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What would ruin Needlemouse for you?


Legendary Emerald

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Based on my previous topic, it seems many people are expecting this upcoming game to be a failure. Hell, some people are actually HOPING it is bad so that they can act high and mighty whilst saying "See? Going back to 2D was a bad idea!", while completely ignoring the fact that execution is what matters, not the dimensions used. But I digress...

What could go wrong with Needlemouse, I've asked myself. Well, quite a bit actually. But lets all share our opinions on this. What (preferably single) announcement/game breaking flaw would ruin the game in your eyes? It can be anything as simple as poor motion physics, to something more controversial like the inclusion of playable Big the Cat. Anything is game, and take the idea as seriously or humorously as you like.

Well, get to the discussion. It's not like you haven't been thinking about this since the game was first announced.

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I tend to be optimistic towards Sonic games in development. And there's not one thing that'd 'ruin ruin' Needlemouse for me but I won't deny that i'd likely feel disappointed if the Sonic in this game is the Sonic of the early-to-mid nineties design. I just don't like it in comparison to todays design. What'd be worse is if they make Sonic mute. It'd feel wrong because Sonic's been audible for too many years alongside his unique personality for sudden muteness to be anything but weird. I'm fully willing to see a Sonic whose actions speak louder than words (Like he was like in early games) but i'm too used to Sonic speaking and revealing his personality through speech TBH. If he was mute and had his actions speak louder than words, it'd be awesome if it was done as well as it was in the Night of the Werehog short.

It wouldn't ruin it for me. That'd be stupid. But it'd make me rise an eyebrow more than likely.

Edited by Verte
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I just think people are overreacting. Seriously, people wanting this game to fail are just idiots who don't like 2D Sonic. It's not like this is the root for all future Sonic games if it does well, it just means we'll probably see some more of it alongside. I think people are just blowing it all out of proportion and the people who want this to fail I don't know what is wrong with you guys, I am a person who looks forward to games that sound interesting to me, I liked some older games some newer games. Most reasons people want the game to fail are selfish, honestly. A game is a game, it's a case by case scenario. There are people who hate 3D that have been wanting this, and I know some newer fans resent them for that, but what about people like me who enjoy the franchise as a whole? Do I not deserve a good Needlemouse just because I can enjoy Sonic in 2D as well as 3D and this idea sounds exciting to me? Come up with all of the excuses you want, say retro fans have done this to you for ages, two wrongs don't make a right.

I'll take a page from ScrewAttack's recent joke list. Justin Timberlake doing the music for the game would ruin a big part of it for me.

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Hell, some people are actually HOPING it is bad so that they can act high and mighty whilst saying "See? Going back to 2D was a bad idea!", while completely ignoring the fact that execution is what matters, not the dimensions used.
Ignoring it?! That was my whole point!

Anyway, there really isn't anything special about Needlemouse; the things that can ruin it are the same as the things that can ruin any other game. Bugs, poor design, halfassed implementation...and unfortunately the series has managed to fail in just about every area at one point or another, so it's kind of hard to say what's more likely to come up this time.

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It's already ruined, lack of Tails or other characters.

But it's just a download game on systems I don't own (I wanted a PC version...) so I don't care much.

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I tend to be optimistic towards Sonic games in development. And there's not one thing that'd 'ruin ruin' Needlemouse for me but I won't deny that i'd likely feel disappointed if the Sonic in this game is the Sonic of the early-to-mid nineties design. I just don't like it in comparison to todays design.

Hear hear. The post-Unleashed design is pretty much a perfect combination of the classic and Adventure-era designs, so I'd be sad to see it go. Still, a classic-themed game demands classic Sonic, so I won't be surprised even if I am a little annoyed. It'd better not be assface Sonic, though.

"Bad gameplay" seems a little too obvious to list, so I'll say that what would really bother me is an overreliance on old locations and enemies. I'm all for a few familiar faces returning, but I'd like to see some creativity at work. It makes sense that the first few released bits of information would tug on the nostalgia strings as much as possible; I'd just like the next bit of concept art we get to be of an all-new badnik, y'know? please let it be an official Scratch badnik, pleasepleaseplease

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It's already ruined, lack of Tails or other characters.

But it's just a download game on systems I don't own (I wanted a PC version...) so I don't care much.

:\ Your sig proves itself here. Why is the game 'ruined' just because Sonic is the only playable?

