort combined with her good cheer fueled by her bottomless energy and optimism should make her endearing and fun to watch. It's why she serves as comic relief as well, because when she appears you are supposed to know that at least for a bit you get to focus on fun silliness and remember to have a good time. But as the series has wanted to turn Sonic into a standup comedian and his audience values only results and never effort, no less doesn't find an earnest and cheerful personality endearing, Amy has been stripped of her foundation and is now completely interchangeable. There is nothing of her left in most cases except for vague references to who she once was trying to be tied together by anything but her foundation. That everyone equates her crush with the core of her character is a gross misreading of her, but considering how great the storytelling in this franchise is that's only to be expected. It's just a shame to me though that most people I see absolutely ignore that her foundation is that of endless energy and optimism. Because they don't see they completely misread her character, both officially and among the consumer base. And she's so much fun too when she's done right.

Yes, it's kind of the tragic part of the character; the parts that made her work before are the parts that the audience didn't like, and were subsequently downplayed. And given the positive reception to her current portrayals, that doesn't seem to be changing any time soon. So I get your frustration, it's a similar frustration with how they're using Shadow lately. It really just goes to show how mishandling and public perception influences how these characters are handled. 

That said, I think how she was in the second issue of IDW was a good start...that they didn't capitalize on, but it's something. Others have said that the current situation in IDW doesn't really warrant Amy's old persona, so...hang in there lol. 

 

But yea, Knuckles is kind of caught in an evil cycle; his fans want him around because they like playing as him, but that usually means they have to either center the game on his job or just ignore it outright, and that gets people complaining how he ignores his job. Like, Knuckles exists on two levels; as a playable character (gameplay) and as a foil to Sonic (narrative). So the hard part is kind of reconciling those two. Most people that want him playable don't care much for his narrative role, but people that care about his narrative role tend to be indifferent to him being playable or not. It's a weird thing. For what it's worth, they have severely downplayed his rivalry with Sonic almost to the point of non-existence. It gets referenced every now and then (Cuz nostaaaalgiaaaa), but it's never really mattered in a narrative. 

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2 minutes ago, Kuzu said:

Yes, it's kind of the tragic part of the character; the parts that made her work before are the parts that the audience didn't like, and were subsequently downplayed. And given the positive reception to her current portrayals, that doesn't seem to be changing any time soon. So I get your frustration, it's a similar frustration with how they're using Shadow lately. It really just goes to show how mishandling and public perception influences how these characters are handled. 

That said, I think how she was in the second issue of IDW was a good start...that they didn't capitalize on, but it's something. Others have said that the current situation in IDW doesn't really warrant Amy's old persona, so...hang in there lol. 

 

But yea, Knuckles is kind of caught in an evil cycle; his fans want him around because they like playing as him, but that usually means they have to either center the game on his job or just ignore it outright, and that gets people complaining how he ignores his job. Like, Knuckles exists on two levels; as a playable character (gameplay) and as a foil to Sonic (narrative). So the hard part is kind of reconciling those two. Most people that want him playable don't care much for his narrative role, but people that care about his narrative role tend to be indifferent to him being playable or not. It's a weird thing. For what it's worth, they have severely downplayed his rivalry with Sonic almost to the point of non-existence. It gets referenced every now and then (Cuz nostaaaalgiaaaa), but it's never really mattered in a narrative. 

IDW Issue 2 gave me hope to be honest, and since then it's just gone. Bu it got so much worse for me as it went on as the character with unlimited energy, optimism, and good cheer needed cheered up with out establishing that she is that type of character, or any type of character really before pulling the rug out from under her (to be fair pretty much everyone has suffered this in IDW due to the zombot arc). And Amy is actually the perfect character for selling the direness of the zombot arc if you are familiar with the genki girl character trope. Typically, when a genki girl isn't energetic it becomes obvious how bad the situation is. But the characters where never established and explored from enough angles before this arc hit. It's built like you're conflating Forces with Archie and coming off of that with no clear distinction of what version of the characters they are. Shadow and Amy have suffered extremely badly from this because Amy has had her foundation removed without replacing it and Shadow doesn't even make sense. Yet this new, foundationless Amy is considered better, over a crush. All actual merit of writing a good character is discarded over a crush. She doesn't have it and she smashes bots so she's magically good despite being completely broken otherwise. People say they want quality from this franchise, and then they accept that blindly due their biases.

