Megathread Archie Sonic Main Discussion

[thumbs13]

Yeah, I never liked the Omega stuff either. I get why they had to get rid of Gamma because they forgot to do it back when Adventure came out, and I get why they had to change Omega's exact intro in a world where Heroes never happened.

But "Gamma infuses himself into Omega" was the worst way of doing that, and changing his motivation really makes him weird in the stories he shows up in later.

[SkyHorizon]

2 hours ago, thumbs13 said:

Yeah, I never liked the Omega stuff either. I get why they had to get rid of Gamma because they forgot to do it back when Adventure came out, and I get why they had to change Omega's exact intro in a world where Heroes never happened.

But "Gamma infuses himself into Omega" was the worst way of doing that, and changing his motivation really makes him weird in the stories he shows up in later.

You think so? Did his motivation really changed? And how does it make it weird in Treasure Team Tango?

[thumbs13]

16 hours ago, SkyHorizon said:

You think so? Did his motivation really changed? And how does it make it weird in Treasure Team Tango?

Yeah, his motivation is now he's good because Gamma was good and injected himself into Omega, with revenge tacked on at the end. It gets rid of all his agency. Games Omega's turn to good was because of his pride, He thinks he's the strongest, and he joined a ragtag group to go after Eggman, before befriending the other two. I found Omega's game backstory very interesting, so this always felt like a step down, benefiting Gamma way more than Omega here.

Treasure Team Tango is a convoluted story, but Omega somehow being the moral conscience out of the group is one of the weirder parts of it.

[CrownSlayers Shadow]

I don’t know. I liked the idea Gamma merging his programming with Omega. It justified why Omega is now rogue against Eggman instead of him throwing a fit for being locked in a room as his reason for revenge in Heroes—Gamma went rogue through his own deduction, and since that deduction was transferred to Omega (who was initially loyal, if not insubordinate) now Omega has gone rogue.

It doesn’t change his pride in being the strongest of Eggman’s robots—he’s still trying to prove that by blowing Eggman’s creations up with fire and bullets every chance he gets—but it does give more substance to Omega actually fighting against Eggman, as the way it was presented in Heroes borders on the level of poor presentation that Infinite had after Shadow kicked his ass in Forces because he hated being called weak.

That, and it allowed Gamma to live on in spirit. I never liked characters being one-shots, and prefer they get more mileage before going away. They’re more memorable (ideally in a good way).

[Dr. Mechano]

Gamma never wanted to kill Eggman though. He wanted to (in his own warped view) "save" the other E-Series, but never expressed any desire whatsoever to harm his creator.

Omega is such a fundamentally different character from Gamma that, to me, it doesn't make sense for them to be the same person. 

[Soniman]

Archie Omega is my favorite interpretation of the character and I had no problems with how they implemented Gamma into it. I guess it wasn't necessary but it's a nice way to tie both arcs together where their originally was no connection at all beyond asthetics and model series. I thought Shadow wanting someone to relate to, failing with Metal but then sucedding with Gamma/Omega was a nice little starting arc for him as well so yeah I'll strongly disagree on the Gamma plot point being a bad thing 

[Kuzu]

I'll be perfectly honest and say I never cared much about Omega before, so how they implemented him and Gamma never really bothered me much. It was one of those "well that happened" scenarios.

 

Nowadays, I can understand why someone would take issue, but like...I don't really see any alternatives? The events surrounding Gamma and Omega in Archie are so vastly different from their mainline counterparts that there aren't many ways to reconcile that in Archie. So, Flynn did what he could in that situation.

[SBR2]

I don't know like I said in my reply Omega feels pretty consistent across all media to me. Like sure Gamma gave him his "Soul" or free will or whatever but pretty much everything about him in the Archie comics feels pretty much the same as the games in terms of his personality before and after that. 

Like Games, Archie and IDW Omega all feel relatively the same. 

[Dr. Detective]

1 hour ago, Kuzu said:

Nowadays, I can understand why someone would take issue, but like...I don't really see any alternatives? The events surrounding Gamma and Omega in Archie are so vastly different from their mainline counterparts that there aren't many ways to reconcile that in Archie. So, Flynn did what he could in that situation.