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Lack of replay value. I mean, this wouldn't exactly RUIN the game for me, but even the worst Sonic game's that have been released lately have been highly replayable. I'd be pretty upset if each of the game's levels didn't give me SOMETHING to go back to, such as multiple paths, special missions, collectable items, special stages, I just want there to be something to do after beating the game rather than just playing the levels themselves. That said, if the game on it's own is simply a 45 minute to an hour romp through 7 stages with multiple acts each, I won't be upset, just a little disappointed that there's not much to do after beating the game.

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I'll be honest here. I really think that whole, " I hope this game sucks just to stick it to the 2D tyrants!" issue was blown completely out of proportions. From what I saw, nobody actually said that they HOPED for the game to fail. They just say what they would laugh at everyone who beliefs that 2D itself will fix the game and are insane about it. Just those that don't see how well it functions, not how buggy it is or etc. Just 2D = god, and smite all who disagree. Or people who are just asses about it in general. If this doesn't describe you, you shouldn't be offended. (And it doesn't group everyone in that category just because they like 2D. Because not everyone likes 2D Sonic gameplay for the same thing. It became obvious over the years.)

And how can they say that they hope the game fails, when they made it clear that they would be disappointed if it did? It was nothing but a "What would happen if it did?" moment. Not a "Oh god I hope it happens! It's on my Christmas list!" scene. If anything, they definitely understood that the dimensions don't mean crap if the game is half-assed, and said what they would do to others who enforce the dimensions of the game, with extreme prejudice, over everything.

Anyway... The only thing that could mess the game up for me is if it's half-assed. I don't care about classic or modern boundaries. If I see the Homing attack, cool. Spin dash, cool. Boost, cool. Just as long as the game is fun, sign me up. It's why I've been playing these games all these years.

Edited by YoshiUnity
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:\ Your sig proves itself here. Why is the game 'ruined' just because Sonic is the only playable?

I'm picky, I'm just more angered that if this game is good I can't play it.

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Messed up physics/controls would ruin it for me. If it's supposed to be like the classics and it doesn't feel as good as they did then it would be pretty disappointing IMO. Also even if the controls feel right, the level design has got to be up to snuff too. So my main two factors are the way Sonic feels when he's in motion and the level design.

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This is the only thing I can think of that would make me mad, but I can't really think of anything that would completely ruin the game for me.

1)If it does what Megamans doing and goes completley back to the basics, I don't mind the idea of 2D gamplay thats fine but I don't want just Sonic1 with different levels. I want a 2D game with a good story, good character personalities, and a bit of features that were introduced after the transition from 2D to 3D(preferably rail grinding, light speed dash, and maby even a boost gauge).

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If the game sucked.

Really, I don't think anything would truly ruin the game for me unless it was something extreme coupled with the game not being fun.

But to think of something that would sort of ruin it for me and not involve a bad game, it probably be lack of depth, length, and I guess if it's anything but Genesis Sonic gameplay.

I'd hate it if the game didn't have a lot going for it, preferably in terms of gameplay aesthetics. If your gonna rehash an old gameplay style, build upon it and add more. More moves for Sonic, more powerups, (i.e give meh more elemental shields plz), and more things outside normal gameplay. If the game's S3&K's gameplay copy-pasta'd into new levels, I will be disappoint. Sure it'll be fun for a while, but it would feel like they didn't even try to make it unique.

Edited by Black Spy
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Well, while most of my fears seemed to have been totally crushed already, what would ruin it for me would probably include (but aren't limited to):

-REALLY messy controls that are either too tight or too loose (and no, that is NOT what she said)

-Overly linear levels

-Sonic never shutting his mouth, and/or saying that we should run into a volcano

-Spin dash and other classic moves being totally ditched in favor for the boost

-Robotnik NOT being the last boss

That's all I got right now... but I'm sure I could think of other things :P

Edited by EXshad
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MY LIST OF SHIT THAT WOULD RUIN NEEDLEMOUSE FOR ME (but maybe not everyone else, oh how divided the fanbase is).

