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4 minutes ago, Dash Speed said:

The worlds collide stuff where he btfo'd every robot master in quick succession, and even megaman? Who Rock was somehow was keeping up with robot master versions of Shadow and Silver, which means Sonic is stronger than Sonic and Silver by proxy of being showing superior to Rock? And before that, theirs the chaos force thing that allows him to have a bigger chance of tacking on Enerjak and Silver at full power with his super form. 

 

Might wanna proofread your stuff just to make sure your sentences are properly conveying, but think I get the gist.

I haven't read World's Collide in a while, but he is named Sonic the Hedgehog for a reason. He simply outmaneuver'd most of the Robot Masters("You're quick, Quickman...but you're not fast!") and left actually beating the Roboticized Masters to Megaman, from what I remember.

Don't remember him using Super Sonic against Silver, though, but that was the only way he stood a real chance of fighting Knuckle-jak, who could only be truly beaten by Locke breaking the hex. I'd also like to point out that Shadow's Chaos Blast was one of the only things shown to remotely budge him.

 

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1 hour ago, DabigRG said:

Might wanna proofread your stuff just to make sure your sentences are properly conveying, but think I get the gist.

I haven't read World's Collide in a while, but he is named Sonic the Hedgehog for a reason. He simply outmaneuver'd most of the Robot Masters("You're quick, Quickman...but you're not fast!") and left actually beating the Roboticized Masters to Megaman, from what I remember.

Don't remember him using Super Sonic against Silver, though, but that was the only way he stood a real chance of fighting Knuckle-jak, who could only be truly beaten by Locke breaking the hex. I'd also like to point out that Shadow's Chaos Blast was one of the only things shown to remotely budge him.

 

Sonic being the whole "One Man army" type in the crossover over Shadow and Silver(who literally have better powers for that sort of job) is what I'm concerned about, even if it's his comicbook series and he's the main lead, you don't discredit them and leave them to dry for Sonic's benefit, it shows that no one but Sonic can shine in battle that makes him unbeatable if not more involved in a storyline where his actions overlap others including the fights. Shadow never got his necromunda or destiny arc moment of power like Knuckles did, he never got to beat his own doppleganger, and fight literally demi gods on equal grounds and still won like Sonic did. Shadow barely held his own against Blaze who he should be stronger than. Him phasing Enerjak or scratching Adam isn't what I call a moment of him being show a powerful force like Sonic and Kncukles. He remained roughly equal but he was never like his game self while he may have rivaled Sonic and Knuckles in their respective abilites, he was a higher level than him in his own specialty besides speed and strength(Knuckles had the things that made Shadow a legit unique character from Sonic as a threat but much more powerful), then you found out all the main cast with chaos energy abilites had the same level for chaos control like Shadow did but somehow possessed more mastery and potential for it than he did.

Sonic somehow equals Shadow and Silver regardless in being as powerful as they are when he uses just his speed which can pretty much do anything short of warping reality. Sonic kicked Silvers ass, he more or less easily equals Shadow constantly and casually and has little trouble fighting him even grinning while exchanging blows, and his in his base he can still travel fast enough to cross universes with going super sonic.

And Super Sonic is Sonic using the seven Chaos Emeralds, so, naturally, he can produce a Chaos Control powerful enough to rewrite the entirety of the Sonic and Mega Man multiverse on the same level. Shadow has never come close to being that strong as a character in his super form.

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1 hour ago, Dash Speed said:

And Super Sonic is Sonic using the seven Chaos Emeralds, so, naturally, he can produce a Chaos Control powerful enough to rewrite the entirety of the Sonic and Mega Man multiverse on the same level. Shadow has never come close to being that strong as a character in his super form.

 

Well that's not entirely accurate. It not like Sonic just pulled a Genesis Wave out of his back pocket on a whim. Although it feels like he could lol, each time Sonic did use Chaos Control to rewrite reality, it was in the aftermath of one of Eggman's waves, which as we know made time and space completely unstable. Sonic wasn't rewriting reality so much as putting back together the busted puzzle pieces.

Shadow has done a few things to rival that. In his Super State, Shadow was able to rip open a portal to the Special Zone in the battle against Adam, which by definition is a zone that exists beyond the normal realm of reality.

