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Kuzu

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56 minutes ago, Kuzu said:

Sonic should probably stop ripping off other successful IP's and just be Sonic. 

I mean, if Frontiers ends up successful and gets iterated on, then it is Sonic. Maybe Sonic at his most vanilla and derivative, but a serious continuation of the Sonic IP.

That is the hope, that there is enough good in Frontiers to be iterated on into a stronger Sonic branded product.

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24 minutes ago, Razule said:

I mean.. being serious, yeah, Sonic Boom is an official Sonic product even if it isn't what I think Sonic should be. Sonic has been so many different things and had such varying levels of quality that it could be anything at this point. It shouldn't have gone that far, but that's where we're at. 

Maybe it shouldn't be that way then.

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8 minutes ago, Jake_LeOFFICIAL said:

I would, legit, rather die than say Sonic Boom is Sonic.

That's needlessly melodramatic.

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I think it's gonna land somewhere in the high 50s-mid 60s. Maybe high 60s-low 70s if reviewers are feeling generous.

The big judgement factor for Frontiers IMO is how well reviewers think the game measures up against other open world games on the market; which I think will be considered not enough at best, not well at all at worst. I think the game commits the mistake of trading off a lot of the series' own gameplay and aesthetic elements in its focus of (also) heavily borrowing elements from other open-world games. So it's just 'there' as an awkward experiment--another drop in the bucket for sandbox games, and another oddball outlier for Sonic games.

Beyond that, I think the presentation (graphics and music), the open world controls and customization, and the boss fights will garner consistent praise, with some (but not all) also giving additional approvals to the story/writing. Meanwhile I envision the Cyberspace levels, the combat system, and the overall jank / technical issues accompanying the game getting more mixed / negative reactions.

Spoilers for Frontiers' gameplay below in the spoiler box.

Spoiler

I think reviewers that aren't generally positive about the game will have their thoughts cemented by the open world hitting diminishing returns after the third island. Recycled level themes and music for the fourth and fifth islands (with the fifth island essentially being the first island, but restricted to a previously inaccessible area) will likely be viewed as a disappointment. Same goes for the Cyberspace levels only being four level themes, especially with three of the level themes being already (heavily) recycled levels we've already seen before in past games.

I can also see some dissonance among reviewers over the endgame/conclusion; between those who know of the "true" final boss (with its additional genre-shift phases of bullet hell shumps) locked behind the hard mode, and those that don't know and are left with the reportedly-anticlimactic QTE sequence on the easier difficulty modes.

I can overall see a sentiment of critics being somewhat mixed on whether Frontier's core foundation ultimately wins out against the rest of the game that was built on top of it. And from there, if the final result is worth the five years of wait and worth the price of admission (which crucially this time won't be a "budget" release like Forces or the previous spinoffs--Frontiers marks Sonic's return to retail as a marquee (holiday) release).

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IDK if this is the right place to put this, but SomeOrdinaryGamers gave his brief opinions on the game after getting it earlier.

Short story, he likes it, despite writing it off months earlier when the first gameplay trailer came out. Neat

 

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11 minutes ago, Milo said:

I think it's gonna land somewhere in the high 50s-mid 60s. Maybe high 60s-low 70s if reviews are feeling generous.

Eh. I will be pretty shocked if high 50s/mid-60s is the range. If Colours Ultimate can hit 74% despite it's numerous issues at launch, and the general issues Colours has baked in anyways, I feel like Frontiers hitting the 50s or so is pushing it. I'd even saw low-high 60s would be stretching it a bit.

Obviously, I have no idea how things will pan out and I could be wrong. But when we've had so much gaming press gush on and on about Frontiers up to this point, and we're talking about the same press that can be a bit more forgiving on Sonic compared to the fans (at least some outlets, depending on the project), I'd personally be putting high 60s as my minimum estimate. As long as Frontiers isn't frustratingly broken, I could see the concept of taking a new fresh take on Sonic one that might at least buy it some brownie points up towards the above average range, at least.

