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Yeah it's only Sonic that is known for this(that's the problem), and his friends have displayed absolute distain for it(when addressed seriously). It also make Sonic sorta of a authors darling, Sonic is the savvy, funny, self aware one in a world full of eccentric animal beings and represents the voice of the reader by simply having more room to express his cocky insightful dialogue more akin to a real life teenager. Really, Sonic acts like a real world teen while the characters who are near his age are simple stereotypical cartoon attitudes playing the straight man to Sonic's humor and snappy modern comments. I'd like it if Sonic wasn't the only character like this, he seems to audience savvy to be as cartoonish as his friends, I'd want them to be as cheeky to know as Sonic too but with their own personalities distinct from him, and have him as the joke sometimes. Make Tails indirectly lampshade Sonic's faults jokingly and tease him with his water weakness with a joke about him not being fast to stay waterlogged.

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There's been multiple aspects of characters firing back and giving Sonic as good as he gives them. The "distain" is them wanting him to get serious more than anything.

Knuckles is just a very blunt and direct individual. And even then he'll shoot Sonic a few barbs, even in the games.

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6 hours ago, Razorsaw said:

There's been multiple aspects of characters firing back and giving Sonic as good as he gives them. The "distain" is them wanting him to get serious more than anything.

Knuckles is just a very blunt and direct individual. And even then he'll shoot Sonic a few barbs, even in the games.

Sonic's relatively serious when he battles something more of a challenge, but even then it's nice to have a lightened mood at all times because their pretty much as experienced as Sonic is in heroism and battles yet they have to make Sonic look quirky more than the others.

Knuckles has been sillier/fun hearted as time goes on in the games, in the comics he's moderately mature and obstinante with some few humorous barbs here and there. Again, between him and Sonic, he has to make Sonic the more entertaining of the two since Sonic becomes generic without playing off anyone. At least the comics could maintain a balance between is gruff nature and his games wacky side.

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14 hours ago, Cowardly Taylor said:

Yeah it's only Sonic that is known for this(that's the problem), and his friends have displayed absolute distain for it(when addressed seriously). It also make Sonic sorta of a authors darling, Sonic is the savvy, funny, self aware one in a world full of eccentric animal beings and represents the voice of the reader by simply having more room to express his cocky insightful dialogue more akin to a real life teenager. Really, Sonic acts like a real world teen while the characters who are near his age are simple stereotypical cartoon attitudes playing the straight man to Sonic's humor and snappy modern comments. I'd like it if Sonic wasn't the only character like this, he seems to audience savvy to be as cartoonish as his friends, I'd want them to be as cheeky to know as Sonic too but with their own personalities distinct from him, and have him as the joke sometimes. Make Tails indirectly lampshade Sonic's faults jokingly and tease him with his water weakness with a joke about him not being fast to stay waterlogged.

  • Sonic is very much not the generic teen in this scenario, he's as cartooney as everyone else. Its part of the characters appeal, everyone can find a character they can relate to. And I really wouldn't call sonic self aware either, anymore than everyone else, outside of bonus comics, he's invovled in the world as everyone else is. 
  • Like I think you think sonic is deadpool... he's not he is just a silly and invovled as everyone else is. Sometimes he makes jokes. 

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2 hours ago, Shadowlax said:
  • Sonic is very much not the generic teen in this scenario, he's as cartooney as everyone else. Its part of the characters appeal, everyone can find a character they can relate to. And I really wouldn't call sonic self aware either, anymore than everyone else, outside of bonus comics, he's invovled in the world as everyone else is. 
  • Like I think you think sonic is deadpool... he's not he is just a silly and invovled as everyone else is. Sometimes he makes jokes. 

Sonic(archie) is kind of like a teen in being he's much mentally youthful/juvenile than all the other characters and has a sharp grasp of teen related habits like playing the guitar, going on dates, pushing work off to play more, living it up(he runs to seek new thrills), acting irresponsibly reckless, and he talks like a Californian High schooler that skips class to go find a skating rink to hit on girls while passing barely to go to community college. Sonic is self aware that he knows all of his casts strengths and flaws and makes a source of savvy humor out of it that fans would get which means he mocks and teases out of being kinda meta. He's basically Peter Parker with Super Speed. Sonic knows about all memetic conventions from almost every Sonic character, next to Bean.

Only time he is cartoony as hell, if he's in a comedy based game or spinoff like Lost World or Sonic X, and famously Sonic Boom where he's exploited as a parody of himself and shares it with everyone else who share the savvy nature of the humor of their conventional tropes.