Even in his base form, Shadow has shown the ability to breech dimensional barriers - without a need to access the the cosmic interstate or even a Genesis portal.

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22 minutes ago, Sega DogTagz said:

Even in his base form, Shadow has shown the ability to breech dimensional barriers - without a need to access the the cosmic interstate or even a Genesis portal.

Case in point: Chaos Controlling himself (and Metal) into the last issue of Sonic X of all things. I thought that was pretty impressive, and resulted in an understated send-off for an underplayed spin-off.

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2 hours ago, Cuz said:

Case in point: Chaos Controlling himself (and Metal) into the last issue of Sonic X of all things. I thought that was pretty impressive, and resulted in an understated send-off for an underplayed spin-off.

Later in that same scuffle, Shadow Chaos Controled himself and Metal into Blaze's world - which is all sorts of crazy.

Shadow also Chaos Controls in and out of the special zone a couple of times - once right in front of Fiest who was powerless to stop him from getting away. Even Hope had issues building a stable portal to the special zone. Shadow does it at the drop of a hat.

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On 7/14/2018 at 2:36 PM, Ernest-Panda said:

“I think the implication was that SA2 happened off-screen*

...have you all just flat out forgotten that the flashback story in Sonic Universe #2 was a thing?

On 7/14/2018 at 4:59 PM, Cuz said:

Yeah.... something like 8 years after the fact. Silvereye's tackling this stuff in order, won't get there for a looong time.

Pretty much. I'm going very slowly due to being busy and really only reading the comic in bursts when I'm in the mood to do so.

I actually can't wait to hit Sonic Universe, I really like the idea of it and from the sounds of it, some interesting stories come out of it. The Flynn era in general sounds promising, even if ofcourse it has its low points, including this House of Cards story everyone loves to argue about. 😛

Coincidentally, I've been really getting into the Mega Man franchise in the last couple of months, and actually wound up reading through the Archie comic of it when I remember that Flynn had worked on it too. I actually really loved the comic, even if it had a couple of duff stories. I skipped the Sonic crossovers because I'd rather read them when I hit them in the Sonic timeline. So if Flynn's era of Sonic is as good as his Mega Man work, I think I'm in for a good time.

I must admit though, I don't think the Penders era has been atrociously bad, even at its worst, at least in terms of writing. I dunno, I think maybe it's because I'm getting into this after it's all over, and that perhaps my standards aren't high. (I think the IDW run so far has been pretty good, but alot of fans seem to be having alot of various issues with it.) Honestly, I find alot of it a bit more goofy, rather than outright awful, like the weird focus on love triangles, and the way the comic can try and be overly serious, and seems to love killing off secondary characters at times.

Will need to read issues #152-#159 to reach the end of the Penders era, may do that tonight. See if any last batshit things happen before he departs.

 

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Alright, reading on:

#152: When #151 ended, with the real Sonic encountering the girls being flirty to them after Evil Sonic's schenanigans, I just assumed it was a joke that would return to the status quo. I was actually surprised when it turned out, this thing of Sonic and the girls is still going. Hell, the cover art of Sonic surrounded by the girls being judgemental with the caption "play on playa"(!?) seems again to go with this idea that apparently the sexual antics of Sonic is what they think people buy the comic for? The plot is fairly simple, ADAM decides to basically use nanomachines to take over the planet, Sonic and co stop him while Sonic is teamed up with girls while they wander why Sonic isn't coming on to them.

Some misdirects in this issue. The cover features Rouge, when she isn't in the issue. The opening has The Wolf Pack turning up after what feels like a bit of an absence, only for them to run away from the nanomachines and then disappear. Even the issue story being called "Sonic's Angels" and the hint of Sonic having *shudders* sexual tension with the various girls doesn't feel like it goes anywhere, except at the end when Sonic saves Bunnie and she kisses him... which Sonic doesn't seem to mind? Also Snively is back and maybe an ally... yay?

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One thing that I get more and more with Penders writing is that I don't think his writing style gels well with Sonic. I don't think he writes in a very interesting way, lots of exposition, and it never feels like he is writing for kids. It comes across like a teenager trying to write smart stuff for an adult audience in a children's comic. I noticed this a bit in the Knuckles comic, but it definetly feels like in this issue as an example when the dialogue can come across as very dry and dull, without much wit, and very overblown emotional sentences combined with lots of flat exposition.

