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Soniman

So which games take place on which "Earth"?

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Human world, Sonic world, His World it's all the same really.

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I really wish Sega would release an official statement on which games take place, which world (AND classic World) but if they insist on making this idiotic idea Canon I think it'd be fun to speculate. 

Human World Games

Sonic Adventure (takes place in human city)

Sonic Adventure 2 (human cities, government, president, military etc)

Sonic Battle (human cities, I believe the government is mentioned, as is Gerald Robotnik)

Shadow (same as SA2)

Sonic 06 (Human city, kingdom, human princess is a main character)

Sonic Unleashed (entire world of humans)

Sonic Colors (no humans appear but the design of the planet is the same as Unleashed's so human world it is)

Sonic Chronicles (very likely not Canon but I'm pretty sure GUN is in it so just toss it here)

Sonic's World games 

Heroes (no humans, the only "city" we see is futuristic and still no humans, more fantastical locations and settings in general)

Sonic Lost World (this could go either way since it doesn't really take place on the main world(s) but I assume it's sonic world since the main surface area we do see has very cartoon cube-like trees that appear in the next game)

Sonic Forces (the most obvious one, animal inhabitants and no humans)

Sonic 4 (I'm not sure if this is even Canon but its a classic style modern game like Heroes so on the list it goes).

Classic-Sonic World 

Pretty much everything between Sonic 1 and SA1 besides Mania obviously

Misc

Storybook games  take place inside storybooks, Rush Adventure takes place in the Sol Dimension, and Sonic Generations is in its own weird pocket dimension.

Not sure

The Advance series, Sonic Rush, the Rivals series and the Riders series are the ones I'm not sure about.

The Advances SEEMS like a Sonic world exclusive but then you have stuff like Route 99 in Adv 3 and how it's story elements continue on from Battle, a human world game. Rush 1 has Huge Crisis which seems to take place on a GUN-like battleship fleet. Riders just kinda has elements of both and Rivals has a Silver from a ruined future just like 06-Human world Silver 

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11 minutes ago, Soniman said:

Sonic Colors (no humans appear but the design of the planet is the same as Unleashed's so human world it is)

Eggman has a few lines about how he's about to take over "Sonic's world" so it's pretty definitively in Sonic's world, regardless of what the planet looks like.

18 minutes ago, Soniman said:

Rush 1 has Huge Crisis which seems to take place on a GUN-like battleship fleet.

The stage has GUN robots, so it's definitely a GUN fleet, and so you can pretty safely argue that Rush takes place in the human world.

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27 minutes ago, Diogenes said:

Eggman has a few lines about how he's about to take over "Sonic's world" so it's pretty definitively in Sonic's world, regardless of what the planet looks like.

That's true actually now that I think about the Wisp also only appear in Sonic World games as well and contrast pretty heavily against the more grotesque human world Black Arm aliens so I agree but the planet surface looking the same as Unleashed's  is still a dumb discrepancy if they were so adamant about sticking to the idea

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I honestly have no reason to believe that Sega actually buy into the two world nonsense, and was just an answer that Iizuka came up with when someone asked him why are there humans around. It really does feel like one of those answers you throw out when you don't actually have an explanation. 

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I have a question about this Two Worlds thing. Has any piece of official Sonic media made any reference to Sonic's world actually being two worlds? I haven't played Lost World or Forces but I can't remember anything in any of the older games that would suggest that Sonic travels back and forth between two different planets.

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25 minutes ago, Kuzu said:

I honestly have no reason to believe that Sega actually buy into the two world nonsense, and was just an answer that Iizuka came up with when someone asked him why are there humans around. It really does feel like one of those answers you throw out when you don't actually have an explanation. 

Nah, they wouldn't keep bothering with it if it wasn't actually a thing. I think of it a bit like the Zelda timeline; it's a real thing that has some implications for the series, but it's usually not important, it isn't the developer's primary concern, and it definitely shouldn't be anyone else's.

Just now, Cosmos Rogue said:

I have a question about this Two Worlds thing. Has any piece of official Sonic media made any reference to Sonic's world actually being two worlds? I haven't played Lost World or Forces but I can't remember anything in any of the older games that would suggest that Sonic travels back and forth between two different planets.

Not explicitly, the closest is probably the talk of "Sonic's world" in Colors that I mentioned. It's not a plot point that any game has concerned itself with, it's just something hanging around in the background.

