Sonic 2 Movie Spoiler Thread (Mostly Untagged Spoilers)

[Diogenes]

3 minutes ago, StriCNYN3 said:

But that's missing the point though. What does it matter if the Biolizard doesn't look 100% like Chaos? The Biolizard was a failed experiment anyway, and the goal was to search for immortality, not entirely shape its appearance 1-1. The main idea of what the Biolizard consists of should be more than enough that it was supposed to be a "Chaos 2" or "Shadow" aka following Chao's footsteps as I like to call it =P. The professor just went off what he saw as the murals depicted Chaos as shown in SA1 when it's at full power, which is a water god lizard serpant thing. Clearly Professor knows about the emeralds in its shrine, or else it wouldn't be in the Ark.... so how and why would he somehow not know about other echidna history, especially as something as big as that literally wiped their civilization?

I don't understand how you see it as vauge after what I've said though? If it was just an artifical chaos in like say... a secret bonus stage like Green Hill zone was, then I could see your point, but after what the game has presented? Idk man, haha. It seems pretty obvious. And why would they not? It's literally the sequel to SA1.

The Biolizard looks almost 0% like Chaos, if you're going to point to them both being lizardy as evidence of a connection you can't just ignore that the supposed similarity is such a stretch and excuse it by calling the Biolizard a failed prototype. If players were meant to connect the two, wouldn't there be a more obvious similarity, especially since they didn't hesitate to make the Artificial Chaos obvious?

And the "Project Shadow" name already has an explanation, which has nothing to do with Chaos:

Quote

The research has been documented as being named "Project Shadow" from the irony of creating a shadow (which cannot exist in this world,)

Similarly the article talks a bit about the Biolizard specifically and doesn't mention anything about Chaos, just about it being a lizard with greatly improved regenerative abilities.

The game certainly doesn't overtly present any connection betwee Chaos and the Biolizard, the Artificial Chaos are just enemies, the game makes no comment on them, the fake shrine is theorized to help harness the emeralds' power and we're not given reason to question that. It's not explicit in the game, it's not hinted by any extra-textual material I can think of, maybe a fair argument could be constructed but it is definitely not what I would call an obvious conclusion to draw.

[___-_]

15 minutes ago, Darkvizardberrytan said:

No I am pretty sure Shadow had those powers before he went crazy. Its a pretty over arching plot cause Black Doom was in the picture before all that. Its the reason the laser on the Station existed to destroy the comet on its return. Sadly Gun took matters into their own hands thinking he was working against the earth with Doom. After Maria was killed he goes crazy and decides without her why protect the world now. Forget it just destroy it with the weapon i wanted to protect with it. But we shall see where they go with the story. All theories are good for now.

Yea, I never really agreed with the events of STH tbh since I always hated that game violently lol, although I'm not going to argue with what they established as canon if you get what I mean. Like, it just made more sense to me that, going off of SA2, Shadow didn't have his destructive powers until after the professor went insane... because what does chaos control and rolling into a ball to hurt people have to do with immortality, ya know? =P

But yea, that was always my little head canon. Clearly they depict Shadow having these abilities even in his flash back memory stages in STH, too.

Also, that eclipse cannon reasoning never made sense to me... like, if they made the cannon to destroy the Black Arms all along... why did they kill off Gerald and literally everyone onboard then instead of just getting rid of the Black Arms... lol. Clearly it doesn't just take one fucking man to be in space and make the thing. Other people clearly had to know. Why is the professor even seen as a villain? Why keep that a secret from everyone?

[Darkvizardberrytan]

I think cause he was so secretive. It was a dual effort. 1. to find a way to save Maria with immortality so he had to trick the black arms into helping with Shadow and his ability to not be harmed with toxins or whatever that mist was at the end of Sth and 2. They probably killed him and everyone thinking they were all in cahoots with the black arms without actually checking or knowing. All they knew was the professor made shadow with this creatures that wanted to destroy the earth and he would not tell them what his purpose was and that he was a mad man. Its a Sonic game honestly that is why I am hoping Frontiers with Ian writing is actually good with a nice flowing story like the IDW books.