Jon Gray is the artist again, and again, not a huge fan of his artwork. It really doesn't mesh well with the other regular artists for the comic at the time, and it's noticable how everyone's faces and body structures keep changing dramatically. Again, maybe on another series his artwork would work really well, but hear, I don't think it does. He also seems to always manage to make Sally look like the biggest bitch in the world when she chews Sonic out for being late. Also, kindof random, but can someone explain to me why the stars and stripes are in the background of this page?

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#153: Not much to talk about with this one. Start of a 2 parter, Eggman hires Nack the Weasal to assassinate Mina the Mongoose because he hates her music. Pretty nice goofy plot, the sort of shit I could imagine the Eggman from Sonic Boom could do, but we get lots of over dramatic dialogue and angst inbetween, with Antoine becoming cold hearted because of the war, Fiona bitching at Sonic for Evil Sonic trying to hit on her in #150, and Mina's boyfriend Ash intent on a pissing contest with Sonic.

I do find the Antoine thing interesting, since #151 revealed that the Antoines have been reversed, with evil Antoine in this universe and vice versa, with more hints at it about his behaviour. Kindof interested to see how this goes eventually, especially with Bunnie. It's sort of weird how prominent Fiona has become, I mean I know she has been in the comic for a very long time but it is a little odd how out of nowhere she is basically a regular. The way she talks about Sonic being a jackass in #150 is just so weird to me. The plot of #150 has Sonic's evil lookalike crossing universes just to get laid, which I think is a goofy plot, probably too mature for a Sonic comic. Yet reading this you'd think this was some bad soap opera plot. The whole thing with Mina and Ash bugs me too, I thought we settled the Mina plot back in #123, which was dedicated to resolving the Sonic/Mina/Sally triangle, and that Ash was to basically marry Mina away, not just for more relationship drama.

I will say my favourite thing about #153 is the B story where Aunt Rosie tells a short story about Pirate Sally having to rescue a stolen tail from Tails from Wizard Robotnik. I love the artwork, it feels like a callback to the Sonic comics from before #50.

#154: Second half of the story, not much to say really. Ash breaks up with Mina because he thinks Mina still loves Sonic and secretly writes all her songs about him, fight ensures against Heavy and Bomb, Ash sacrifices himself with the last bomb to save Mina, in hospital Ash and Mina reconciliate while Sonic walks off sad like a bad soap opera. I don't mind the plot, it is pretty simple, and I do like how Eggman can be so petty to try and kill Mina over music, but the excuse just to engage in more love trianges and angst is what gets to me.

B plot is pretty unremarkable, about following up on the nanites from #152, which winds up giving Tommy the Turtle wings. I find it interesting how much they are pushing Tommy, I think I read in a past issue from letters apparently alot of fans like him, which might be why he is becoming more of a main character at the moment.

 

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Sorry for the multi posts, but my browser has a habit of crashing, and I want to make sure I don't have to lose all this writing.

#155: Oh dear. This cover. I actually knew of this comic cover from a while back in Cybershell's Archie comics retrospective where he showed an image of it about talking about the comic's decline before Penders was fired. Seeing it again, good lord. In a way, it's a nice shorthand to show how much the comic was too interested in angst and unneccessary romance. Makes you wonder if that cover alone may of concerned someone high up in Archie or played a role in Penders exit from Archie.

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You know, again, I actually like the plot of this 2 part story in theory. Evil Antoine basically tries to become King by slowly poisoning King Max and rising to royalty by being forcibly married to Sally. I like how competant Evil Antoine is, able to best Sonic in a fight, and has a plan that makes sense. Its just, again, this is an excuse for more angst and relationship conflicts.

Sonic really has become a bit of a womaniser in these last few issues, with him having him hook up with Fiona at the start of this issue, much to Tails' shock, in this awful artwork.

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However, when King Max wants Sally to succeed him, and must get married, Sonic decides he has to find a way to stop it? It honestly makes Sonic look like a bit of a dick for hooking up with another girl, and then immedietly wanting to go back to Sally, especially when after this plot is over in #156, Sonic goes back to Fiona over Sally. Speaking of #156...

#156: Oh god...