You don't see any alternatives? Just introduce Omega as himself and don't put Gamma's "soul" into his body. He had the power to do that. He was the one writing the story for Omega's introduction. 

He did it because he liked the story he came up with. That's it. 

[Kuzu]

14 minutes ago, Dr. Detective Mike said:

You don't see any alternatives? Just introduce Omega as himself and don't put Gamma's "soul" into his body. He had the power to do that. He was the one writing the story for Omega's introduction. 

He did it because he liked the story he came up with. That's it. 

Omega was introduced in the games as a robot Eggman lost interest in. Omega in the comics is introduced getting a mission from Eggman himself.

Omega is a fundamentally different character from his game self. He's not "himself" in Archie and never was. 

That's why I don't see the problem here. I know this is a bigger deal for you as a fan of Omega and you want to see him represented in the way as you initially liked him.

I'm only speaking from my personal perspective as someone who doesn't have much attachment to him.

 

Even the character I do have an attachment to, Shadow, I'm mostly fine with because I've already internalized that he is not the same Shadow that I know from the mainline series, which helps me tolerate him a bit more.

[Dr. Detective]

1 hour ago, Kuzu said:

Omega was introduced in the games as a robot Eggman lost interest in. Omega in the comics is introduced getting a mission from Eggman himself.

Omega is a fundamentally different character from his game self. He's not "himself" in Archie and never was. 

That's why I don't see the problem here. I know this is a bigger deal for you as a fan of Omega and you want to see him represented in the way as you initially liked him.

I'm only speaking from my personal perspective as someone who doesn't have much attachment to him.

This doesn't make any sense as a response to the notion that there were "no other alternatives". There totally was. IDW Omega is proof of that, and I adore him there. All you're saying here is that it's different because Ian made it different which is exactly what I just said. My problem is the way in which he made it different. 

[Kuzu]

IDW Omega is essentially game Omega, and pretty much assumes that you already know that.

 

But I suppose "no alternatives" wasn't the best choice of words; I guess my perspective is, the alternative that Ian chose really wasn't that big of a deal to me. There were probably better ways to do it, but I didn't really have a problem with what he did either. 

[Dr. Detective]

1 hour ago, Kuzu said:

IDW Omega is essentially game Omega, and pretty much assumes that you already know that.

 

But I suppose "no alternatives" wasn't the best choice of words; I guess my perspective is, the alternative that Ian chose really wasn't that big of a deal to me. There were probably better ways to do it, but I didn't really have a problem with what he did either. 

And that's fair.

I just REALLY couldn't stand it as a huge fan of the character. Different portrayals of characters are going to happen across different mediums and the circumstances concerning whether or not I like it or don't will always be different. All I can really do is explain why it doesn't work for me. 

[Kuzu]

And that's fair too. 

Like I said, for me and how I deal with it, I just completely accept the circumstances are different and internalize that they aren't the same characters that I know them. Archie!Shadow is a wholly different beast from his game incarnation, and probably way more emotionally vulnerable that I would prefer him to be, but I've had to accept that this version of him hasn't gone through the same exact sequence of events and might act different as a result. 

Who knows, maybe if game Shadow had another person to open to like Hope, he might lighten the fuck up too. 

[SkyHorizon]

3 hours ago, CrownSlayer’s Shadow said:

I don’t know. I liked the idea Gamma merging his programming with Omega. It justified why Omega is now rogue against Eggman instead of him throwing a fit for being locked in a room as his reason for revenge in Heroes—Gamma went rogue through his own deduction, and since that deduction was transferred to Omega (who was initially loyal, if not insubordinate) now Omega has gone rogue.

It doesn’t change his pride in being the strongest of Eggman’s robots—he’s still trying to prove that by blowing Eggman’s creations up with fire and bullets every chance he gets—but it does give more substance to Omega actually fighting against Eggman, as the way it was presented in Heroes borders on the level of poor presentation that Infinite had after Shadow kicked his ass in Forces because he hated being called weak.