But High-50s/Mid-60s is Forces range, and I just sincerely have my doubts Frontiers will hit that area despite having considerably more time, effort, and higher pre-release positivity surrounding it. 

Granted, I haven't checked any of the spoilers/people who've got it earlier, and I don't intend to do anything like that til I get my hands on it on Tuesday (other than checking out a few reviews tomorrow), I'd just be shocked if Frontiers - after all the more positive word of mouth it's been getting somehow manages to shoot into Forces tier scores.

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14 minutes ago, Jake_LeOFFICIAL said:

I don't care. I hate Sonic Boom and I don't personally want it associated with Sonic anymore

Eh, as someone who's a fan of Boom (the series), you have....my sympathies.

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People need to understand the difference between liking a game and the game actually being good. You can like something and it can still be trash; the line for that gets very blurred because I feel like when people read these reviews and see low or high scores, they're misinterpreting that as what the reviewers liked versus what's actually good about the game compared to its competition. 

I'm one of the few who's been playing this game and while I am enjoying playing it and there's not much wrong with it, I also don't think its really anything special as far as video games are concerned. Like there's some potentially good Sonic shit here; Sonic controls great...but there's barely any level design to take advantage of it. So all there's left to do is just run in the overworld and do the challenges, fight the mini-bosses and Cyberspace levels...and Cyberspace is....bad, very bad. I can tolerate it for the most part, but all of the issues start showing up when you get into Cyberspace. And this is after I lost my first save file and had to redo the first two islands from scratch, and I 100% both of them again. 

So if I had to say what my thoughts were....it's fine. Nothing egregiously bad, but nothing that's gonna blow people away either. If you just want your new Sonic to go crazy over, you'll like it. Anyone expecting something revolutionary, this ain't it. 

 

At worst, it'll get somewhere in the 60's, and at best probably upper 60's/low-mid 70's.

Spoiler

In other words, it's MID

This isn't a Frontiers spoiler btw, so you can click it. 

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34 minutes ago, Jake_LeOFFICIAL said:

I don't care. I hate Sonic Boom and I don't personally want it associated with Sonic anymore

@Jovahexeon Jax Joranvexeon

But you are only talking about just the Red Button Wii U game right? The Sonic Boom show itself is by all means pretty darn excellent. 

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5 minutes ago, Sonicka said:

But you are only talking about just the Red Button Wii U game right? The Sonic Boom show itself is by all means pretty darn excellent. 

Mmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmno. I don't like any version of Boom, it makes me irrationally mad

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I think low 70s will be worst case scenario. It's a reasonably fresh and competently executed spin on a generally well-liked and easily understood genre. That alone will keep it from falling into the 60s and below, imo.

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Just now, ZinogreVolt said:

I think low 70s will be worst case scenario. It's a reasonably fresh and competently executed spin on a generally well-liked and easily understood genre. That alone will keep it from falling into the 60s and below, imo.

Personally it's the combat that is leaving the game open to going below that. Platforming is well understood, sure, but knowing what to do with every single combat encounter? I don't know if I have that much faith in the reviewers or the systems I've seen to guide their playthroughs towards easy understanding

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1 hour ago, Kuzu said:

Sonic should probably stop ripping off other successful IP's and just be Sonic. 

To be fair, even that didn’t save the GBA Sonic 1 port or Sonic 4 Episode I.

By at least some evidence, Sonic just being Sonic is hard to do.

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Honestly expecting this to get mostly 7's and 8's and maybe a few 9's I also expect some some negative reviews obviously. As for the Metacritic score I'm thinking 76 to 83.

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9 minutes ago, Scritch the Cat said:

To be fair, even that didn’t save the GBA Sonic 1 port or Sonic 4 Episode I.

By at least some evidence, Sonic just being Sonic is hard to do.

Cuz the people running him are stupid. 

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11 minutes ago, Scritch the Cat said:

To be fair, even that didn’t save the GBA Sonic 1 port or Sonic 4 Episode I.