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OH GOD

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#156 sees Sonic try and stop the wedding, is too late, reenacts the Graduate, and gets help from Prince Elias. I must admit, it is cool seeing Elias again, he is probably the best part of Sally's family, and it makes sense for him to come back and bait Antoine into revealing his intentions. We get the real Antoine back and him and Bunnie get back together again, which is pretty nice, they are probably the best couple in the comic, especially with Sonic being a womanising douchebag apparently as he hooks up with the girl he knew his best friend had a crush on.

This had potential to be good, but ultimately the fact that Sonic comes off really badly by wanting to prevent Sally's wedding but not wanting to be with Sally herself hurts the story tremendously, as well as basically betraying Tails. Again, if this didn't have such bad angst, this could of been a good little story, especially when I think Evil Antoine actually is a good villian and a nice counterpart to the very rash Evil Sonic.

There is also a 2 part Dulcy story in #155 and #156. It's pretty basic, it's about Dulcy's backstory, about her being exiled, and then having to redeem herself when Eggman's roboticised dragons attack. Really, the only 2 notable things about this is the fact that dragons go through a cycle of reincarnation, basically to excuse the fact that Dulcy and the other dragons wind up melting all the roboticised dragons. Sucks to be every other species I guess. The other bit is the bizarre decision to reference Dulcy's abusive boyfriend from 50 issues, like anyone wanted that idiotic issue to be brought up again.

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3 hours ago, silvereye27 said:

Alright, reading on:

#152: When #151 ended, with the real Sonic encountering the girls being flirty to them after Evil Sonic's shenanigans, I just assumed it was a joke that would return to the status quo. I was actually surprised when it turned out, this thing of Sonic and the girls is still going. Hell, the cover art of Sonic surrounded by the girls being judgemental with the caption "play on playa"(!?) seems again to go with this idea that apparently the sexual antics of Sonic is what they think people buy the comic for?

I tend to forget that cover was 152. It just perfectly represents 150's story so well that I get them turned around.😅

Quote

Also, kind of random, but can someone explain to me why the stars and stripes are in the background of this page?

How have I never noticed this before! I've taken note of the stars but never put the two panels together. o_O

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One thing that I get more and more with Penders writing is that I don't think his writing style gels well with Sonic. I don't think he writes in a very interesting way, lots of exposition, and it never feels like he is writing for kids. It comes across like a teenager trying to write smart stuff for an adult audience in a children's comic.

 Part of me actually prefers exposition heavy writing to the extreme alternative when things get too quippy. Also, that Ken is still heavily borrowing from SatAM in writing Sonic, even this late into the comic's history, really sticks out here.

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how much they are pushing Tommy, I think I read in a past issue from letters apparently alot of fans like him, which might be why he is becoming more of a main character at the moment.

Interesting, I usually associate Tommy with a lot of hate. If people remember him it's usually as another one in a long line of brain trust members. The amount of times he gets killed-off and unkilled-off doesn't help.

Otherwise I kind of like the idea of Sonic as Knothole's most eligible bachelor after "The Slap", but 150 just creates a whole mess of pitfalls with that concept.

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8 hours ago, Cuz said:

Part of me actually prefers exposition heavy writing to the extreme alternative when things get too quippy. Also, that Ken is still heavily borrowing from SatAM in writing Sonic, even this late into the comic's history, really sticks out here. 

Interesting, I usually associate Tommy with a lot of hate. If people remember him it's usually as another one in a long line of brain trust members. The amount of times he gets killed-off and unkilled-off doesn't help.

Otherwise I kind of like the idea of Sonic as Knothole's most eligible bachelor after "The Slap", but 150 just creates a whole mess of pitfalls with that concept.

I sortof agree, I'm not a fan of writers like Joss Whedon and Steven Moffat whose characters often seemingly do nothing but quip at each and always have witty put downs for everyone. I don't hate Penders writing, I just think it is noticable for what is meant to be a comic for kids. And you are right, that whole nanites thing definetly seems like something from SATAM.

I'm not sure what to think of Sonic being a bachelor. I mean, I guess it fits his character type, I could see Sonic in a more mature setting being the type who goes around having 1 night stands. I just don't think it really works in a comic meant for kids, and especially when we've been setting up since the very beginning that him and Sally are probably going to wind up together anyway. I wonder if Penders was inspired by James Bond for it considering how much he likes to reference Bond in the comic.

