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Sonic the real Ultimate Life Form?


S0NIC-Keyblade 007

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Well for those who don't know, at the end of Sonic Adventure 2/Battle during the final boss fight with Super Sonic and Super Shadow, before you finish off the biolizard make sure you are playing as Super Sonic then wait until your time is at about I believe 3:55 and Shadow should say "Sonic, I think I've discovered what the Ultimate Life Form is, it might be you!" Or you could just watch

to see for yourself.

So, let's say Sonic is the real Ultimate Life Form, however, even though Shadow speculates that Sonic may be the real Ultimate Life Form in this boss fight, we should also keep in mind that Shadow was originally supposed to die at the end of this game. When Shadow returns to life in Sonic Heroes, he claims once again that he is the Ultimate Life Form and completely forgets about his speculation of Sonic, and then, some games after Heroes claim Shadow to be even stronger than Sonic. So if Shadow were to remain dead at the end of SA2/B and not return, do you think that Sonic would be considered the Ultimate Life Form? And by the way, I don't mean to offend any Shadow fans by my idea if he were to remain dead, I'm a Shadow fan myself, however this idea has been on my mind for quite some time now and I just wanted to see what other Sonic fans think of this idea.

Sonic's untouchable spirit makes him the real Ultimate Life Form in my eyes. However, if Sonic is the real Ultimate Life Form, then what does that make Shadow, the hedgehog who today claims to be the Ultimate Life Form but has forgotten the speculation he made quite some time ago of possibly, the real Ultimate Life Form?

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Well I think a question that is should be asked is, what is the Ultimate Lifeform anyways? Not from the game's perspective, as I have played SA2. But does that mean this "lifeform" is the fastest being? The smartest? The strongest? Do they live a long time? Are they invincible? Or all of the above?

So how is it really defined? I think then we can truly determine if Sonic is \ was the ULF (rhymes with Alf!), or if Shadow was in the first place.

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I think it's just an aggrandizing title, whether for himself or for someone else. It's like a wordier way of saying "You're the man, Sonic!"

But does that mean this "lifeform" is the fastest being?

Sonic and Shadow seem to be the consistently fastest characters in the franchise, but...

The smartest?

Eggman and Tails definitely beat them in intelligence. Furthermore, Gerald probably beats them both. (Eggman calls himself "The greatest scientific genius of the world", but refers his grandfather as "The greatest scientific mind in the history of the world", which seems an admission that Gerald was the superior genius.)

The strongest?

Plenty of stronger characters than Sonic, no explanation needed here. Knuckles, Storm, Vector, Big. These guys are all power-houses of strength.

Do they live a long time?

Shadow was designed to never naturally age, I think. But he can still die, so he's not "immortal" as some fans claim he is.

Are they invincible?

Every character in the franchise is capable of getting hurt, so no to this.

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In Darwinistic terms, "Ultimate Lifeform" is an oxymoron; if anything, it would ironically mean the worst lifeform. Each species has a niche in its ecosystem and an "Ultimate Lifeform" would make it fall completely out of balance.

But if we went by the basic definition implied by the games that the "Ultimate Lifeform" is the pinnacle of all biological research, then it's hard to say that Shadow is that anymore. I said in the deep Sonic game thread that what made the characters great in the first place was their unique abilities, and Shadow had that with Chaos Control. But now that it seems like the ability to use Chaos Control is now universal, the title of "Ultimate Lifeform" is just aesthetic.

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But now that it seems like the ability to use Chaos Control is now universal,
Just in regards to this, I feel the need to quickly drop a tidbit or two on this. You have to bear in mind that thus far, the only characters in the series that CAN use Chaos Control are either:

a: hedgehogs (all three main chars of Sonic '06)

b: capable of Super forms (same as above)

c: artificial (Shadow, Biolizard, Metal Sonic/Madness)

So while it ain't exactly unique to Shads anymore, there's something of a specific criteria about it that limits it to specific beings, otherwise the usage between the roster would easily be much larger by now. Even bearing that in mind, Shadow is the only one who is capable of performing it without external aids (namely Chaos Emeralds), and I'd say that's enough for him to keep it his special thing. Not to mention he still has an array of other Chaos-based moves that nobody else seems capable of yet.