[___-_]

Yea, it's so much of that belief suspension that makes me just disregard StH story =P. Like, from what I understand, Gerald didn't really see them as a threat until somehow after the fact he made Shadow...? (Even though the Black Arms didn't do anything yet anyway... or else all of humanity would've already been enslaved at that point anyway... but clearly they aren't as Earth was still thriving? Hell they celebrate the damn comet's 50 year return with an anniversary festival in present time in StH)

It's just weird that they depict Black arms being the reason everyone had to die and live behind this horrible mystery forever... when nothing happened yet when clearly in that same game, they talk about the artificial chaos, a completely separate conflict, where they actually said in their own dialogue that it attacked them and caused the Ark havoc. Unless I'm missing something here.

[Diogenes]

32 minutes ago, StriCNYN3 said:

Like, it just made more sense to me that, going off of SA2, Shadow didn't have his destructive powers until after the professor went insane... because what does chaos control and rolling into a ball to hurt people have to do with immortality, ya know? =P

Maybe that's just what happens when you pump enough chaos energy into something, considering the Biolizard could use Chaos Control too.

[Shiny Gems]

About the Black Arms, will they even be used in the third Sonic movie? Sega has disallowed those such as IDW to use dead characters such as Black Doom and the Black Arms, from what I remember. I know it was mostly a comics thing, but I am not sure if they'll be allowed in the movies if they can't be used in the comics. Maybe it is just me, though?

[___-_]

54 minutes ago, Diogenes said:

The Biolizard looks almost 0% like Chaos, if you're going to point to them both being lizardy as evidence of a connection you can't just ignore that the supposed similarity is such a stretch and excuse it by calling the Biolizard a failed prototype. If players were meant to connect the two, wouldn't there be a more obvious similarity, especially since they didn't hesitate to make the Artificial Chaos obvious?

And the "Project Shadow" name already has an explanation, which has nothing to do with Chaos:

Similarly the article talks a bit about the Biolizard specifically and doesn't mention anything about Chaos, just about it being a lizard with greatly improved regenerative abilities.

The game certainly doesn't overtly present any connection betwee Chaos and the Biolizard, the Artificial Chaos are just enemies, the game makes no comment on them, the fake shrine is theorized to help harness the emeralds' power and we're not given reason to question that. It's not explicit in the game, it's not hinted by any extra-textual material I can think of, maybe a fair argument could be constructed but it is definitely not what I would call an obvious conclusion to draw.

Im sorry, I just don't understand how you can't see the similarities between the two and how that falls back to Shadow. There are obvious connections between the two which I've already mentioned. The stages and their story telling within them, the music call backs, their designs, their history and their shared goals and even them being the final foil should be enough to tell you how they connect.

Can you explain to me how they're nothing alike, like at all? Are you looking at everything from a surface level and not acknowledging the clues the writers left off to put the pieces together for the player to figure out? What is Chaos and Biolizard to you? I just want to know before we go any further. The writers don't have to literally say "Oh yea, and uh, Chaos and Biolizard are brothers... Da End!" at the end credits for people to make the connections and see how SA1 is involved with SA2 =P. 

[Diogenes]

2 minutes ago, StriCNYN3 said:

Can you explain to me how they're nothing alike, like at all?

Well one is a mutated chao with a body composed of water, typically taking a humanoid form, but by absorbing chaos emeralds it can grow and change, at times resembling a shark, a spider or scorpion, or a giant sea serpent capable of wiping out a city.

And the other is a big mutated lizard on life support, eyeless, toothless, with malformed limbs, created in a lab in a search for immortality, a sickly lump of flesh in spite of its regenerative abilities.

Can't say I see much similarity between them.

15 minutes ago, StriCNYN3 said:

Are you looking at everything from a surface level and not acknowledging the clues the writers left off to put the pieces together for the player to figure out?

Are you assuming any "connections" you've come up with are intentional clues, and not just your own unsupported reaches?