8 hours ago, Conquering Storm’s Servant said:

It’s more interesting to note that people didn’t like Tommy under Pender’s run, but when he came back later and then Ian came aboard and worked on him up to his death the reception sort of changed.

That's interesting. I can't say I have any strong feelings about Tommy, he's just kindof there for me.

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13 hours ago, Conquering Storm’s Servant said:

It’s more interesting to note that people didn’t like Tommy under Pender’s run, but when he came back later and then Ian came aboard and worked on him up to his death the reception sort of changed.

His original was apparently also very well liked when it came out, hence why they decided to bring him back later.

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4 hours ago, silvereye27 said:

I wonder if Penders was inspired by James Bond for it considering how much he likes to reference Bond in the comic.

Actually...

That brought to my mind, has anyone else thought how similar Sir Connery sounds to Sean Connery?

I just can't say Sir Connery out loud anymore without wondering how silly it sounds...

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5 hours ago, silvereye27 said:

I'm not sure what to think of Sonic being a bachelor. I mean, I guess it fits his character type, I could see Sonic in a more mature setting being the type who goes around having 1 night stands. I just don't think it really works in a comic meant for kids, and especially when we've been setting up since the very beginning that him and Sally are probably going to wind up together anyway. I wonder if Penders was inspired by James Bond for it considering how much he likes to reference Bond in the comic.

 

I echo that. In most iterations, Sonic is something of a ladies man. In almost every representation, he's had some kind of active connection to the fairer sex. Even in his concept days within Sega, they tried to push the idea of Madonna being a female interest. Then when that fizzled out, Tiara came into focus sometime later. In Satam, Sally was the most desirable - thus connected to him. In AoSTH Sonic is nothing short of a horndog and you can rattle off females he's shown interest in left and right. The Archie comics threw Sally, Mina, Bunnie and Fiona at him, and the IDW run makes it pretty clear that Sonic is in demand with all the ladies who wish they could have him.

and all that is before you even consider Amy. Or the shiptease's with Blaze, or any of the ump-teen innuendos Rouge throws at him.

 

I really don't mind the idea of Sonic being seen as a bachelor. Anyone with his level of fame would understandably attain that kind of following. Its just more important about how it is presented to the viewer. Sonic can be a jerk sometimes, but he isn't the type to take advantage of people - and leveraging his fame and good deeds to plow half the countryside seems like an exploitation of their good will and trust. I almost expect Sonic to flirt with a pretty girl, its part of who he is and feeds his cool persona, but I also expect him to recognize when someone is star-crossed and know when to keep it in his pants.

 

...on a slightly unrelated note, that's probably one of the reasons why I feel like the Sonic/Blaze dynamic works. You don't have to worry about that particular speedbump.

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 Based on Rivals. And Treasure Team Tango. Shouldn't shadow be the "the play hard to get" player of the series? 

But he isn't the type to take advantage of people

he kinda did that when fighting shadow and putting thoughts of shame in him by exploiting his past to keep him from killing fake eggman.

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At this time in the book Shadow’s still very hung up on Maria that I’d imagine it gets in the way of some romantic subplots. Right now he’s following Hope around like a lost puppy. Otherwise sure It’s just much in Shadow's character as Sonic.

I’ve often wished the games gave him a little more time with Amy so they could explore the whole “ hey, thanks for talking me out of my burn the world that took Maria from me phase”.

I mean not as romantic subplot necessary, this is Amy after all, but that always felt like a loose plot thread a good character writer would capitalize on.

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1 hour ago, Sega DogTagz said:

I really don't mind the idea of Sonic being seen as a bachelor. Anyone with his level of fame would understandably attain that kind of following. Its just more important about how it is presented to the viewer. Sonic can be a jerk sometimes, but he isn't the type to take advantage of people - and leveraging his fame and good deeds to plow half the countryside seems like an exploitation of their good will and trust. I almost expect Sonic to flirt with a pretty girl, its part of who he is and feeds his cool persona, but I also expect him to recognize when someone is star-crossed and know when to keep it in his pants. 

Excellent way of putting it really. It's why #155-#156 doesn't work for me, Sonic takes the girl he knew Tails had a massive crush on, goes after Sally when he finds out she is about to go off the market, and then when the plot is over, goes back to Fiona knowing that Sally is single and presumably will only go and try and get Sally when he feels like it. All with Penders writing Sonic as being the victim, when in reality he is acting like a chauvinist asshole.