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I say it's nothing more than a well-rounded compliment from Shadow, impressed with the power that Sonic can wield by harnessing the energy of the Chaos Emeralds. A confidence booster more likely.

Needless to say, Robotnik's dying speech in Shadow the Hedgehog around the 9 minute mark during your battle with Devil Doom exclaims that Shadow is indeed the Ultimate Lifeform, a song to the same tune in order bolster emotions and confidence (I mean after all, he is your last hope out there.)

8:56 Shadow, can you hear me? This might be the last chance I have to speak to you so… What I said about having created you… It was all a lie… Everyone thought you died… During that horrible incident… But I rescued you… with one of my robots. You lost your memory that’s all. You really ARE the Ultimate Lifeform my grandfather created!

But what is really the ultimate lifeform? It can be anything. A body that harnesses the cure for a disease, a vast intelligent being, perhaps more down to earth with wide power and speed. A combination of these elements is a likely candidate, but may not suffice. After all the ultimate lifeform might be the noblest and gentle of creatures with a power unmatched in another unnamed category. So would Gerald be considered an ultimate lifeform? He created a way to save countless lives (Heal Unit), harnessed power with utilizing a clean energy force (Chaos Drive), created a lifeform of immense speed and power (Shadow), and has an wealth of intelligence at his arsenal. Perhaps not by anyone's standards, but it all depends what the definition of Ultimate Lifeform consists of.

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Well I think a question that is should be asked is, what is the Ultimate Lifeform anyways? Not from the game's perspective, as I have played SA2. But does that mean this "lifeform" is the fastest being? The smartest? The strongest? Do they live a long time? Are they invincible? Or all of the above?

So how is it really defined? I think then we can truly determine if Sonic is \ was the ULF (rhymes with Alf!), or if Shadow was in the first place.

Well Shadow said Sonic may be the Ultimate Life Form during the Super Sonic and Super Shadow boss fight, and if you listen to what Shadow has to say while your playing as Sonic you'll see that Shadow was having a tough time maintaining his Super form, while on the other hand, Sonic was doing just fine, for example, during the fight you may hear Shadow say, "Sonic, I can't keep this up much longer, hurry!" In the end it was probably Shadow's unstabability of the power of chaos that made his body give out and cause him to fall to Earth and apparantly die. Perhaps the term "Ultimate Life Form" refers to one who is able to control the power of chaos without any side-affects. The chaos emeralds are enriched by one's heart (referring to Tikal's statement, "Chaos is power, power is enriched by the heart) and Sonic has a heart of gold, so could this be what the term, "Ultimate Life Form" means?

Edit:

Needless to say, Robotnik's dying speech in Shadow the Hedgehog around the 9 minute mark during your battle with Devil Doom exclaims that Shadow is indeed the Ultimate Lifeform, a song to the same tune in order bolster emotions and confidence (I mean after all, he is your last hope out there.)

8:56 Shadow, can you hear me? This might be the last chance I have to speak to you so… What I said about having created you… It was all a lie… Everyone thought you died… During that horrible incident… But I rescued you… with one of my robots. You lost your memory that’s all. You really ARE the Ultimate Lifeform my grandfather created!

Well that is true what Eggman said but also keep in mind that when Eggman told Shadow "You are the Ultimate Life Form" during the fight against Devil Doom, he may have simply been referring to the fact that he is not an android he created but the original Shadow known to be the "Ultimate Life Form". Now, everyone in the Sonic Universe has referred to Shadow as the Ultimate Life Form but what if at one point (reffering to the final boss fight in SA2/B ) deep down inside, Shadow has realised that Sonic has surpassed him and that Sonic is the real Ultimate Life Form, but Shadow is the only person to realize this, even though Shadow shouted to Sonic that he may be the Ultimate Life Form, there is no context to assume that Sonic heard him or if this was just a thought from Shadow's conscience.

So basically what I was trying to say is that Eggman and all the other characters may assume Shadow to be the Ultimate Life Form due to Shadow's claim and Gerald's journal, however they are not aware of the events that took place between Sonic and Shadow during the fight against the Biolizard.