That, and it allowed Gamma to live on in spirit. I never liked characters being one-shots, and prefer they get more mileage before going away. They’re more memorable (ideally in a good way).

That too. I wouldn't exactly call "Revenge because parked in a hanger for too long" good writing... And as you said, in the end Omega has precisely the same objective, only there is more "beef" to his motivations.

As for Gamma, it totally feels more honorable for him to go down this way.

2 hours ago, Dr. Mechano said:

Omega is such a fundamentally different character from Gamma that, to me, it doesn't make sense for them to be the same person. 

Uhm... no! They didn't became the same person. You can even see at the beginning of "Gamma's contamination" that they talk to each other, they never become the same person (robot). Gamma, as he said himself, simply transmitted him the algorithm he developed when he got his free will. Basically, he is giving him the keys to access free will.

2 hours ago, Soniman said:

Archie Omega is my favorite interpretation of the character and I had no problems with how they implemented Gamma into it. I guess it wasn't necessary but it's a nice way to tie both arcs together where their originally was no connection at all beyond asthetics and model series. I thought Shadow wanting someone to relate to, failing with Metal but then sucedding with Gamma/Omega was a nice little starting arc for him as well so yeah I'll strongly disagree on the Gamma plot point being a bad thing 

Same here.

1 hour ago, SBR2 said:

Like sure Gamma gave him his "Soul" or free will or whatever but pretty much everything about him in the Archie comics feels pretty much the same as the games in terms of his personality before and after that

To the point that some of his lines were straight up taken from Heroes dialogue .

1 hour ago, Dr. Detective Mike said:

He did it because he liked the story he came up with. That's it. 

Ehr... no? He did it because he had to deal with the fact that Gamma was still alive.

39 minutes ago, Dr. Detective Mike said:

IDW Omega is proof of that, and I adore him there.

Uhm... what's the difference in character between ArchieOmega and IDWOmega? Because aside from his origin story, there's, like, no difference at all. Or from GamesOmega for what matters, aside from the fact that in the games he is less fun (in my opinion).

[Razule]

17 minutes ago, SkyHorizon said:

Uhm... what's the difference in character between ArchieOmega and IDWOmega? Because aside from his origin story, there's, like, no difference at all. Or from GamesOmega for what matters, aside from the fact that in the games he is less fun (in my opinion).

I remember Archie Omega being more.. emotional? I can't imagine IDW Omega having a crush on Blaze or thinking Cream is adorable.

[SkyHorizon]

2 minutes ago, Razule said:

I remember Archie Omega being more.. emotional? I can't imagine IDW Omega having a crush on Blaze or thinking Cream is adorable.

Eh, you got a point there, but I hope we all agree that it had nothing to do with "Gamma's soul". Ian simply was more "flexible" with his characterization of Omega. Proof is in the last Archie arc (Knux and Amy search for the ME) he acted pretty much like IDWOmega.

[CrownSlayers Shadow]

6 hours ago, Dr. Mechano said:

Gamma never wanted to kill Eggman though. He wanted to (in his own warped view) "save" the other E-Series, but never expressed any desire whatsoever to harm his creator.

Omega is such a fundamentally different character from Gamma that, to me, it doesn't make sense for them to be the same person. 

Well Gamma already went rogue and is against Eggman regardless of whether he wants him dead or not. Omega, while loyal, was just insubordinate and unwilling to do what he was told beyond what he deemed his function was (at first).

Given Gamma’s rogue status and previous Omega’s stubbornness, it’s not hard to just assume that the fusion of the two brought out the sociopathy in the new Omega when put together like a glitch in a system.

Also, let’s not forget that Archie!Eggman is a lot more dangerous than most of his other counterparts. I could see this point if it were the games, but as laughably enjoyable Eggman is here, he’s not exactly one who should get that kind of sympathy given the magnitude of his crimes in this setting. I’m not saying Gamma should want to kill Eggman, but let’s not gloss over how evil this version of the mad doctor is.