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1 hour ago, Soniman said:

That's true actually now that I think about the Wisp also only appear in Sonic World games as well and contrast pretty heavily against the more grotesque human world Black Arm aliens so I agree but the planet surface looking the same as Unleashed's  is still a dumb discrepancy if they were so adamant about sticking to the idea

Idea: maybe Eggman knew about the portal and decided to aim his laser from Earth to Sonic’s world? While the game is above “Earth”, Eggman wanted to go and target Sonic’s world. 

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1 hour ago, Kuzu said:

I honestly have no reason to believe that Sega actually buy into the two world nonsense, and was just an answer that Iizuka came up with when someone asked him why are there humans around. It really does feel like one of those answers you throw out when you don't actually have an explanation. 

As great as it would be to just be able to disregard the things Iizuka a lot of things he says as things he made up on the spot, there is reason to believe this stuff is actually written down in an internal document.

We first heard about it before Colors, but I don't think he'd be so adamant about it being a thing ten years later if he didn't care at all.

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Correct me if this was disproven somewhere, but isn't there sufficient evidence to suggest that there aren't literally two separate worlds in the Sonic games and that the "two worlds" thing refers to two separate societies? (based on the fact that the Japanese word for "world" can also mean "society", and that Iizuka has gone on record to say that Emerald Coast is in Sonic's world, among other things)

 

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If it's classic styled and features no humans I just assume it's Sonic's World unless proven otherwise. That would put the Advance games over there. 

One detail about Advance 3 I find interesting is that it's story technically features the world being split into pieces but nobody has to put up with any of Dark Gaia's nonsense. That could only be the case if Dark Gaia wasn't in the planet that got broken. There's probably a much more boring answer for this discrepancy but having two planets settles it in-universe. 

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1 hour ago, Rexeljet said:

Correct me if this was disproven somewhere, but isn't there sufficient evidence to suggest that there aren't literally two separate worlds in the Sonic games and that the "two worlds" thing refers to two separate societies? (based on the fact that the Japanese word for "world" can also mean "society", and that Iizuka has gone on record to say that Emerald Coast is in Sonic's world, among other things)

According to Ian Flynn, he's been told at multiple points that there are literally two planets that the games take place on.

There was another time he said Iizuka himself told him, but I'm on mobile right now.

Aaron Webber spoke about this at some point too. Unless there's multiple translators at SEGA with some Two Worlds agenda.

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1 hour ago, Wraith said:

If it's classic styled and features no humans I just assume it's Sonic's World unless proven otherwise. That would put the Advance games over there. 

One detail about Advance 3 I find interesting is that it's story technically features the world being split into pieces but nobody has to put up with any of Dark Gaia's nonsense. That could only be the case if Dark Gaia wasn't in the planet that got broken. There's probably a much more boring answer for this discrepancy but having two planets settles it in-universe. 

Funny how it lines up with  all the human world games having eldritch God monsters, Dark Gaia, Black Doom, Biolizard, Solaris, Chaos

OH lord speaking of Chaos how does Angel Island even begin to make sense with the two world nonsense since it has existed in both worlds at this point but all the lore with the Echidnas happens in the Mystic Ruins on human world which kinda makes sense because Gerald studied the ruins and now I have a headache 

 

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25 minutes ago, Soniman said:

OH lord speaking of Chaos how does Angel Island even begin to make sense with the two world nonsense since it has existed in both worlds at this point but all the lore with the Echidnas happens in the Mystic Ruins on human world which kinda makes sense because Gerald studied the ruins and now I have a headache 

 

Stuff like this is exactly why it's much easier to denounce Iizuka's comments until it actually becomes concretely spelled out in the games because official or not, it makes less sense than just assuming all take place on the same planet and some games just have more surreal art styles than others, or some locations look like our world and some locations are more fantastical.

Tbh the "Sonic's World" comment in Colours never came off to me as anything more than a weird insistence on not using the word "Earth" in the series to keep the setting vaguely seperate from the Earth of the real world.  But I can't argue that it doesn't have legs to support the two worlds thing either when "the planet" or "the world" could have equally been used (and have been in previous games).

 

Entertaining the topic's goal though, I mostly would agree with the list in OP - when it comes to the Advance games, the presence of cities doesn't mean too much - Spring Yard, Star Light, Casino Night, Casino Park and Sunset Heights all contain fairly grounded looking cities in the background despite taking place in more "Sonic's World"-ish games.