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20 minutes ago, Cowardly Taylor said:

Sonic(archie) is kind of like a teen in being he's much mentally youthful/juvenile than all the other characters and has a sharp grasp of teen related habits like playing the guitar, going on dates, pushing work off to play more, living it up(he runs to seek new thrills), acting irresponsibly reckless, and he talks like a Californian High schooler that skips class to go find a skating rink to hit on girls while passing barely to go to community college.

That isn't teen related habits... that's just a personality. Some teenagers don't do that, some teens are like amy, some teens are like knuckles having repsonsiblity thrust on themselves having to do a job they kind of feel they have to. And some are like shadow who are just going through a plethora of bullshit ( secret experiment aside). Your view of what is a teenager seems to be quite limited. All the characters are marketed that way in some regards, it isn't just sonic. Its odd you perception of teenage dom seems so limited in related to sonic , considering there were and... still are a metric shit ton of teen people who like shadow, and he's the exact opposite. Along with that he's not the only character with the character traits you have described.

You are trying to push sonic as more than he is, he's sonic an exaggerated cool character, that's it.  

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Sonic is self aware

Not in archie at least, he's as invested as everyone else, the only time he's self aware is in the bonus stuff in the back. 

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that he knows all of his casts strengths and flaws and makes a source of savvy humor out of it that fans would get which means he mocks and teases out of being kinda meta.

I think you might be thinking of sonic boom sonic.

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He's basically Peter Parker with Super Speed. Sonic knows about all memetic conventions from almost every Sonic character, next to Bean.

Peter isn't the thing you described, what you described is DEADPOOL. Peter parker makes quips because he's super affraid , and it gives him confidence, and peter parker due to his life experience, isn't fool hardy like sonic, he does danger stuff because he feels like he has to alot of the time. And given the loss and Peter's multiple trips to the darkside... he's actually a hell of a lot like knuckles or even  shadow Ironically enough. Even with out the black suit, Peter strait goes into more serious places than sonic goes to, because despite jokes, peter's a way more serious character than sonic is. And has a lot more going on with who peter is besides " he made a funny" hell the reason why he makes funnies is more complicated than sonic and comes from a completley different place, its because he was bullied and it made him feel better to laugh about it and it evovled when he became spiderman.  Peter parker exists because of bad things, and uses those things to make himself better, those is where those jokes come from, archie sonic much like game sonic... .is just kind of some asshole who wants to help people. He never personally experiences this loss or bad thing because that's not his story. Everyone else does, even tails, ( at least I believe he's supposed to be an orphan ) Sonic has yet to be through any character development to even call him peter parker. Or a lot of marvel characters because tragedy is usually the name of the game. 

Deadpool is self aware, Deadpool is making Meta jokes, Deadpool knows the strengths and weakness's of everyone because he knows he's in a comic, and he can just consult outside information ( She Hulk also Knows she is in comic book, just a quick fact, this however turns on and off depending on the story.) You are describing deadpool and sonic very much isn't deadpool even then. Even Deadpool has too much depth to even be compared to sonic. You are imagining an entire level of joke sonic gets in this comic, all he does is make a funny. That's all it is, there is no meta no larger meaning a lot of the times, he just cracks a joke because he's a basic ass character ( because he's the main character and used as a platform for other people to be interesting and they provide a comparative platform for him to be interesting ) and that's it. 

Quote

Only time he is cartoony as hell, if he's in a comedy based game or spinoff like Lost World or Sonic X, and famously Sonic Boom where he's exploited as a parody of himself and shares it with everyone else who share the savvy nature of the humor of their conventional tropes.

What you are describing is a cartooney version of him that doesn't exist in the comic, and the one that actually does exist in though isn't what you describe. 

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2 hours ago, Shadowlax said:

That isn't teen related habits... that's just a personality. Some teenagers don't do that, some teens are like amy, some teens are like knuckles having repsonsiblity thrust on themselves having to do a job they kind of feel they have to. And some are like shadow who are just going through a plethora of bullshit ( secret experiment aside). Your view of what is a teenager seems to be quite limited. All the characters are marketed that way in some regards, it isn't just sonic. Its odd you perception of teenage dom seems so limited in related to sonic , considering there were and... still are a metric shit ton of teen people who like shadow, and he's the exact opposite. Along with that he's not the only character with the character traits you have described.