Edited by S0NIC Toadstool
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It's really not possible to answer without deciding what definition of "ULF" we're using. There's several valid options, none of which trump all the others.

Probably the most accurate definition would be an immortal life form. Project Shadow was all about immortality; Gerald's goal of curing Maria, the Biolizard's regenerative abilities, and Shadow still being alive 200 years from now. By this definition Shadow is the current champion, as while he may not be invincible, he doesn't seem to age, and he's got the power to shrug off almost anything that could cut his life short. But while this is a good technical definition, it doesn't seem to fit the common usage very well. It doesn't make much sense for Shadow to call Sonic the ULF if it's a matter of being immortal.

Another option is that it's a matter of power. Shadow is one of the most powerful characters in the Sonic universe, and since Sonic could compete and even surpass him in strength in SA2, it's reasonable for Shadow to call him the ULF by this definition. As for the final decision, I'd say it's too close to tell; the two are similar in abilities, and while Shadow has the edge in raw power, Sonic's got some tricks of his own. Neither one really pulls far enough ahead of the other for it to be clear-cut.

And I'm going to suggest a third option, thanks to something Stingray said. Perhaps the ULF isn't about dominance, but survival? "Winning" life isn't necessarily about clearly dominating every other species, but in your own surviving and being prosperous. In terms of individuals, true immortality would achieve this, so it fits alongside the first definition. Just below that, a creature powerful enough that no other creature is likely to kill it, which ties in definition two. But neither cuts to the core of the issue; they are creatures which will survive, but not creatures whose nature is "survival". To compare, Shadow is incredibly powerful and nigh unkillable, but that's about where it ends. Sonic, on the other hand, will survive anything he is required to, by the nature of the series and his role in it if nothing else. Even discounting that sort of meta thought, it's part of Sonic's nature to always move forward and never stop fighting; he's got an unbreakable will and the strength to back it up (and considering how the emeralds work, it's quite possible the former causes the latter).

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I had some ideas about a Shadow creation fanfic, since that part of the story was always confusing.

In the story Gerald would be a scientist obsessed with finding the ultimate life, after he discovers an Echidna religion that worshiped a creature called Chaos. After failing to create Chaos in experiments, his Echidna records (think Aztec sun stone) lead him to believe that "a creature in harmony with forces of Chaos" occurs in nature every few ages, and that he's living in one of these ages. The sources (especially the S3&K mural) point to that life taking the form of a hedgehog. He decides to force the natural process on the ARK, and isn't successful until he gets his hands on advanced genetics via Black Doom. What this story would do in addition to explain Shadow's creation, is hint to us that Sonic is basically the perfect life of the new age, like Chaos who Knuckles' ancestors worshiped. With Sonic and Shadow there would be two of them. I dunno if that's too large a stretch for people, defining Sonic like that. But I think it makes Gerald's purpose more clear if he's got this scientific obsession with finding the perfect lifeform. :P

A quote from me to you of me, about what I think about this. This would have been a fanfic, and only extrapolated from canon, so I don't think we can call Sonic the ultimate life until they really say it. Maybe Shadow's line was supposed to go somewhere, but they never decided to use it. I do think there's a connection between the ultimate life and the ability to use Chaos Emeralds, so maybe ultimate lifeform isn't the right term if there can be more than one of them. I think of Shadow as the perfect lifeform, like "Perfect" Chaos. It's more a status not a thing.

Edited by Ezra the Badnik
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But what is really the ultimate lifeform?

It's really not possible to answer without deciding what definition of "ULF" we're using.

Basically what I had asked at the beginning of this topic. ;)

Edited by Lava89
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Whenever a video game developer calls something an ultimate life form (That exact title has been used many times before Shadow came about), They clearly don't have Darwin's theory of evolution in mind.

There seem to be many signs to me that Sonic Adventure 2's plot was revised pretty heavily at some point in development, but it's hard to tell what it was prior to the changes. Knowing Iizuka, I wouldn't put it past him that he intended to make Sonic the final product of Project Shadow with the Shadow we know as the prototype. I would like to say that Shadow's name change (from "Terios") ties in with this, but I have no reason to believe that it's anything more than a prototype name never intended to be used in the first place.