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6 hours ago, Diogenes said:

Nah, they wouldn't keep bothering with it if it wasn't actually a thing. I think of it a bit like the Zelda timeline; it's a real thing that has some implications for the series, but it's usually not important, it isn't the developer's primary concern, and it definitely shouldn't be anyone else's.

I feel like the difference is that while there are explicitly different incarnations of Link and Zelda in every game, Sonic and Co. are meant to be the same exact characters going from game to game. More Mario than Zelda IMO, but the main difference is that Mario has never once given a shit about narrative cohesion at all, even in the more story driven games. 

Sonic games, at least before, kind of gave the illusion of being a somewhat cohesive setting, so that's why the sudden change is pretty jarring. 

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So, how do we explain all the ancient echidna arcitecture in the Mystic Ruins? Or how Angel Island is seemingly present on both planets?

Or, y'know, Emerald Town - where Tails lives - being accessible by walking from both Central City (which appeared in Shadow the Hedgehog and is definitely in the human world) and "Knuckles' house" which is presumably on Angel Island since it's right next to the Emerald shrine?

Sonic geography's a nightmare.

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Sonic Colors was when this idea was first publicly brought up if you don't count Sonic X (per some interview, it's been linked in the forum before somewhere). This might be it but there could be multiple: http://info.sonicretro.org/Takashi_Iizuka_interview_by_Game_(August_4,_2010)

Quote

Takashi Iizuka: We have two different worlds for Sonic games – one is human, and one is set on the non-human side. Sonic Colours is set on the non-human side. The only human in the game is Dr Eggman, who tries to build this huge amusement park which, as you will see on the world map, ties all these planets together with a tractor beam.

Apparently, also according to Ian Flynn, this idea was made by Yuji Naka and was a thing since Sonic Adventure, which does explain Sonic X. So as nonsensical as the idea is, it's been around for decades? https://sonicsourceblog.wordpress.com/2018/03/19/flynn-clarifies-the-two-world-issue-in-bumblekast-65/

Even weirder is how you never get an impression this was a thing until after Colors, because Colors onwards has been all on the non human world, Generations at most maybe on regular Earth. I'll chalk that up to coincidence or maybe, this was a more dormant idea that became active, especially by the time of Forces.

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3 hours ago, Dr. Mechano said:

So, how do we explain all the ancient echidna arcitecture in the Mystic Ruins? Or how Angel Island is seemingly present on both planets?

Or, y'know, Emerald Town - where Tails lives - being accessible by walking from both Central City (which appeared in Shadow the Hedgehog and is definitely in the human world) and "Knuckles' house" which is presumably on Angel Island since it's right next to the Emerald shrine?

Sonic geography's a nightmare.

The ancient Echidnas traveled to the human world with the secret giant rings that Sonic and friends used. When Angel Island rose out of the ground, it also started teleporting between worlds. 

Central City in Battle is another, animal world city named Central City.

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1 minute ago, Razule said:

Central City in Battle is another, animal world city named Central City.

In Battle, Rouge still claims to be acting as an agent of the President.

Is... is she also employed by some other, animal president? Or did the president of the United Federation task her with a mission on another planet in that game?

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7 minutes ago, Dr. Mechano said:

In Battle, Rouge still claims to be acting as an agent of the President.

Is... is she also employed by some other, animal president? Or did the president of the United Federation task her with a mission on another planet in that game?

Honestly, that would explain why she mentions an "intelligence division"  in Forces.

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SA1 had loads of callbacks to the events and lore of the games predating it and Sonic and Tails explicitly remember their Genesis-era adventures in Generations. Sonic 4's plot, while now dubiously canon, was still tied directly to the events of Sonic CD. Regardless of what they say now, it's pretty clear that the classic games were always a part of the modern lore.

If we're going with the idea that "classic world" Mania took place in is a new branch of the timeline created by the time travel shenanigans in Generations, then it stands to reason that any event prior to the split can be remembered in either timeline branch.

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12 minutes ago, Domino said:

SA1 had loads of callbacks to the events and lore of the games predating it and Sonic and Tails explicitly remember their Genesis-era adventures in Generations. Sonic 4's plot, while now dubiously canon, was still tied directly to the events of Sonic CD. Regardless of what they say now, it's pretty clear that the classic games were always a part of the modern lore.