Of course you describe it extremely well with Knuckles. His fans either care too much or not at all and then neither group is pleased because you get pointless unplayable Knuckles. This is why I said earlier that if that is preferential treatment I don't want to see what would happen if SEGA decided to actively make a character hated. The thought honestly horrifies me.

But I guess at this point i should just directly answer the thread topic. Which is no, I don't hate the new Amy because there is no character there to hate. There is only an actor with some vague traits to act out and no foundation to put those traits on. You can't hate that because it isn't anything. That it's being used to replace Amy, now that by now should be obvious in how much it gets under my skin. So at the least OP, you're not alone in disliking the shift in her character, but I might very well be alone in how I see Amy positively.

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5 hours ago, Sonictrainer said:

While we're on the subject of Amy, does anyone feel like she should get some new abilities or upgrades?

She obviously has some sort of magical power, but we only see a small glimpse of it (outside when she summons her Hammers).

Her tarot cards have been alluded to a few times. Sadly, the only magical ability away from this was at the end of the Archie comics run, where she used the Mystic Melody to get a long distance reading on the Master Emerald shards.

 

Away from magic, I seem to remember Amy being described by her Sonic Boom VA as "Bi-polar". I think it was more of a "putting up with Sonic's s*** constantly" thing.

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9 hours ago, KingScoopaKoopa said:

I'm just looking at the profiles for Amy and Boom Amy on Sonic News Network, and some stuff does stand out.

They note that Amy was originally meant to be more tomboyish, but seemed to lose that trait as time went on. "Temperamental, bossy, overbearing, and stubborn" are traits used to describe her around the Sonic Adventure era, as well as optimistic, hopeful, and cheerful. Sonic Free Riders marked a turn towards being even bossier and more infatuated with Sonic, while "starting from Sonic Lost World, Amy appears to have matured. Although Amy maintains her crush on Sonic, she has learned more self-control over her demeanor towards him, and is now more caring and level-headed."

With Boom Amy, she's supposed to be a natural leader and organizer (something that's carried over to IDW), but is also a perfectionist. "She is overall sweethearted and has ballerina-like gracefulness, but also a capable and tough cookie," and one trait I rather liked that didn't seem to be explored nearly enough is her expertise in archaeology. In a world like Sonic's, Boom or otherwise, I think that's a pretty cool trait to have.

I've seen people here say she's "no fun," but "sensible" is the word used here, and seems right, especially when you remember some of the stuff the others got up to (Sonic and Knuckles' wheelbarrow run comes to mind). Peppiness and optimism seem to carry over from her original counterpart

There's other stuff, but on the whole, it just feels like there's more to Boom Amy than Game Amy. Of course, unless we were to count Sonic X as Game Amy, we spend so little time with her by comparison that it's no wonder that she doesn't seem as well-rounded as the character who was a part of 112 different stories in around a two-year period or so. Ditto with the comic version.

But then, when you see how they've changed other characters and made them less likeable at times in the games (looking at you, Shadow and Knuckles), it's little wonder I favor other versions more than the "main" one.

Boom Amy worked in terms of being the actual 'heart' of the team and trying to placate personal conflicts and issues a lot of the time. There was often still a flawed way of doing this since they wanted to keep the dynamic even, she could still be very overbearing and self righteous, this is lampshaded and undermined a lot of times, but this Amy did have good intentions and tried to take the moral high ground. Even her temperament she TRIED to keep under control a lot of the time, even if in a characteristically desperate 'teeth bared' way. I think that's the key here, that this Amy was TRYING to look out for everyone, compared to the 2000s era Amy who was starting to became a catty and apathetic id towards anything that wasn't Sonic.