For some reason I seem to recall something about project shadow being intended to create a cure for Maria's nondescript illness. She did have some kind of chronic illness, right?

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For some reason I seem to recall something about project shadow being intended to create a cure for Maria's nondescript illness. She did have some kind of chronic illness, right?

Yeah. Maria had a terminal disease, and Gerald tried to save her by creating a hedgehog. Makes sense, right?

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While I don't want to be a party pooper, I think that was just a cleverely context specific compliment from Shadow, nothing more.

I agree. Even though Shadow said that, he meant like an compliment, not a for real. Shadow survived, doesn't age, has POWAH, and can be easily defined like (as one of) strongest character in Sonic Universe.

Yeah. Maria had a terminal disease, and Gerald tried to save her by creating a hedgehog. Makes sense, right?

:lol:

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Its a lot more complicated than that. Gerald was trying to create a lifeform that overcame such things as disease and age. He didn't just use a hedgehog; he used a larger variety of beings for his EXPERIMENTS. Obviously he was unable to finish what he started, which was to cure Maria. He did finish his final project, Shadow, but Shadow wasn't his goal. Shadow was only the key to unlocking immortality in that way, so that he could try and uncover a way to cure Maria by creating an "immortal being." The whole idea of creating an immortal being was the President's idea, and the only reason Gerald agreed to it is because of Maria's illness.

Once Gerald was able to create a single immortal being, he could then continue and try to make other beings immortal, too. By utilizing this on Maria, it would, theoretically, cure her of the disease. I don't think the goal was really to make her immortal, though; the goal was to cure her, in any means necessary, and since he was assigned to Project: Shadow Gerald found this the prime opportunity.

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I have one possible answer. Some speculate that when Gerald was studying the ruins of the Echidna civilization he came across either the mural depicting the fight of Super Sonic and Perfect Chaos or the fight between Super Sonic and Eggman in the Doomsday Zone. And that after witnessing either image he decided to design Shadow in the same form as Super Sonic.

If the above is true then it might be that Gerald had shown Shadow the creature[super Sonic] his design is based off of before GUN raided the Ark. And thus it is during the battle between Super Sonic and the Bio-lizard, Shadow recognizes Super Sonic as the creature his own build is based off of and decides to tell Sonic the truth about who is the true Ultimate Life Form. After that battle Shadow loses his memory and thus begins referring to himself as the Ultimate Life Form once again.

As for who that ultimate Life Form truly is, I believe it is Super Sonic (not the regular Sonic).

Edited by megman
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Just in regards to this, I feel the need to quickly drop a tidbit or two on this. You have to bear in mind that thus far, the only characters in the series that CAN use Chaos Control are either:

a: hedgehogs (all three main chars of Sonic '06)

b: capable of Super forms (same as above)

c: artificial (Shadow, Biolizard, Metal Sonic/Madness)

So while it ain't exactly unique to Shads anymore, there's something of a specific criteria about it that limits it to specific beings, otherwise the usage between the roster would easily be much larger by now. Even bearing that in mind, Shadow is the only one who is capable of performing it without external aids (namely Chaos Emeralds), and I'd say that's enough for him to keep it his special thing. Not to mention he still has an array of other Chaos-based moves that nobody else seems capable of yet.

I'm fairly sure Knuckles and Tails could have used Chaos Control as well considering they can harness the chaos powers to turn into super forms, even though they haven't turned Super since the classics. And no shut up, that Sonic Heroes golden shield thing doesn't count. That was just developer laziness.

With that said "The Ultimate Lifeform" is nothing more than an ego-boost to Shadow as anyone can use Chaos Control if they just know how to harness the power of the Chaos Emeralds, which reduces Shadow to nothing more than a Sonic edit having to utilize airshoes in order to run fast and simply just uses Chaos Power as a means of combat as well, even though most other characters should also be able to do this. It's just to make him more "special", that and Sonic isn't really confined to combat and destruction, his trait is speed. Silver already has his own power which is telepathy. "Ultimate Artificial Lifeform" would be more suitable since he has a perfect AI and pretty much acts on his own whim. So all in all, Sonic and Shadow are pretty much exacts in traits only they use them differently in order to categorize their behaviors.