[Dr. Detective]

Archie Sonic the Hedgehog - Issue #200: Turnabout is Fair Play

Issue #200! We’re here again, again. Oh, it feels so good to be here again, again. I just can’t imagine that it’s ever been gone; it’s not starting over, it’s just going on!

Neat cover. It’s appropriate as hell that Spaz is the one who gets to draw it. I like the checkerboard being used as a flowing flag. I love how Sonic is drawn and despite it being kind of hard to catch him, I like how Knuckles is drawn too. If I had a complaint it’d probably be that Tails looks a little off to me and that Eggman in the background looks awesome but, for some reason, the part of his body below Sally’s ear and Sonic’s nose is colored normally while the part above it is shaded in that cool dark green. I’ve never noticed it before but now that I have I can’t unsee it.

Other than that, it’s great. I’ve reached Issue #200 and I’m only really compelled to say thanks for following this craziness along with me. Now, let’s watch Sonic drive a man literally insane and feel bad about it to celebrate.

Spoiler

Writer: Ian Flynn
Pencils: Tracy Yardley
Inks: Terry Austin
Colors: Matt Herms
Letters: John Workman
Editor/Managing Editor: Mike Pellerito

Eggman begins the issue by screaming at Sonic that IT’S BEEN --ONE WEEK SINCE YOU LOOKED AT ME-- FIFTEEN YEARS AND MORE that he’s spent being a thorn in Eggman’s side.

Sonic responds by going “Uh-huh”, looking really uninterested in this, the final “climactic” battle between the two of them. 

Eggman is furious beyond furious. He’s just screaming his head off at Sonic about how he’s still totally awesome and in-control and things are just as under his control as always.

He’s really desperate to have it sink in for Sonic’s that he’s still the biggest, baddest dude around and Sonic just isn’t responding in a way that even remotely hints at him taking the man seriously.

Immediately after this scene, Sonic sets out to completely rip Eggman’s arguments to shreds point by point, all with that cocky smirk on his face. He talks about how a bunch of children with no training took the city he stole back. Eggman says he took the city back again after that but Sonic says he had it for like a month and then let it get nuked by missiles. Now it powers New Mobotropolis.

Eggman’s response to this is “Shut up!”

They’re “fighting” the entire time this is happening, by the way. It’s really just a series of Eggman launching attacks and Sonic dancing out of the way of them.

As this is happening, Sonic lays into him about his empire and how there're a ton of places he doesn’t control. Eggman tries to claim their specks in the wind but Sonic calls him out for being in denial and talks about how far the United Federation’s influence has gotten as well as all the Freedom Fighter groups around. On top of that, people don’t like him in the areas he does control so it’s not too reliable of a thing he has in his back pocket.

The line “You can’t really claim to “control” the planet when you’re fighting for it every waking hour” rings true here and it really sinks in just how pathetic and at the end of his rope Eggman is.

Sonic could probably stop talking after that banger but he keeps going. He dances out of the way of Eggman’s attacks, attacks his robots, and taunts him while hovering over the man in his cockpit.

At this point I had to stop for a bit.

My thoughts on this issue back in the day were very… jumbled. 

I want to say that I hated it but that doesn’t feel quite right. 

I think “uneasy” is a more appropriate word. 

Something about reading this back in the day put my teenage brain on edge. I wasn’t feeling any triumph from this. This felt more sad and pathetic and ruthless on the part of our hero here. Back in the day I was blissfully unaware of the history of this version of Eggman and the tenure he and Sonic shared together. Sonic listing all that stuff off didn’t exactly imbue me with a complete understanding of how things between them really were. I had to read all that in this retrospective to really get a feel for it.

However, when I first got this issue, this conflict was literally the FIRST conflict between Sonic and Eggman I was reading. Issue #181 was the Enerjak thing. Then when I skipped to #194 it was a story about Scourge and Moebius. The Phoenix thing and now this Spider-Robot boss battle was my introduction to Archie Sonic and Archie Eggman’s dynamic.