Early episodes Amy in particular felt like the fine balance, since she still had this exuberance and dizziness about her in a lot of what she did, while later Boom Amy started to have that genuine SatAm Sally disposition, curmudgeonly and no nonsense and shaking her head at everyone's else's silly behaviour (though she did still SOMETIMES join in on the fun and games, she's wasn't humourless). This wasn't a BAD personality, if anything it's ideally how I'd see Sally, but yeah, it is far more befitting of her than it is Amy, who is known for her childlike energy. I'm guessing since Tails and even Knuckles had a far more wide eyed and flawed disposition in the show, Amy ended up taking over the more cynical sane role more consistently.

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Honestly, Amy has always kinda sucked in terms of personality. Classic Amy had no personality, Adventure era Amy han an annoying personality, and modern Amy, once again, have no personality.

But then again, Metal Sonic has even less personality, and yet I think he's fucking awesome, so eh.

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To me the "new amy" is just a reigning in of the old one for the most part. She's one character I honestly wouldn't say is that different.

The scenarios being pointed out where she's being labelled as bland are unfair since a situation like Forces and IDW had her take on large responsibilities. Amy has always been good at organizing, redirecting and leading others, so she makes sense in this role even if it doesn't give her a lot of time to get googly eyed at Sonic. There's still plenty of instances of Amy being herself in IDW specifically, she's just not the center of attention. 

I kinda miss her hot temper and more self centered behavior but I was always under the impression that they toned that shit down because it annoyed people. Amy used to get endless amounts of shit so refocusing and highlighting the other stuff she's always been good at makes sense to me. 

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11 hours ago, KingScoopaKoopa said:

 

There's other stuff, but on the whole, it just feels like there's more to Boom Amy than Game Amy. Of course, unless we were to count Sonic X as Game Amy, we spend so little time with her by comparison that it's no wonder that she doesn't seem as well-rounded as the character who was a part of 112 different stories in around a two-year period or so. Ditto with the comic version.

But then, when you see how they've changed other characters and made them less likeable at times in the games (looking at you, Shadow and Knuckles), it's little wonder I favor other versions more than the "main" one.

Pretty much.

Boom!Amy was interesting because for how a lot of people tend to look at her, she was actually a balanced character overall. One that the writers clearly recognized as she got used in a significant capacity in a lot of episodes.

It also kinda plays on the idea that they essentially combined her with Sally and if you will, Relic.

11 hours ago, Sonic Fan J said:

I honestly have no clue who you're talking about 😆 It is curious to me though that my rant reminded you of someone else.

I forget their actual username, but there was a user a few years ago who was also a huge Amy fan that was fairly well-spoken, but seemed to have a chip on their shoulder for her lesser image. As such, they would occasionally go on tirades against characters they felt were responsible for taking away her potential limelight, including Knuckles and Cream. It was certainly a comprehensive perspective to have, but it happened just frequently and sometimes bitterly enough to be disconcerting. 

11 hours ago, Sonic Fan J said:

See, I find it interesting when you describe antagonist as a malicious force when an antagonist doesn't have to be. For example, depending on the story a broken bridge could be the antagonist. That said, the Load trope actually describes Amy really well and explains where a lot of the hate for her character comes from. It makes me again say that if Tails is Robin than she needed to become Batgirl, and considering her character is supposed to be someone who follows Sonic ceaselessly a bit of competence would not have hurt her more early on. Without doing that though as you said, you have the damsel problem which is not particularly amusing after the nth time. If one considers her from a comedy angle though her antics and getting into trouble or making situations worse though could have been used to make her sympathetic. But even then, without being a "companion" from the Hero's Journey approach to story telling she will be an antagonist. A well meaning one who whose earnest efforts and playful optimism despite her failures should make her sympathetic. It's why her being a bubbly character full of endless energy, optimism, and good cheer is so important to making her work. Even though her actions can create trouble for Sonic, her personality and earnest efforts should make you cheer for her instead. So yeah, she's the Load, but that doesn't have to be a problem, and it still gives her more narrative importance than she is given credit for.

This is true.

10 hours ago, Sonictrainer said:

While we're on the subject of Amy, does anyone feel like she should get some new abilities or upgrades?

She obviously has some sort of magical power, but we only see a small glimpse of it (outside when she summons her Hammers).