I think you put it pretty perfectly. Sonic is a free kindof guy, someone who likes to go on adventures, and I think would happily be up for some fun with an attractive lassie he may encounter in his adventures. I think Sonic as a bachelor is fine when there isn't any sleaze or manipulation to it. To me, Sonic isn't the type of guy who would seek out one night stands (or shall we say one night make out sessions, since this is a kid's franchise?). Rather, I think Sonic would just happily engage in that kind of thing if ever came across it. (Granted, Adventures of Sonic Sonic may of been a horndog, but then I think that was more the case of him being like a Looney Tunes or Animaniacs kind of character in that show.)

So if the IDW Sonic was ever like that, the way you describe, I think that would work, although I'm not too sure how to handle it when it came to main girls like Blaze, Rouge, etc. The whole bachelor thing probably works better with 1 issue characters who are never seen again, maybe not with regulars who then have their history of having past experience with Sonic. But I think you could get away with it, even if it is just something like a "thank you for saving me" kiss like Bunnie gives Sonic in #152.

I suppose the issue with Archie Sonic is the whole thing with Sally, since Sonic is interested in her, unlike game or IDW Sonic where Amy's affections are one sided. I just don't think it works, although from what I understand Sega had Archie drop the Sonic and Sally love thing entirely, and that apparently it is implied that Sally and Nicole are meant to be an item, which is fascinating to me, at least from where I am in the comic right now.

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15 minutes ago, Cuz said:

At this time in the book Shadow’s still very hung up on Maria that I’d imagine it gets in the way of some romantic subplots. Right now he’s following Hope around like a lost puppy. Otherwise sure It’s just much in Shadow as Sonic. 

Don't you just love how he lost a twelve year old 50 years ago, then became intrigued by her fourteen year old niece?

 

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2 hours ago, Dash Speed said:

he kinda did that when fighting shadow and putting thoughts of shame in him by exploiting his past to keep him from killing fake eggman.

 

a.) It a completely different situation when there is literally a life on the line

 

b.) That is taking advantage of someone in a completely different context. Its not even comparable.

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I just read the last Penders story, #157-#159. And honestly, I don't have much to say about it. I think it's OK, basically the plot concerns a scheme against Eggman, where a massive army of Metal Sonics attack Eggman, then wind up attacking everyone else. Turns out, they were created by Charles under royal orders when Sonic was thought dead, deactivated and then reactivated by... someone? To be honest, I get a bit lost as to why the robots were reactivated, by whom, and why they go haywire and start attacking Knothole when they were originally designed to protect it. Maybe I'm just being a bit thick, but I don't think the comic is terribly clear about it.

Still, it leads to a nice plot where Eggman is at threat, and we get Shadow back, this time being far more in character than he was the last time we saw him. Nothing to much else to say really, no real angst or anything thankfully, the most notable part is Sonic's mum getting a lot of screentime being concerned about her son's safety, which I actually think is a nice touch. Otherwise, a pretty unremarkable end for the Penders era.

I think the most ironic part is the B story in #158, which is an Off Panel story, which is about someone sabotaging the Sonic comic by showing various outtakes, but with Sonic and an editor to reply about how succesful the comic is doing. Just seems a little ironic when Archie would very shortly fire Penders, at least to me.

I do agree that certainly so far, #126-#159(ish) is probably the weakest era of the comic so far. It does feel a bit tired, the plot point of Sonic going to space only to come back to Mobius where things have changed did seem to change alot of things for the worst, and seemed like an excuse to ramp up the angst and relationship drama. Not to mention, as it's been talked about on other threads, it does feel obvious that Penders wasn't interested in keeping any kind of influence from the games, and it does mean that the comic feels very divorced tonally from what the games were doing, especially in regards to Shadow being quite different from his game counterpart.

I can't say I really hate any of it though. Again, I do think my standards are a bit lower than other fans, if judging from people's reviews of the recent IDW series is anything to go by, and getting into this after the Archie era has ended has meant that I don't have the same kind of investment in this comic that people would of had when it was still running. But still, this has been substandard, and compared to the kind of highs that I feel were achieved in issues #30-#50, it does feel like a low point, and a new head is required after Penders has been in charge for such a while now.