If we're going with the idea that "classic world" Mania took place in is a new branch of the timeline created by the time travel shenanigans in Generations, then it stands to reason that any event prior to the split can be remembered in either timeline branch.

Oh alright, thanks.

Though that brings the question on which of the worlds the classic games take place. Forces makes you think it's on the non human world (Green Hill, Chemical Plant, rebuilt Death Egg?) which would be fine, except Angel Island. If there was some chaos control event like in Sonic X established in the games, this would be fine honestly.

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I think the human world is just their way of explaining away why they're not going to address stuff like GUN or any of the human society stuff. Like, it's a explanation for why the flavor of Sonic's world changed that doesn't explicitly lock them out from ever returning to it if they feel like it. It's kind of like putting that part of Sonic on the bench so to speak.

It doesn't really make sense, but Sonic's world wasn't consistent even before this was a thing so I'm just rolling with it for now.

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9 hours ago, Wraith said:

If it's classic styled and features no humans I just assume it's Sonic's World unless proven otherwise. That would put the Advance games over there. 

One detail about Advance 3 I find interesting is that it's story technically features the world being split into pieces but nobody has to put up with any of Dark Gaia's nonsense. That could only be the case if Dark Gaia wasn't in the planet that got broken. There's probably a much more boring answer for this discrepancy but having two planets settles it in-universe. 

Here's my boring answer. When the planet was split in Sonic Advance 3, it was several years before Sonic Unleashed, so the Dark and Light Gia were just too premature to even wake up at all. It might even have to do with the way the planet was split. In Advance 3, Eggman used Chaos Control to split the planet and the Chaos Emeralds weren't drained, but in Unleashed, Eggman used a laser powered by the Chaos Emeralds which were drained by the laser, and all the Chaos Emeralds' power was shot into the planet.

All of the games are in one world. It's how it is and should be.

If there was a "human world", then why was the Light Gia (Chip) a "mobian" like creature? Why were there temples for the Chaos Emeralds? Why were there human depictions and statues in Sonic 3? Why was the Knuckles tribe on the human world? Why was Chaos and chao on the human world? Does Angel Island travel between worlds? How did Gerald Robotnik have access to mobian hedgehog DNA? Why would Shadow, Rouge, and Omega be on Sonic's planet when they work for G.U.N.? Why would Shadow be on Sonic's world in Heroes after falling from the Ark in the human world? What made Sonic and Eggman travel between each other's worlds in the first place? 

I think saying that there are two worlds raises a lot more plot holes than saying there's one world. I say one world, you say,"But, the moon is whole again!" Anything else?

I say that the reason why there are only humans in Station Square and only mobians in the city in Sonic Forces is that humans and mobians live segregated because of height difference. Wouldn't it be hard to make buildings work for both mobians and humans?

One world.

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2 minutes ago, SonicFan2832 said:

Here's my boring answer. When the planet was split in Sonic Advance 3, it was several years before Sonic Unleashed, so the Dark and Light Gia were just too premature to even wake up at all. It might even have to do with the way the planet was split. In Advance 3, Eggman used Chaos Control to split the planet and the Chaos Emeralds weren't drained, but in Unleashed, Eggman used a laser powered by the Chaos Emeralds which were drained by the laser, and all the Chaos Emeralds' power was shot into the planet.

All of the games are in one world. It's how it is and should be.

If there was a "human world", then why was the Light Gia (Chip) a "mobian" like creature? Why were there temples for the Chaos Emeralds? Why were there human depictions and statues in Sonic 3? Why was the Knuckles tribe on the human world? Why was Chaos and chao on the human world? Does Angel Island travel between worlds? How did Gerald Robotnik have access to mobian hedgehog DNA? Why would Shadow, Rouge, and Omega be on Sonic's planet when they work for G.U.N.? Why would Shadow be on Sonic's world in Heroes after falling from the Ark in the human world? What made Sonic and Eggman travel between each other's worlds in the first place? 

I think saying that there are two worlds raises a lot more plot holes than saying there's one world. I say one world, you say,"But, the moon is whole again!" Anything else?

I say that the reason why there are only humans in Station Square and only mobians in the city in Sonic Forces is that humans and mobians live segregated because of height difference. Wouldn't it be hard to make buildings work for both mobians and humans?

One world.

How you feel about it doesn't change anything about what the creators have said is their intent. I'm trying to make sense of their intent. 

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