Edited by Frog-Tan
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And no shut up, that Sonic Heroes golden shield thing doesn't count. That was just developer laziness.

Wasn't that just because T&k would've look unsymetrical to sonic? I mean yellow,yellow pink?...doesn't work.

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I don't think Sonic is the Ultimate Life Form because I found it simply to be a gimmick for the game. We saw Shadow and we all said, "Who is THIS!?" and then he comes out claiming that he is the "Ultimate Life Form" and you realize that is his thing, his gimmick, what made him mysterious/cool/lame/sexy/whatever you think of Shadow. I see it as nothing more than that. Today, it seems to merely be a title that was given to Shadow with his name. Kind of like, "Dr Eggman, Genius Extraordinaire with a IQ of 300" or something of that matter.

I think the title has no significance (Thanks to the excessive plotholes due to Shadow coming back in Hereoes and ShtH). And I don't think, "Ultimate Life Form" fits Sonic. I associate as being a creature of some king that was created in a test tube, not the mammal Sonic is.

"Sonic the Hedgehog, the Ultimate Life Form"....

....Nah!!! :P

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Wasn't that just because T&k would've look unsymetrical to sonic? I mean yellow,yellow pink?...doesn't work.

It's already yellow, yellow, red. Doesn't make much of a difference.

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Considering Sonic has fought against giant water monsters, space lizards, robot dragons, a 7 eyed thing that lives in the center of the planet and also a GOD and defeated all of them, I think its pretty safe to say Sonic is the ultimate life form as far as the franchise is concerned. Although all Sonic characters are stupidly overpowed anyway, for example how the hell can an echidna kill THE KING OF GHOSTS by digging into it? Though if we're to take all variations of the 3D stories into consideration Sonic has been defeated by Knuckles, Gamma and Shadow (even whilst fighting alongside Diablon), plus if we're to take Sonic Battle as canon then you can add Rouge, Emerl and even Tails to the list of characters that have single handedly taken down Sonic.

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While I don't want to be a party pooper, I think that was just a cleverely context specific compliment from Shadow, nothing more.

I would have to agree with this. It was a complement to Sonic, showing that he now respects him. Shadow was very impressed Sonic kept going, exspecially since he himself was tiring out (although this was caused also by the previous fight).

Now, concerning what 'the Ultimate Lifeform' is? Heck, I don't know. From pure connotation I'd say it mean they are the strongest and smartest (or at least a good enough combination to be better than all other life in some shape or form). Well, Shadow's pretty fast and strong. Not to mention built-in immortality and Chaos Powers. So I guess that would make him the 'Ultimate' based on that critera. But only that critera.

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My only explanation on this issue is that Shadow knows that he's artificial and that Sonic's natural, and when Shadow saw Sonic doing so well against the Biolizard Shadow claims that Sonic's the ULF because Sonic may be able to withstand more amount of chaos energy.

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I'm fairly sure Knuckles and Tails could have used Chaos Control as well considering they can harness the chaos powers to turn into super forms, even though they haven't turned Super since the classics. And no shut up, that Sonic Heroes golden shield thing doesn't count. That was just developer laziness.

Developer laziness is questionable. That was the origin of S. Sonics ability to diffuse chaos onto his buddies. (it evolved onto a much more visibly appealing technique in 06).

Also, people are pinballing that short list of Chaos Control users. I have to think that it would be a knock on the U. Life Form. Shadow gets demeaned that much more every time someone else whips it out.

- Sonic

- Shadow

- Silver

- Metal Sonic

- Biolizard

- Black Doom (I believe it was said that it was Dooms Blood that enabled Shadow)

- Blaze (possibly - no one knows exactly what she did, but C. Control is a good bet)

- Solaris (Technically it could distort space-time + End of the World)

Its sickening. Chaos Control was designed to be an overpowering ability.

For the simple fact that everyone can use it, and that Shadow still spouts about his Ultimate status, I have to think Chaos Powers have little to do with the title. (either that, or proficiency > ability).

As far as I am concerned, the Ultimate Lifeform is a just a name granted to Shadow meaning that no other lifeform can stand before him.

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