By at least some evidence, Sonic just being Sonic is hard to do.

No, it really isn't. Or at least it shouldn't be. 

It's not hard for Mario to be Mario, or for a number of franchises to be what they set up, why is Sonic the exception?

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43 minutes ago, Jake_LeOFFICIAL said:

Mmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmno. I don't like any version of Boom, it makes me irrationally mad

I don't know what to tell you man. That's a vastly personal problem that I can't help with. 

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2 hours ago, Jake_LeOFFICIAL said:

No, it really isn't. Or at least it shouldn't be. 

It's not hard for Mario to be Mario, or for a number of franchises to be what they set up, why is Sonic the exception?

I wish I had an answer, and maybe when I learn more programming I will, but now I can only venture that it SEEMS like Sonic’s movement would be harder to program than that of slower characters.

Of course, how hard this is or is not only comprises part of the issue; another is the simple lack of ethics in companies willing to release games that are blatantly unfinished messes.  The overwhelming majority of gamers would rather a game get delayed than sold to them at full price by its original deadline but without being whole.

To go even deeper, though, it seems like the people running the show don’t prioritize some nuances that much of the fandom likes.  Even if they have the ability AND time to program in good physics, it doesn’t matter if they don’t see good physics as an important part of Sonic.  And that’s probably a big part of why they’re stuck in a situation where they can’t just be Sonic, at least not according to an older definition of what being Sonic is.  Most of the things that HAD provided these games with their challenge, depth and replay value have been stripped out in their quest to make modern Sonic gameplay as speed-centric as possible, but that has given them the burden of finding other ways to make these games challenging and satisfying, and it’s always a crapshoot whether those ways are appealing or not.

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Something something "Let Sonic Team cook, they're finally making the game they've always wanted to". Doesn't really matter what anyone thinks "makes Sonic Sonic" if Sonic Team's definition isn't as specific as whatever the fans think it is. Whether it's pinball physics, art-style, level-design, etc

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1 hour ago, Jake_LeOFFICIAL said:

No, it really isn't. Or at least it shouldn't be. 

It's not hard for Mario to be Mario, or for a number of franchises to be what they set up, why is Sonic the exception?

Mario never had a Sonic 06 disaster that completed upended everything the franchise had been building towards. And then Mario never had a second Boom disaster that financially destroyed a segment of the company.

You'll find plenty of franchises in Sonic's position but worse if you look at any Wha Happun episode. The difference is that many franchises making Sonic levels of fuck ups don't come back for decades. Sonic somehow manages to stick around.

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In my opinion, It will problably get 75/100 like Sonic Generations did. It's a solid game and it's better than Generations, but I think the cyberspace aesthetics and the fact they advertised the game as having "5 massive Islands to explore", when actually it's 4 Islands, will lower the scores a bit.

I don't think It will have a negative reception because it's exactly the same game people experienced in the demos and most casual players enjoyed.

Spoiler

Even though the last Island has the same aesthetics as Kronos, it's huge and has interesting new enemies.

I don't think Frontiers doesn't have enough content. I'm in the lasr Island and I have 27h of total playtime so far. I'm playing on hard mode, but I'm not finding the game difficult.

I highly doubt people who beat the game in under 10 hours or less have fully explored the islands, finished all the puzzles and beat all the guardians. At least not on hard mode

Furthermore, not all open World games last hundreads of hours. Sony Spiderman is open World and it's possible tô beat the story mode in under 15h in a normal playthrough.

It all depends on the genre. Action and platform games are usually shorter than RPG. We should compare Sonic Frontiers to games like Solar Ash, Gravity Rush, etc. Open World platformers. Not games like The Witcher 3 and Skyrim

 

 

 

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7 hours ago, ZinogreVolt said:

I've been told that apparently the only review codes sent out for the game were of the PS5 version. So don't expect reviews of the Xbox/PC versions or last gen machines.

Damn, I was hoping to know sooner rather than later whether the Denuvo hurts PC performance. 

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