[Leebo4]

I don’t think the biolizard is necessary for a sonic adventure 2 adaptation, maybe after his change of heart he has to stop Gerald’s Endgame considering I don’t even think it’s necessary to put the ark there

 

they could say it was a secret lab they are working on and they could come up with a different scenario to pull the plan off

[light-gaia]

3 hours ago, CrystalMaelStorm said:

About the Black Arms, will they even be used in the third Sonic movie? Sega has disallowed those such as IDW to use dead characters such as Black Doom and the Black Arms, from what I remember. I know it was mostly a comics thing, but I am not sure if they'll be allowed in the movies if they can't be used in the comics. Maybe it is just me, though?

I don't think it would be possible to adapt Sonic Adventure 2 and Shadow the Hedgehog in the same movie. SA2 story alone is a lot of content to adapt. Maybe, they could adapt Shadow the Hedgehog in a live action series, just like they are doing with the Knuckles series. Or in a fourth or fifth movie.

[Shiny Gems]

2 minutes ago, light-gaia said:

I don't think it would be possible to adapt Sonic Adventure 2 and Shadow the Hedgehog in the same movie. SA2 story alone is a lot of content to adapt. Maybe, they could adapt Shadow the Hedgehog in a live action series, just like they are doing with the Knuckles series. Or in a fourth or fifth movie.

I know. Still, I don't think I said them being in the same movie. I just am wondering if they are even allowed.

[light-gaia]

10 minutes ago, CrystalMaelStorm said:

I know. Still, I don't think I said them being in the same movie. I just am wondering if they are even allowed.

I would love to have a Shadow the Hedgehog movie adaptation with better writing than the original game hehe

[Shiny Gems]

Just now, light-gaia said:

I would love to have a Shadow the Hedgehog movie adaptation with better writing than the original game hehe

I wouldn't mind that as well, actually.

[Zadent]

54 minutes ago, light-gaia said:

I would love to have a Shadow the Hedgehog movie adaptation with better writing than the original game hehe

I probably would not complain about that one bit (unless the writing/characterization gets botched ). Even if not a direct adaptation, but just a series focused on him, though telling the story from ShTH without all the branching paths, but one singular story would go a long way (my biggest issue with that game’s story is just them not actually saying what path he took to get to Last Story)

[light-gaia]

15 minutes ago, Zadent said:

I probably would not complain about that one bit (unless the writing/characterization gets botched ). Even if not a direct adaptation, but just a series focused on him, though telling the story from ShTH without all the branching paths, but one singular story would go a long way (my biggest issue with that game’s story is just them not actually saying what path he took to get to Last Story)

I really like Shadow the Hedgehog plot, even though the execution was bad, and some story paths were inconsistent with each other. I like the retcons they did with SA2's story, such as explaining why the Eclipse cannon was created. I think the story could be pretty great if Shadow's character was better written

[VO.SUPER]

Spoiler

Chaos is looking to be inevitable as a major plot thread in the future, if this image is anything to go by.

[Shiny Gems]

Just now, The Great Egg Emperor said:

Now that Shadow has been confirmed, who should voice him? I kind of want Robert Pattinson, but that's just me.

One person I know is one I have seen say that Keanu Reeves should do the voice of Shadow.

[Zadent]

1 hour ago, light-gaia said:

I really like Shadow the Hedgehog plot, even though the execution was bad, and some story paths were inconsistent with each other. I like the retcons they did with SA2's story, such as explaining why the Eclipse cannon was created. I think the story could be pretty great if Shadow's character was better written

Yeah, there are some points of it I like, some I don’t. I absolutely love Sonic and Shadow having a rematch race in Space Gadget which leads to Shadow getting his memories back, and is a piece I think feels..necessary if you aren’t pointing to Last Story (neutral a bit, go Hero, race Sonic, finish full Hero). Last Story was so cool to me, and a great transition from amnesia Shadow to ‘06 Shadow. Gimme that Shadow spin-off series, please  he seems the most likely of the 4 to go elsewhere and do stuff, at least based on where team Sonic is at the end of 2

[PeterPancake]

Robert Pattinson or Pedro Pascal for me. Keanu Reeves would be playing a parody of the character 

[GOAT]

Just walked out of the theatre and man…no words…they truly outdid themselves.

What a time to be alive as a Sonic fan right now! Just absolutely grinning from ear to ear…gonna def see it again when I am able..