  • Monster of the Day. It's so, so stale now, give it up already Sonic Team. Why not try a different tack? Metroid always does well with its cadrés of one-game bosses and series stalwarts like Ridley and.. erm.. the Metroids. Oh and Dark Samus I guess. Why not try something like that? Robotnik and Metal Sonic are the series stalwarts, so they should, in their capacity as diametric opposites of Sonic and Tails, be the villains. The rest of the bosses, if we go into that, should be drones and monsters created or modified (even half the time piloted) by the bad doctor himself.
  • Pseudo-Final Fantasy plot. This is Sonic. He runs, jumps, spins, bops badniks and beats up on the bad guy across a colourful variety of zones. He has also had a crapload of bad 3D instalments and totally inappropriate plots. This is the very first new home console Sonic all in 2D in about a decade if not more, I don't want it fucking ruined by the goddamn Fanfic Brigade. You're probably going to be sated by the next big 3D instalment anyhow.
  • Voice acting. Unless Sega can find Sonic's Charles Martinet to do little noises akin to Mario's various wahoo's and it'sa me's, iconic stuff and not the annoyances they've had so far, it's just not appropriate.
  • Rock Generica. Part of why the 2D games are great are that the classic soundtracks are by and large unmarred by screaming vocals, guitar solos and themesongs. I don't see a need for them, especially in this sort of game.
  • BOOST/MegaSpeed. It's becoming increasingly clear to me that this is a cop-out used by Sonic Team and Dimps to in some way cover for their inability to cleverly design their levels; who's going to notice poor design when the whole damn thing flies by in a blur anyway? Exactly. Additionally, Unleashed and the Rush games taught me one thing above all others: that Sonic should never be "all about the speed". I didn't used to think that way of course, I was part of the speed crowd back before Unleashed was unveiled, but.. well, levels go by so quick that the only way to play and enjoy the game is to learn them by heart. That's not fun. That's not how it used to be back in the old days, back when side-on Sonic was fun Sonic. Back then it was just fine to go slow when you needed to because you were given impetus to do so by always being on the clock, the ten minute timer made sure you made your way to the end of the level on pain of death. Maybe they should bring that timer back too...
  • Endless Pit Deaths. It's bad level design, pure and simple.

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Hell, some people are actually HOPING it is bad so that they can act high and mighty whilst saying "See? Going back to 2D was a bad idea!".

Wow, that's really sad. I always thought of classic elitists as the worst,and I'm more on the classic side of the fence myself. But anyone who is (even remotely) wanting a game to fail just so they can act immature like that is definitely the worst the fanbase has to offer.

I hated every single idea that Sonic 06 ran on, but I certainly didn't want the fail to turn out to be a steaming pile...which it was.

Anyways, enough about how bad (some) of the fanbase is. I agree with wwhat speedfreak said. This is suppose to be classic, so I want good classic mechanics. If it plays like Sonic Advance 3, I'll cry.

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You know, there's not a lot of things that could ruin this game for me if it ends up being what they're shooting for. So I'm not gonna get into that.

What I would really really like to see in this game though, is no freaking save function.

I know Sonic 3 had a save, but that was for the lock-on. Sonic & Knuckles didn't use that feature.

It's most old school games, not just Sonic. I want it to be me and my lives, no chances beyond continues. It makes players want to be better at the game.

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Dr. Robotnik being called Dr. Eggman.

Anyone who was invented after 1994 appearing in the game.

Srsly tho, aside from poor gameplay, I guess the only thing that would really ruin it for me is having bland level design. Rush and Advance 2 was vastly hurt by their incredibly linear, generic level structures. I mean, in the Genesis games, one of the best parts is that not only were the levels well set up, but they were unique enough to be "characters" in themselves. Each had a different focus on different elements of platforming and they were just diverse. I want to see that return more than anything.

What I would really really like to see in this game though, is no freaking save function.

I know Sonic 3 had a save, but that was for the lock-on. Sonic & Knuckles didn't use that feature.

It's most old school games, not just Sonic. I want it to be me and my lives, no chances beyond continues. It makes players want to be better at the game.

Well, that would probably ruin it for me. As far as I'm concerned, lives should have never left the arcade. There wouldn't be a point to Galaga or Pac-Man if they went on forever, but beyond that sort of game, there are few instances where I found lives to have been implemented well. If they're not absolutely meaningless like in the 3D Mario games, they're generally frustrating. If I get up to Wing Fortress Zone, there should be no reason to have to go all the way back to fucking Emerald Hill Zone just because I died an arbitrary number of times. If getting a game over meant I simply had to restart the act, or even the zone, that would work for me. But the entire game? It's just counterintuitive to the goal of games to give a sense of accomplishment if two hours of progress suddenly goes for naught. That's not a challenge, that's an annoyance.

Edited by SuperStingray
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