So, coming out of this issue I felt REALLY weird. Eggman to me, at the time, was my favorite Sonic character. He’s at number 2 now that I’ve fully embraced my love for my son Charmy but he’s still like my main man. 

Naturally, in some respects, despite recognizing that he has to lose and me WANTING Sonic to win in most cases, seeing him get so thoroughly trounced, taunted, and bullied by the hero like this made me feel odd. 

I wasn’t… sure how to process it.

I didn’t want to say that I hated it because, after all, Eggman was the villain… but at the same time I wasn’t fond of how HE was being treated in the issue either… but he’s the villain so I shouldn’t care right? But I love Eggman so I like seeing his clashes with Sonic be a lot more fun than this… but this was just really, really sad to me at the time… but then again, that was the point of the issue. I could tell that was the point even back then despite having no other context for what was going on…BUT..!

But… But… BUT…!

AGH!

My brain! 

I was hoping that a re-read of this, with ALL the context of how horrible and devastating Eggman has been to the world would make this feel different but it hasn’t just yet. 

What’s frustrating is that I CAN’T EXPLAIN WHY. 

I mean, I KNOW why but I can’t explain it in a way that I think any of you would understand. I know what all your positions on this are going to be. It’s going to be the opposite of this, for sure. 

But I dunno. That last panel of Sonic looming over Eggman, reflected in the glass with that evil looking smirk on his face while the doctor just… FAILS to form words because his mind is breaking hits differently for me. 

I’m seriously starting to wonder if I need to get checked by a doctor to see if I have some sort of condition. It feels unnatural to have this much empathy for someone who doesn’t deserve it. 

Also, I’m not mad at Sonic for this. I should clarify that. I think that’s one thing that has changed since back in the day when I first read this. Back then, I think I may have been upset with Sonic for being so harsh. Today, now that I’m older, I’m like, no, Sonic’s earned this and he has absolutely every right to be as harsh and as mean about this as possible, even if I don’t particularly think my ideal version of Sonic would be QUITE this vindictive.

On top of that, Sonic is still ignorant as to what’s happening with Eggman and his reaction to what ends up happening isn’t a celebratory one. I think the younger me really should have given Sonic more credit but I think I just ignored how he felt because I was so upset that it happened.

Everything about this is SO much more interesting reading it here though. Actually following the lead up to the mental break and actually paying attention to the obvious clues Ian was leaving behind has made this quite a ride. 

I’m not surprised or upset that this isn’t even a fight now because I know what got us from Point A to B and I’m able to process this AS what it’s supposed to be. It’s weird that Issue #200, as a result, isn’t really one that feels like a celebration within the narrative. The heroes do, totally, but what happens is so mean and uncomfortable that it leaves both our main hero and our main villain feeling very unlike themselves.

It’s very admirable how risky it is and it really makes me think. 

But yeah, Eggman literally can’t speak properly anymore. Look at this.

That’s the first time Sonic’s facial expression has worn anything other than a confident smirk this entire fight.

Eggman can really build some impressive, cool shit.

What’s even better is that, Sonic confidently takes it on but suffers literally the ONLY hit he takes in this fight… and it happened because he broke the wire connecting the spider to the ceiling and one of it’s legs accidentally hit him in the chin.

At this point, Sonic’s a bigger danger to himself than Eggman is.

When it lands, Sonic sees the weak point exposed for massive damage and tries to hit it. Eggman flips over and knocks Sonic back, shouting that he won’t let him.

So, Sonic decides to do it the hard way with a delightful smirk on his face. He races off, through the tunnel and then jumps down behind the robot to slam it into it’s back.

Then it falls over and is exposed again which prompts Eggman to just yell and beg and plead for Sonic to stop it.

I think back in the day I may have been subconsciously putting myself in Eggman’s shoes here. I might have been imagining myself in that robot, trying to take Sonic down and being greeted with nothing but his taunting, grinning, jazz hands-ing mug. 

Can you imagine being the doctor and trying to take out Sonic? It might actually be way easier than Eggman makes it out to be but because he’s Eggman he loses pretty much all the time, either because he doesn’t think things through or his actions are rooted in what would feel the most satisfying for his ego rather than what’s practical. It’s the very thing that Snively and Lien-Da smack their foreheads over often but it’s also what makes him Eggman.