[Red]

6 hours ago, The Great Egg Emperor said:

Now that Shadow has been confirmed, who should voice him? I kind of want Robert Pattinson, but that's just me.

Keanu Reeves for sure. He's an actor Paramount can actually afford since he's not in high demand and I feel he would actually really care about Shadow and do a lot of research, just like Idris Elba with Knuckles. He's also a genuinely nice guy and would get along swell with fans.

[Rabbitearsblog]

So, since we've seen the movie, what were your favorite scenes in the movie?  My favorite scenes were:

1. Sonic and Tails bonding with each other at the lodge and Sonic covering Tails up with a cover when Tails goes to sleep.

2. Sonic and Knuckles talking with each other after Knuckles saves Sonic's life.

3. The final battle with the Death Egg (and SUPER SONIC)!

4. The final scene of Sonic, Tails and Knuckles playing baseball with each other.

[caitash]

26 minutes ago, Rabbitearsblog said:

So, since we've seen the movie, what were your favorite scenes in the movie?  My favorite scenes were:

1. Sonic and Tails bonding with each other at the lodge and Sonic covering Tails up with a cover when Tails goes to sleep.

That HUG. I hoped and hoped it was coming, but it still caught me off guard with how sudden and warm and sincere it was. And that dual blanket part. And everything else in that scene. My cold dark heart was instantly filled to the brim with warmth. I need more, and so help me having the patience to wait another 2-3 years for the 3rd film for it. I hope he gets a hug back this time, Movie!Sonic seems like he’d be more open to it than Sega!Sonic.

Also a standout moment was when Super Sonic just stopped the giant metal punch dead in its tracks. I’m not normally in that much awe of Super Sonic but that moment was just satisfyingly perfect.

Everything else was jus wondeful too. I keep trying to make a list but I just end up including so much that I’m just listing off the whole movie.

[Rabbitearsblog]

36 minutes ago, caitash said:

That HUG. I hoped and hoped it was coming, but it still caught me off guard with how sudden and sincere it was. And that dual blanket part. And everything else in that scene. My cold dark heart was instantly filled to the brim with warmth. I need more, and so help me having the patience to wait another 2-3 years for the 3rd film for it. I hope he gets a hug back this time, Movie!Sonic seems like he’d be more open to it than Sega!Sonic.

I hope that Sonic also gives a hug back to Tails soon. It would make their relationship feel more complete!

[WhoWhatMan]

I liked the movie, but man, I hope they make it more focused next time.

The pacing felt like this meme at points lol



I thought it bounced around too much.

We got the plot with Sonic & Tails, then Knuckles & Eggman, then Tom at the Wedding, then random scenes of Wayne (the most iconic Sonic character), and then suddenly GUN shows up at the wedding! Clearly they're trying to set things up for the 3rd movie, but I guess I wanted more development of certain characters, like Tails.

He's my favorite Sonic character, so admittedly I'm bias but I would like some more proper explanation about who he is? I can get around him knowing Sonic, but he also somehow knows about Knuckles and his whole deal? It also would've been nice to get a proper flashback of his origin instead of him explaining it off. Y'know, see more of the village he came from and get extra lore through that.

It felt like there were suppose to be one, but they cut it out to have Metal Gear Maddie instead lol

Regardless, I liked the movie quite a bit. I'm a real sucker to the whole "Found Family" trope in stories, so this story really does it for me.

It's honestly just... nice seeing Sonic and friends talking about their feelings? While I had some issues with Tails, I like that scene where Tails pour his heart out to Sonic and them just having a mutual understanding of each other. The part where Sonic and Knuckles talk to each other on the beach and worked out their differences was also very heartfelt. I like the bit where Knuckles asked Sonic about "how can you keep being so hopeful after losing everything?". That struck a cord with me.

This is a bit personal, but my grandma died earlier this year and it been stuck on my mind for a while. She lived a long and fulfilling life, but it's also weird to have someone that was a big part of your life being gone. 

So when Knuckles asked him that and Sonic reassures him, I... like, shed a tear, lol.

It's kinda silly, but I guess I needed to hear that.

Y'know, even from a blue hedgehog who does Fortnite dances.