Megathread Archie Sonic Main Discussion

[Ryannumber1gamer]

I think the idea of Countdown to Chaos was a good idea. My issue was Ian basically said fuck all of that. With a hard reboot, it would've meant a lot of the things that needed payoff wouldn't get it. With a soft reboot, there was still that chance of some things being paid off (For example, Mecha Sally literally could've gotten a payoff with only characters owned by SEGA). My biggest issue is Ian still squandered that chance, and we ended up with no pay offs whatsoever. Mecha Sally gets a few pages of tears and that's it. Bunnie/Antoine gets absolutely shit all other than their normal "we're always here for you" stuff, and that was it. I know Ian didn't want to do the soft reboot, but he at the very least should have done the best he could with the hand he was dealt.

 

[Celestia]

1 hour ago, Toby said:

I would have loved a hard reboot myself, but there's one thing ya gotta keep in mind though. Even if they had started back to the very beginning, classic designs were still mandated against, so they'd be telling the classic stories with the modern designs.

I'd be fine with that personally, but I'm very sure many people would have hated it.

I get the feeling that if they had done a full reboot, it wouldn't be that different in terms of the timeline. Just like what we got, all the events that we know have happened (most of the games ranging from the classics to Colours/Generations) would have occurred already, and we'd still have Sonic and co. being flung into the shattered world crisis...just without any of the memory stuff. There'd definitely be other differences too, though--in fact, I wonder how Ian would have handled the hypothetical #1 issue since it would have to function as a full on introduction to the whole comic, but yeah.

I wouldn't have minded that, but thinking about it, it's probably a good thing Ian went with the temporary memories idea. If only because it probably would have really alienated people right off the bat, even if that sort of ended up happening anyway once it was made clear the memories were only temporary.....jeez, this was a real mess, huh? At least things worked out pretty well, it's just kind of hard to look back on.

On another note, I don't think they would have started out with Sonic 1, for a lot of reasons. For example, what if a new game comes out, and Ian and/or Archie and/or SEGA wants the comic to adapt it...but they're still back in Sonic 2 times or whatever. Oops? I mean, they could do the Another Time, Another Place thing and leave it at that, but...eh.

[QuantumEdge]

17 minutes ago, Ryannumber1gamer said:

I think the idea of Countdown to Chaos was a good idea. My issue was Ian basically said fuck all of that. With a hard reboot, it would've meant a lot of the things that needed payoff wouldn't get it. With a soft reboot, there was still that chance of some things being paid off (For example, Mecha Sally literally could've gotten a payoff with only characters owned by SEGA). My biggest issue is Ian still squandered that chance, and we ended up with no pay offs whatsoever. Mecha Sally gets a few pages of tears and that's it. Bunnie/Antoine gets absolutely shit all other than their normal "we're always here for you" stuff, and that was it. I know Ian didn't want to do the soft reboot, but he at the very least should have done the best he could with the hand he was dealt.

 

As much as I enjoyed it (despite part 3 being a real let down), I always have mixed feelings coming away from it.  As you said, it never fully delivered the proper payoff we wanted.  Granted what we really wanted was never going to happen, but it never fully reached whatever potential it had.  It's why I think Ian was pretty eager to wash his hands dry from the old canon, only to be given a much softer reboot instead, which I imagine left him in a rush to think of some vague continuation from the old world.  If we were to get right down to the cause of how bumpy the transition was, I'd say it was having to rush things with the little time they had.  The reboot was never pre planned in advance, it was a creative ejector seat from a bad legal situation that was made with a lot of haste. 

[SBR2]

1 hour ago, QuantumEdge said:

My guess is that Archie likes the amount of records its cashed in with not changing the numbering.  Brings a few bragging rights to the table.  However I'm curious if they'll restart the numbering after 300.

Why does everyone keep asking for that? Resetting the Numbering is something every single comic fan hates so honestly Sonic's better off not falling down that well.

[kadybat]

20 hours ago, Destructo-Dude said:

Maybe I'm just being the guy who can't wait for the Lost World Adaption, I dunno.

My goodness I can't wait either. Ian doing that thing where he used Eclipse's use of the baby Dark Arms as basically nega-Wisps was super good foreshadowing, and I can't wait to see the comics draw Sonic in Wing and other forms. Do we know if Colors has happened in this continuity, too? Does Sonic know what Wisps are and has he used Color powers before? I can only imagine we'll find out in the adaptation.

[Zaysho]

2 minutes ago, kadybat said:

My goodness I can't wait either. Ian doing that thing where he used Eclipse's use of the baby Dark Arms as basically nega-Wisps was super good foreshadowing, and I can't wait to see the comics draw Sonic in Wing and other forms. Do we know if Colors has happened in this continuity, too? Does Sonic know what Wisps are and has he used Color powers before? I can only imagine we'll find out in the adaptation.