Quote

Sonic has the most fundamental traits of a teen and is the most kid appealed because his basis of being cool and young over emphasizes any generic cartoon cliché he has, it's the same as Rainbow Dash from MLP:FIM and Buttercup from PPG. Shadow may have some relatable parts, but he's the a stereotypical edgy rival concept that acts like nothing of a kid that connects to them. Shadow is also based on Vegeta, a character that has a purpose in being less like the casual reader but serves as a foil to the main character who is supposed to be a straight up self insert for little boys.

You are trying to push sonic as more than he is, he's sonic an exaggerated cool character, that's it.  

Not in archie at least, he's as invested as everyone else, the only time he's self aware is in the bonus stuff in the back. 

I think you might be thinking of sonic boom sonic.

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Sonic is exaggerated parts of the modern day American teenager and maybe the cool rebel that is wish fulfillment fuel to many kids. Like the Fonz and Ferris Buller, and all have the same insightful knowledge of the worlds we fans would know. Sonic takes the piss out of his continuities and established concept with his cast and his games and cracks jokes about them to his friends and enemies, Dude knows Knuckles theme song and is savvy enough to taunt him about it.

Peter isn't the thing you described, what you described is DEADPOOL. Peter parker makes quips because he's super affraid , and it gives him confidence, and peter parker due to his life experience, isn't fool hardy like sonic, he does danger stuff because he feels like he has to alot of the time. And given the loss and Peter's multiple trips to the darkside... he's actually a hell of a lot like knuckles or even  shadow Ironically enough. Even with out the black suit, Peter strait goes into more serious places than sonic goes to, because despite jokes, peter's a way more serious character than sonic is. And has a lot more going on with who peter is besides " he made a funny" hell the reason why he makes funnies is more complicated than sonic and comes from a completley different place, its because he was bullied and it made him feel better to laugh about it and it evovled when he became spiderman.  Peter parker exists because of bad things, and uses those things to make himself better, those is where those jokes come from, archie sonic much like game sonic... .is just kind of some asshole who wants to help people. He never personally experiences this loss or bad thing because that's not his story. Everyone else does, even tails, ( at least I believe he's supposed to be an orphan ) Sonic has yet to be through any character development to even call him peter parker. Or a lot of marvel characters because tragedy is usually the name of the game. 

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Peter was cracking genre savvy jokes and wise on the uptake about anything with famous hero lampshading way before Deadpool was a idea. Peter is like Sonic, he's famous and old enough to know the parts of his narrative that are nearly commonplace knowledge and funny lampshading on a parody level. Sonic as well has experienced angst, loss, tragedy, heartbreak and tons of grief in being a hero it's just either to small to notice or Sonic has to remain a expected personality as per Sega Mandate and resets back to child pandered when a serious plotline is resolved. As for the rest, theres a lot you don't know but Peter is closer to Sonic than anything in comics, Peter in some stories has no baggage to act like a funny comedian, he does it because he's bored. That's probably because Spider-Man came first and created to wisecracking modern day hero.

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Deadpool is self aware, Deadpool is making Meta jokes, Deadpool knows the strengths and weakness's of everyone because he knows he's in a comic, and he can just consult outside information ( She Hulk also Knows she is in comic book, just a quick fact, this however turns on and off depending on the story.) You are describing deadpool and sonic very much isn't deadpool even then. Even Deadpool has too much depth to even be compared to sonic. You are imagining an entire level of joke sonic gets in this comic, all he does is make a funny. That's all it is, there is no meta no larger meaning a lot of the times, he just cracks a joke because he's a basic ass character ( because he's the main character and used as a platform for other people to be interesting and they provide a comparative platform for him to be interesting ) and that's it. 

What you are describing is a cartooney version of him that doesn't exist in the comic, and the one that actually does exist in though isn't what you describe. 

Quote

Deadpool being meta doesn't change the fact Sonic sometimes plays with the forth wall to emphasize how silly things that try to be serious aren't and mockable. Like Spider-Man(sometimes) and Deadpool, Sonic plays off the serious nature of his world to be some sort of a self perceptive protagonist that mocks the casual setting("He pretty represents the reader being Sonic in the situation) conventions(in pre genesis wave he's has quipped self aware establishment of always being right especially with Tails always following him), and even the established character personalities to stand out because he has to be edgy and cool for kids that think that sort of thing is cool.

 

Look this is just my opinion, chao.