So long as Eggman isn’t willing to change that stuff about himself, he’ll never beat Sonic. However, were he to change that stuff about himself, there’s a chance he’d probably stop being Eggman, honestly.

I have to stop again to say that this is great. I love that this issue is making me think so much about stuff without really even doing too much.

Sonic shoots on down and starts tearing the robot’s legs apart. Eggman is infuriated, retreating into the part of his brain that thinks or perhaps wishes he held any controlling authority over Sonic by shouting “I FORBID YOU!” and “I COMMAND YOU TO STOP!”

It’s obviously not going to work. Shouting those things at the antithesis of you, a cool blue dude who loves and values freedom above all else isn’t going to land you any success.

Oh, but Eggman really wants it too. He wants so much for Sonic to “STOP!” when he shouts stop but he just keeps going.

Sonic asks if he’s ready to surrender but Eggman is just… saying shit now. 

“STAY BACK! LOSE…! DIE!!!”

Sonic doesn’t do any of those.

He just keeps going and going and going until finally, we witness the moment where Sonic tears through the robot’s remains and subsequently are presented with one extremely memorable panel at the bottom where Sonic shatters Eggman’s mind, reflected through what’s left of the glass of his cockpit.

All while saying his trademark phrase from the 90s.

I actually didn’t catch the tears coming out of the bottom of Eggman’s glasses back in the day either. Now that I’m noticing it I’m feeling it even more now, just how brutal this all is. What a thing to go for. I gotta applaud Ian for taking it this far. 

So that’s it. That was the last line Eggman said before his mind officially crossed the road of no return. Sonic lands on the ground and picks up Eggman’s glasses, as they had fallen off the doctor’s face with the destruction of his final robot, and trots on over to him with them in hand.

He could stop talking now but he doesn’t because he’s Sonic. He lays it in even thicker despite the fact that he probably knows that the doctor knows he’s done.

Eggman can’t process it. He’s not the kind of character who would ever process it. Every waking moment of his life and beyond, he’d defy the idea that he was destined to lose to Sonic. He’s a man who never gives in, no matter how often he suffers defeat. It’s been this way for 30 years now. Not so back when this issue came out but still not an insignificant amount of time when it did.

However, here, Eggman’s been so pushed to the brink and so unable to process how he’s losing to Sonic all the time that he can’t handle it. He said all of this was a game to him back in #175 but then that tremendous wake-up call after his big bid to end it all failed stirred him towards taking things seriously. 

He had no choice but to consider things he didn’t wish to consider about Sonic and how he was actually making headway and advancing to a point where he was being backed into a corner. This wasn’t supposed to happen because it couldn’t happen. Eggman was superior and Sonic was nothing. That’s just how it was.

It doesn’t make any sense to him. He can’t process it. He can’t accept it. He’s being given no choice BUT to process and accept it but he physically and mentally CAN NOT!

So he snaps.

That’s it.

His mind just breaks.

The warning that Shadow gave Sonic back in SU #2 fell on deaf ears but now it’s hitting home and Sonic was left unable to brace himself for it.

Yeah, it really is good to finally have all the context.

This is great.

The uneasiness of witnessing this still lingers today because of the simple fact of the matter being that I love Eggman’s character and I don’t want to see him going through this… but at the same time, what I failed to acknowledge and give credit for back in the day was how Sonic reacted once he realized what he had done and THAT’S really what sells the bigger picture here.

This isn’t just any old beating he took. Sonic may have been treating this “finale” as no different from their other scuffles but the doctor was. 

When Sally enters with news of what transpired back with them, she’s stunned by what she’s seeing as she delivers the news and asks Sonic what the fuck he DID to him.

I love that little “Eww!” motion that Sally does there when big nosed lover boy waltzes in between them. How he ended up here without coming across the Freedom Fighters, I don’t know. Maybe he asked politely and they let him pass.