Yeah, #252 suggested that Colors had already happened in Sonic's flashbacks (specifically the DS version since Tails mentions Silver was around at that time).

While I'm not big on the Wisps, myself, I admit it would be interesting to see how they're incorporated in the comics. I quite dug how the Dark Arms acted, so I'd be curious how regular Wisps are treated.

[King Scoopa Koopa]

I liked Genesis and Mega Drive, though I agree that I might have liked the former a bit more if it hadn't been so firmly tied to the greater continuity and been more standalone. I like to go back to it on occasion (I should really get the trade), but that kind of takes me out of it. Same with Worlds Collide's references to the old continuity.

Renumbering after 300 could be neat, particularly if they did it to align with the new continuity, i.e. #252 or even #248 being retroactively made the new #1. Only problem would be that #300's significance would be almost immediately diminished.

[Dr. Detective]

17 hours ago, MetalSkulkBane said:

They have one thing in common: extremely simple plot of running through zones.

I would tone down a hype (which pretty much always helps) and know that ending isn't very climatic and you should enjoy it just fine. Maybe even love it.

I'm incapable of feeling hype for anything relating to Classic Sonic. 

Doesn't mean I'll hate it of course. 

[Sean]

I'd rather they had just restarted at #1 with issue 252. Now that the reboot has been going for a few years, there's not much point to it now.

[Soniman]

7 minutes ago, Sean said:

I'd rather they had just restarted at #1 with issue 252. Now that the reboot has been going for a few years, there's not much point to it now.

I like that they kept the numbering simply because It makes milestone issues mean a lot more imo and it gives the comic bragging rights

[goku262002]

4 minutes ago, Sean said:

I'd rather they had just restarted at #1 with issue 252. Now that the reboot has been going for a few years, there's not much point to it now.

Basically this, were already treading though it theirs no point now in changing the number.

[DabigRG]

8 hours ago, Ryannumber1gamer said:

I think the idea of Countdown to Chaos was a good idea. My issue was Ian basically said fuck all of that. With a hard reboot, it would've meant a lot of the things that needed payoff wouldn't get it. With a soft reboot, there was still that chance of some things being paid off (For example, Mecha Sally literally could've gotten a payoff with only characters owned by SEGA). My biggest issue is Ian still squandered that chance, and we ended up with no pay offs whatsoever. Mecha Sally gets a few pages of tears and that's it. Bunnie/Antoine gets absolutely shit all other than their normal "we're always here for you" stuff, and that was it. I know Ian didn't want to do the soft reboot, but he at the very least should have done the best he could with the hand he was dealt.

 

I personally thought that the memories thing could've been used as an interesting handwave for the Unleashed adaptation, what with Chip meeting Knuckles and learning his real name before meeting Sonic. That way, Mr. Flynn could've said Unleashed did happen but Eggman and Super Sonic's screwup cross-negated it into happening again, with the Chaos Spirit thing informing Chip of this along with his previous powers. That way, this would be another chance for Sonic and Chip to bond and experience the world, even if one doesn't fully remember it anymore. 

[DaddlerTheDalek]

I see no point in starting at #1 after #300. It's pointless.

[Your Vest Friend]

Knowing Archie's mindset, it surprises me that making every issue after #300 '#1' hasn't at least been joked about.

[TKD_Tarantino]

The problem I have with rebooting the series and starting back at number 1 is two-fold. First, I really stopped reading Marvel Comics because they continue to do this with their books and it's outrageous. What Marvel has shown is that people are more likely to buy a book that has number 1 because the perception is that it will be more valuable for the collector. My second problem is what is lost when going back to number 1. Research has shown that people, the average reader as well as the person just noticing a book for the first time will notice the high number and perceive that book as being of a higher quality that the one with the low number because of it's long run. I just think that there really is never a reason to go back to number 1 and I praise DC for going back to 935 and 958 on their Detective Comics and Action comics, respectively.

[MetalSkulkBane]

1 hour ago, TKD_Tarantino said:

The problem I have with rebooting the series and starting back at number 1 is two-fold. First, I really stopped reading Marvel Comics because they continue to do this with their books and it's outrageous. What Marvel has shown is that people are more likely to buy a book that has number 1 because the perception is that it will be more valuable for the collector. My second problem is what is lost when going back to number 1. Research has shown that people, the average reader as well as the person just noticing a book for the first time will notice the high number and perceive that book as being of a higher quality that the one with the low number because of it's long run. I just think that there really is never a reason to go back to number 1 and I praise DC for going back to 935 and 958 on their Detective Comics and Action comics, respectively.