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Having an opinion is fine, its great. But that doesn't exclude you from criticism. And you haven't really still justified your comparison to peter, acknowledge the numinous other personality traits that makes that comparison fall, apart ect. But you seem like you want to end this conversation, that's fine. Just know that when you compare a someone to one of the most famous super heroes on this planet, people have reference, and its not the easiest. 

Anyway you have a nice day. 

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Alright, so I just got Sonic Universe Issue 92 and might hype for the Chaotix has died down to a reasonable level, so I can go through everything and express what I did and didn't like a lot more clearly now. 

That said, I know this is going to sound like I have some sort of bias because I love the Chaotix but honestly, I really do think the issue of SU 92 is the best written issue of Sonic Universe I've probably ever read. At least when it comes to drudging up what I can from the folds of my memory. It might be beaten out by an issue from Eggman's Dozen or something. I can't really think back to when the comic actually managed to get across the feel of an entire group of OC animal characters in it's book so well without them being straight up villains. Questionable morality aside, usually the stray groups of animals the characters meet within the books seldom ever interest me. Sometimes they'll have a stray cool design here and there but for the most part I'm used to relegating them to background fodder.

Everyone we met in this issue was interesting, which shocked the hell out of me. The Captain shows up with an otter pun right out of the gate and a "Beggin' yer pardon?" after they ask to join the crew, to allow the levity he could provide float about the air for a bit before showing the side of him that's relatively reasonable and smart. It's impressive that the pirates backing down and allowing them to join their crew wasn't written in a way that felt silly despite a few of the jokes that sprung from it. In particular, I love the scene where he's politely asking Vector to leave the room when he's accessing the ship's control board. Because of course he would.

I'm really fond of Vector and Espio's relationship here and how it's portrayed through these panels, not just through how they react to one another but by how others react to them individually. Vector's off scouting about the ship and taking in whatever information he can while Espio's being "anti-social" until he can get some alone time with the princess to accurately explain the situation. His passion for being a man of honor makes him rather stubborn of course and because Vector's the one whose often shown to be the quick thinker (not just here but even in the games) he defuses the situation and gets them to join. Espio protests without really giving it much thought until Vector lays it into him that he's the boss and that he knows what he's doing, which brilliantly does show an elegant contrast between their personalities. But it concludes by ultimately showcasing that Espio does have more respect for Vector as the boss at the end of the day.

I also think it's really cute how Opal and Charmy get along. Just randomly talking about how cereal with raisins is disgusting and how they introduce each other so nonchalantly. It's great. I do also like how people react to what Charmy says. They aren't making comments about how the thing he says is stupid. They either have something to bounce off of it or they take it at face value. No one cracks a joke about how being good at pouring cereal isn't cooking. Opal just says "Oh yeah, cereal with raisins is gross". I really appreciate that. 

The princess, or Deena, was also something I didn't expect. Not even just by the way she talked but her attitude towards the whole situation. It's one thing to be totally aloof and chipper about your kidnapping, as I've seen that before, but to then make this really sinister looking face when explaining how much of a lucky "coincidence" it is that things are going great puts a new layer on it that saw to myself not even sure of what she was doing, despite being able to wager a pretty good guess. But the important thing is, it carried across in a way that was more intriguing rather then unabashedly obvious.

The pacing is really well done too. We managed to have plenty of conversations throughout with several different characters without it feeling rushed at all. Razor's situation with his sibling came across well and I understood the merit behind why he left and why it's awkward that he's back without it needing to be shoved in my face. Dive... I'm not even sure what to make of that scene with him. I liked it though. I think it's good to have a character with a young, soft looking design suddenly go glassy-eyed and creepy looking when staring at the ocean.

However, the best part for me would have to be the way the issue wraps up at the end. All of them are heading for bed, there's a cute conversation about who snores or not followed by Espio's line of concern and it ends with Vector overlooking Charmy as he asks his boss if it'd be okay to be a detective again should the pirate thing get boring. And the last page isn't some full page spread reveal of a villain but a nicely drawn visual of the back of the ship as they're about to embark on the next part of their adventure.

Despite all the characters and their histories clashing here, it still does feel like a story that's actually about the Chaotix. It's not using them as promotion for the book, having them saunter about for a bit for the first two issues, and then basically shifting it's narrative towards being only about the person they came to rescue... so far. After all this is only the second issue. In the third it could very well do that but it doesn't feel like it at the moment. Chaotix Quest felt odd from the start, as the central conflict and the way they were being put forth in the issue made it feel more like they were just mercenaries in a group of other mercenaries that didn't happen to be led by Sonic or Knuckles this time. It didn't really take much advantage of their personalities and didn't use who they were to great effect. I only really remember Vector being the one to manage a good line or two and even then the only other one I can remember is the forced Computer Room joke that I hate. Bring back "Who's this broad?" please? That line is far funnier and it also has the added benefit of being a legit cool thing for him to say. 