Anyway, Snively sums up the situation for us, using far less words than me.

So there you have it. Sonic drove a man insane.

… Yay.

200. 

Wooo…

No, but everyone comes up from behind them all and start celebrating. Sally’s tearing up as she asks if Nicole got the news and Nicole says that everyone back home did. They’re all dancing in the streets.

It was here where I did actually take the time to put myself in the hero's shoes for once and imagined celebrating because an evil tyrant that had been looming as a devastating threat to my home for years had finally been put to bed. It felt a little nice.

Of course, it didn’t stick as Sonic is now a bit… shackled with the prospect that he just destroyed someone’s mind.

Tails and Amy are literally swooning and dancing around him, trying to get the deets about how awesome his take down of Eggman was and he’s giving it to them but he isn’t being too enthusiastic about it. Eventually, Amy asks him what’s wrong and Sonic stops to think for a bit… then decides it’d be best to lie and say he’s just tired.

The concern on both their faces is touching. 

Sonic is still Sonic. Despite him being way more abrasive and harsh in this series he’s obviously not a monster. At least when kept out of the hands of Penders he isn’t. I almost don’t even know why I was so reluctant to give Sonic any props here back in the day but seeing just how much panel space is being dedicated to Sonic’s reaction to how all that went down is really allowing it to hit home.

I especially love this next scene and the one panel of Sonic holding Sally’s hands with his head down a bit while in silhouette.

Which is, of course, followed by our group of heroes making their valiant way home.

I remember back in the day, people were saying that it was stupid of the heroes to not capture Eggman and Snively and bring them back to put them in a cell or something. 

I wasn’t one of those people. 

I really don’t have an issue with them just leaving Eggman to be insane with his nephew watching over him. They should know better about Snively’s potential, of course, but whatever.

I mostly feel this way because I don’t think Eggman needs any more done to him right now and also due to the fact that I still really hate that the Freedom Fighters have a prison.

Besides, look at how giddy Snively is?

I’m sure he’ll take good care of Eggman and his Empire. He’s such a sweet boy.

He might even give Eggman the best oats he can find when he slides him his feeding troth. 

Anyway, on the roof, a huge blimp has arrived and the Dark Legion and Snively are lined up to introduce their new benefactors. Dimitri feels like threatening Snively again, so he does, and Snively tells him to knock it off.

Dimitri’s just worried his risks in siding with this other crazy dude’s plans won’t bite him in the… ball. At this point in time, it seems pretty unfounded as a fear. The other dude you were working under put bombs in the body of your people and has now gone insane and sits in a padded cell. You’ve nowhere to go but up.

Snively’s pen pal has arrived though. 

We’ve reached the final page of the issue and one that I remember really, really well from back in the day.

When I saw this panel as a teenager who hadn’t read a thing from before Enerjak Reborn, my reaction to this huge full page spread reveal of who was coming to take over Eggman’s kingdom was, “Who the fuck is this?”

I’ll never forget it.

I was so worried going back into this one, especially after reading the last three issues and not having my mind changed much about them. I can’t say that for this one though. This was expertly handled and really well done. The conclusion to the lead up to Eggman’s mental break was done justice and the fact that it happened at all gave me a lot to chew on as far as looking back on Sonic and Eggman’s relationship; the Freedom Fighter stuff notwithstanding. That stands true not just for this comic but also for their history together as rivals and enemies across a ton of different mediums. Imagining what it’d be like to finally see the conflict end and in what way and how they’d react is something the narrative never really gives you the chance to chew on and this one did it.

It won’t last, obviously. It literally can’t. However, the fact that it happened still leaves me reeling. The fact that SEGA allowed Eggman to go insane and get locked in a padded cell is crazy to me. Do you think they’d allow something like that to happen to Sonic? Under what pretense? Why am I even asking that? Who cares? 

I’m so happy I not only made it this far but got to re-experience this issue and see it for what it actually was and not just what I thought I wanted it to be all the way back when I first got a hold of these comics. I’ll admit, it’s STILL hard reading the first half of this issue in my opinion but now it feels worth it because the second half makes what I felt feel warranted and appropriate. 