 

9 hours ago, thumbs13 said:

Only if they explain it and it's not just "Amy could totally go invisible the whole time guys trust us!"

Yeah, she has had a long history of pulling powers or even skills from under her dress and then mostly forgetting about them.

 

4 hours ago, HywelAtTheMoon said:

 

Away from magic, I seem to remember Amy being described by her Sonic Boom VA as "Bi-polar". I think it was more of a "putting up with Sonic's s*** constantly" thing.

I mean she basically was--she still had semblances of her positivity and her girliness was taken up a level, but she would try to force more productive good vibes on the other characters and even get snappy when questioned on certain things.

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1 minute ago, DabigRG said:

I forget their actual username, but there was a user a few years ago who was also a huge Amy fan that was fairly well-spoken, but seemed to have a chip on their shoulder for her lesser image. As such, they would occasionally go on tirades against characters they felt were responsible for taking away her potential limelight, including Knuckles and Cream. It was certainly a comprehensive perspective to have, but it happened just frequently and sometimes bitterly enough to be disconcerting.

I have an inkling that I know who you're talking about, but since I could be wrong, I'm not gonna say anything.😅

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2 hours ago, E-122-Psi said:

Early episodes Amy in particular felt like the fine balance, since she still had this exuberance and dizziness about her in a lot of what she did, while later Boom Amy started to have that genuine SatAm Sally disposition, curmudgeonly and no nonsense and shaking her head at everyone's else's silly behaviour (though she did still SOMETIMES join in on the fun and games, she's wasn't humourless). This wasn't a BAD personality, if anything it's ideally how I'd see Sally, but yeah, it is far more befitting of her than it is Amy, who is known for her childlike energy. I'm guessing since Tails and even Knuckles had a far more wide eyed and flawed disposition in the show, Amy ended up taking over the more cynical sane role more consistently.

Which is really what Sticks was about come to think of it, so Amy could just be a realist who was alternatively aggravating and aggravated. 

27 minutes ago, batson said:

Honestly, Amy has always kinda sucked in terms of personality. Classic Amy had no personality, Adventure era Amy han an annoying personality, and modern Amy, once again, have no personality.

But then again, Metal Sonic has even less personality, and yet I think he's fucking awesome, so eh.

Classic Amy was something of a cutesy crybaby in what little we got to see of her. Meanwhile, Metal's personality(or lackthereof) couldn't get in the way of his sleek novelty.

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Just now, DabigRG said:

Classic Amy was something of a cutesy crybaby in what little we got to see of her.

Yeah, I suppose I wasn't being perfectly fair towards Classic Amy. She had as much character as you could expect from a silent 2D sprite in 1993.

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I'm pretty much sure @DabigRG is actually talking about @Skull Leader who pretty much abandoned ship here when he felt he had no ground to discuss Amy in good faith here. But trust me, him and I are not the same. There are a lot if things him and I disagree on involving Amy's character, and if you want to see that difference highlighted dig up my thread on me disliking Amy's hammer. You'll find some of his posts there where he clearly disagrees with me. That and his art style is incomparable to mine.

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3 minutes ago, Sonic Fan J said:

I'm pretty much sure @DabigRG is actually talking about @Skull Leader who pretty much abandoned ship here when he felt he had no ground to discuss Amy in good faith here.

There we go! I knew it had something to do with bones since I at least remembered calling them Skeletor once.

Didn't realize that's why he left, though. I just thought they were doing other things and/or forgot how to log in here.

3 minutes ago, Sonic Fan J said:

But trust me, him and I are not the same. There are a lot if things him and I disagree on involving Amy's character, and if you want to see that difference highlighted dig up my thread on me disliking Amy's hammer. You'll find some of his posts there where he clearly disagrees with me. That and his art style is incomparable to mine.

Oh, I know, as I remember ya'll coexisting via your particular redesign of Classic Amy.

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10 minutes ago, Sonic Fan J said:

I'm pretty much sure @DabigRG is actually talking about @Skull Leader

Lol, that's exactly who I was thinking about. He and I used to argue about Amy's and Knuckles' respective roles back on the Sega Forums.

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