Anyway, I'm excited to enter the Flynn era. I'm actually reading #160 while I type this, and boy, already is it an improvement. The art hasn't been this good for a long while, and Flynn's writing is such a drastic improvement. This should be fun.

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4 hours ago, silvereye27 said:

Excellent way of putting it really. It's why #155-#156 doesn't work for me, Sonic takes the girl he knew Tails had a massive crush on, goes after Sally when he finds out she is about to go off the market, and then when the plot is over, goes back to Fiona knowing that Sally is single and presumably will only go and try and get Sally when he feels like it. All with Penders writing Sonic as being the victim, when in reality he is acting like a chauvinist asshole.

I think you put it pretty perfectly. Sonic is a free kindof guy, someone who likes to go on adventures, and I think would happily be up for some fun with an attractive lassie he may encounter in his adventures. I think Sonic as a bachelor is fine when there isn't any sleaze or manipulation to it. To me, Sonic isn't the type of guy who would seek out one night stands (or shall we say one night make out sessions, since this is a kid's franchise?). Rather, I think Sonic would just happily engage in that kind of thing if ever came across it. (Granted, Adventures of Sonic Sonic may of been a horndog, but then I think that was more the case of him being like a Looney Tunes or Animaniacs kind of character in that show.)

So if the IDW Sonic was ever like that, the way you describe, I think that would work, although I'm not too sure how to handle it when it came to main girls like Blaze, Rouge, etc. The whole bachelor thing probably works better with 1 issue characters who are never seen again, maybe not with regulars who then have their history of having past experience with Sonic. But I think you could get away with it, even if it is just something like a "thank you for saving me" kiss like Bunnie gives Sonic in #152.

I suppose the issue with Archie Sonic is the whole thing with Sally, since Sonic is interested in her, unlike game or IDW Sonic where Amy's affections are one sided. I just don't think it works, although from what I understand Sega had Archie drop the Sonic and Sally love thing entirely, and that apparently it is implied that Sally and Nicole are meant to be an item, which is fascinating to me, at least from where I am in the comic right now.

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I rather keep Sonic asexual to be honest, his personality is not stable enough to please women and he's very self secretive about his freedom. Making Sonic into women and dating makes him more a self insert harem protagonist in those harem animes, when Sonic is supposed to be a force a nature and not bound to any human engagements. 

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1 minute ago, Dash Speed said:

I rather keep Sonic asexual to be honest, his personality is not stable enough to please women and he's very self secretive about his freedom. Making Sonic into women and dating makes him more self insery harem protagonist in those harem animes, when Sonic is supposed to be a force a nature and not bound to any human enguagements. 

I can't say I'd object to that idea, either being asexual or simply just being very uninterested in romance. But I think romance can make things more interesting, I just don't want it to be the major focus which seems to be the case sometimes in this era of the Archie comic. I think the Sonic and Sally romance has created some great moments, and I honestly think the Antoine and Bunnie romance has actually helped flesh out both of their characters.

Although I gotta disagree about Sonic not being able to please women, I'm sure there are some fangirls out there who would disagree with you on that one. 😛

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1 minute ago, silvereye27 said:

I can't say I'd object to that idea, either being asexual or simply just being very uninterested in romance. But I think romance can make things more interesting, I just don't want it to be the major focus which seems to be the case sometimes in this era of the Archie comic. I think the Sonic and Sally romance has created some great moments, and I honestly think the Antoine and Bunnie romance has actually helped flesh out both of their characters.

Although I gotta disagree about Sonic not being able to please women, I'm sure there are some fangirls out there who would disagree with you on that one. 😛

Thats because Sonic fangirls make up traits he shouldn't have in order to humanize him to being a ladies man. Look at his advoidance of Amy, he wants no part in relationships.

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Just now, Dash Speed said:

Thats because Sonic fangirls make up traits he shouldn't have in order to humanize him to being a ladies man. Look at his advoidance of Amy, he wants no part in relationships. 

Well, some maybe, but I doubt most do. I think he avoids Amy because she can be overly clingy, and that being with her would restrict his freedom, which is perhaps the most important thing to Sonic. I don't think it means he doesn't like relationships in general, I think it just means he would only want a relationship that would accomodate his lifestyle.

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