I'm enjoying this greatly though. I don't know if the story feels like it has more air to breathe because the pressure of hastily setting things up for the Unleashed adaption is gone but I'm really digging this. 

Also, these faces. I dunno why, but Charmy's just making faces at random points and it's cracking me up.

Charmy_face_01.png

 

Charmy_face_02.png

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Forgot to mention today that I got Genesis of a Hero Part 2.

Spoiler

To be honest it was underwhelming, like, really underwhelming. Sonic got to interact with Snively, sure but it's just the end of Sonic 2 (Sky Chase, Wing Fortress and Death Egg [Ends with the Final Boss Rising from the ground]), nothing else, nothing to build onto what the ending of part 1 started. For an arc about the past of this world, something a lot of people like me want to know about, it's not answering a lot of questions, and more just stalling till the next arc.

 

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I wasn't really expecting all that much from it other than establishing the beginning of the new continuity, quite frankly. I mean, given that we all know the entire Classic era like the back of our hand, and this was a retake of that with new elements...what else would you have expected? I mean, if you were looking for more world-building, I can get that, but I couldn't see anything else beyond that.

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Is it just me or is Tails really getting some kind of an panic attack in that preview? Around the part biplane got hit, he starts to repeat that "I can fix it" like a mantra or something... it also makes me think of Fix-It Felix for some reason...

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8 hours ago, therealfalconpawnch77 said:

Forgot to mention today that I got Genesis of a Hero Part 2.

  Hide contents

To be honest it was underwhelming, like, really underwhelming. Sonic got to interact with Snively, sure but it's just the end of Sonic 2 (Sky Chase, Wing Fortress and Death Egg [Ends with the Final Boss Rising from the ground]), nothing else, nothing to build onto what the ending of part 1 started. For an arc about the past of this world, something a lot of people like me want to know about, it's not answering a lot of questions, and more just stalling till the next arc.

 

Genesis of a Hero looked like filler from the start. Trying to blend a game adaption in with the comics' original material with only 20 pages to spare comes at a price.

Spoiler

Did the FF show up in the issue at all? Rotor said something about disabling traps before, though I have a feeling they won't serve much of a purpose in #290-#291 (could be wrong).

 

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I finally got my hands on one of Tomy's comic packs today, specifically, the Mecha Madness one. Exactly like I predicted, it's just the Mecha Madness story and nothing else. The last two pages consist of the now-out of date advertisement for Wings of Fire and Eggman's Dozen, and an ad for the Sonic Boom toy line. The back page has an ad for Sonic on the Archie App.

Also the cover is printed with a random black boarder around it.

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^ Well, to be honest that was the most likely outcome due to all of these licensing thingies and all. I suppose it's even kind of accomplishment to have even this piece with the merchandise at all... But that cover feels a bit bummer. I suppose they didn't want to put into it any more money they'd feel necessary. Hope the print quality was decent at least. :D

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3 hours ago, Ernest-Panda said:

I finally got my hands on one of Tomy's comic packs today, specifically, the Mecha Madness one. Exactly like I predicted, it's just the Mecha Madness story and nothing else. The last two pages consist of the now-out of date advertisement for Wings of Fire and Eggman's Dozen, and an ad for the Sonic Boom toy line. The back page has an ad for Sonic on the Archie App.

Also the cover is printed with a random black boarder around it.

any changes from the original print comic?

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So I got #289.

It's a comic retelling of Sonic 2 from Wing Fortress to the final boss. The only major deviation is that Snively is there, but even with his addition it plays out the same way. It also has a non-ending, with the Death Egg Robo looming over Sonic and the comic telling you to play Sonic 2 to find out how the game ends.

Ironically the pre-story blurb suggests that Sonic was with the FFs to liberate the zones up to Metropolis, which deviates more than anything on-panel.

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14 minutes ago, Ernest-Panda said:

Wait how do they have differing designs?

Sonic Genesis used Death Egg Robot based on Sonic 2. "Genesis of Hero" based his on Generations.

Anyway, 289 has all the problems 288 only even more glaring. I don't feel like wasting my breath repeating myself, there is barely anything to talk about anyway.

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