I don't really trust those research. Bigger number can mean quality, but also tons of confsing continuity, while small number promise easy jumping point.

With that said I do hate going to number one, it's so cheap tactic to get new readers, and makes navigating through old stories confusing.

Thankfully I'm pretty sure Sonic will never do it. It's high number gives it bragging rights.

[Kfarc]

Issues' re-numbering was fun for a first time (New52 and Marvel Now respectivly). But right now it's... bleeeh. Especialy when they are doing it just for the sake of it being #1 (aka Marvel NOW2 and Mega Drive: Next Level). And Sonic isn't in the best possition for something big and world-changing events to justify an All-notnew All-notdifferent  issue 1. We're just ending SWC, a big world-bulding saga. If they were going to have #1, then it would be #252, not know. Also, they do like having the longest running, without renumbering, series on a market. Even when I wasn't folowing Archie comics,and Sonic as a whole, I remember how much noise there was and how much they were proud out of having the longest running series, based on licensed property. So no. No renumbering at #300. ESPECIALY there ('couse... milestone issue.and hundreds of variants to celebrate that)

[DabigRG]

 

 

1 hour ago, MetalSkulkBane said:

I don't really trust those research. Bigger number can mean quality, but also tons of confsing continuity, while small number promise easy jumping point.

With that said I do hate going to number one, it's so cheap tactic to get new readers, and makes navigating through old stories confusing.

Thankfully I'm pretty sure Sonic will never do it. It's high number gives it bragging rights.

Resetting to #1 is just a cheap tactic to make weak comic sales stronger!

[Dr. Detective]

So I just read through Issue 283. 

I quite enjoyed this one. It certainly wasn't anywhere near as boring as the Dark Gaia Phenoix one despite the subject matter of the issue. That one definitely felt like an inclusion done for the sake of keeping in an element from the game and not knowing where to put it. This one worried me a bit since it started off seeming as though it was going to be a run-down of everything that's happened so far but it ended up just being the call to arms for the heroes. Despite some of these characters being rather hit or miss for me, this is typically something I like to see happen. It's no Sengoku broadcasting shocking news to the Sabaody Archipelago and the world over from Marineford but it works well in its own right. I tend to worry a tiny bit about Vector considering his Sonic Channel profile states that the reason they're so poor and have to use rundown, broken TVs and such is because he's too much of a softie and often takes jobs for free on more then one occasion. Finding that balance for him sounds like a challenge. It'd be too easy to do what Free Riders did and turn him into Mr. Krabs.

Despite my enjoyment of what was happening, half-way through it I was contemplating how awesome it would be if Eggman just found out about all this anyway. And low and behold. The second half made this even better. I do so look forward to seeing how Eggman fucks them over. I know the heroes are going to still win but I want for this retaliation on Eggman's part to mean something. Please don't do this thing where he sends all these people out and it changes nothing. I don't want them to just be caught by surprise but still beat them effortlessly as though there wasn't any real need to shift how this was to go down in the first place. I'd like to see some actual set backs. It'll make the victory feel like a well fought and hard won battle.

Just having a bunch of characters fighting in a war zone is cool and all but it kind of loses it's appeal in the end when they defeat Sigma Eggman as easily as though they were swatting a fly. Good issue though.

[Your Vest Friend]

Dulcy no, why did you make the direct market sales tank sub-7k?

[DabigRG]

2 hours ago, Dr. Chaotix said:

I know the heroes are going to still win but I want for this retaliation on Eggman's part to mean something. Please don't do this thing where he sends all these people out and it changes nothing. I don't want them to just be caught by surprise but still beat them effortlessly as though there wasn't any real need to shift how this was to go down in the first place. I'd like to see some actual set backs. It'll make the victory feel like a well fought and hard won battle.

Just having a bunch of characters fighting in a war zone is cool and all but it kind of loses it's appeal in the end when they defeat Sigma Eggman as easily as though they were swatting a fly. Good issue though.

Well, if my predictions (and the implications of the solicits) are correct, you shouldn't have to worry too much.

[Ryannumber1gamer]

I can see Eggman and his crew easily countering everyone else, until Sonic barely manages to push forward, in which Eggman unleashes the Egg Dragoon as his desperation attack.

1 hour ago, VEDJ-F said:

Dulcy no, why did you make the direct market sales tank sub-7k?

I guess she just burned out fans of the comic

 

[Shadowlax]

3 hours ago, VEDJ-F said:

Dulcy no, why did you make the direct market sales tank sub-7k?

Straw that broke the camel's back. Thats all i will assume until i get more data

[Big Panda]

Mega Drive's SDCC cover:

 

[Your Vest Friend]

So the super-rare exclusive is basically stock art?