A lot of what I’ve read up to this point, while not my ideal vision for a Sonic comic, has proven to be something that I very much can and do respect. We’re barrowing into the first big arc of the book that I got to follow from start to finish and as such it’s got a bit of a special place in my heart despite how strange and different it is. It’s time for the Iron Dominion!

Holy shit. Can you guys Adam and Eve it? We’re at the Iron Dominion Arc. Good God.

 

Sonic Universe - Issue #4: The Shadow Saga - Part 4 of 4:  The Ultimate Lifeform

We’ve reached the end of our first Sonic Universe arc and the end of Shadow’s first of many. This is a really neat cover and I love how much it sparkles and shines. It’s Team Dark, in their full glory, presented for the first time in the comics. It took 6 years since the team’s creation in Sonic Heroes but better late than never.

Spoiler

Writer: Ian Flynn
Pencils: Tracy Yardley
Inks: Jim Amash
Colors: Jason Jensen
Letters: Teresa Davidson
Editor & Managing editor: Mike Pellerito
The book begins with Shadow and Rouge standing on the telepad, about to head off to the special zone. Rouge asks Shadow if he’s excited and Shadow says “Not particularly” because it’s another day and another mission.

Reading that line made me realize just how awful it would be to be Shadow the Hedgehog. I get excited whenever I go to New York City every single year and there’s still parts of it that I haven’t seen despite that being a tradition of my family ever since I was an infant. I’m trying so hard to cling onto remaining excited about the things I used to get super pumped up for when I was a kid at times. 

Speaking of kids, Hope is extra special sure of the fact that she’ll be able to send them where they need to go this time (she’s pretty sure at least) and manages to do so. 

It’s here where we get a reunion with ye old’ panda God who somehow is able to stand in a void where there is no bottom; Mr. Feist himself.

Despite being in the presence of a God, Shadow isn’t impressed. He even tries to implement cheat codes to vi-pass what the dude is saying and trying to do but it doesn’t work.

The guy put so much time into his work, Shadow. The least you could do is appreciate the effort.

Do you know how long a single snap of the figure is to a God?

Honestly, imagine if Chaos Control had worked. He would have done his lofty speech and then Shadow would have just zipped on over, snagged it, and left. Shadow wouldn’t have shown it on his face but you know a part of him would have reveled in humiliating him like that.

It goes the opposite way though. Shadow can’t use Chaos Control because Mr. Panda Express wills it. So, instead, they have to go through the gauntlet.

The part where they have to fly is handled by Rouge but the air here sucks so it takes her a bit. Then when they land, Shadow has to do the bridal carry for her that all the speedsters do to whisk her towards the finish.

Pictured here is what seems to be the secondary formation for the Speed and Flight type where the flight type character isn’t going fast enough so the speed type just whisks them off their feet and carries them to the altar.

They have a mere second left but miss it and get booted out.

Rouge explains to Hope and the Commander why they failed and the Commander demands to be explained as to why they failed so Rouge snarks at him that she literally just told him. I would too, honestly. Imagine telling someone a literal God stood in your way and your boss was just like “Not good enough.” Like, what the fuck dude?

Shadow blames himself though and goes off to sulk on his own because apparently this was the third time where he wasn’t good enough.

I must have been missing the through-line here back in the day because I honestly don’t remember these stories being connected through Shadow’s feelings regarding being a failure. I was aware it was happening but I guess my brain just disassociated them a bit.

Looking at this now, I’m happy it’s here though. It helps string together these four stories a little better. They’re still four episodic ventures but the theme is more explicit now that I’m paying more attention.

Shadow goes to blow off some steam by fighting Omega and he’s gone full brood to the point where the “Hmph!” he usually does is literally all he can say in response to Omega’s inquiries.

To be fair, reading this scene doesn’t clue me in on what it was that Omega said that got him angry. I guess it was the part where he said he was going to help next time? It’s sort of weird seeing as how Omega himself is a testament to the success Shadow’s had but I guess this is one of those situations where he’s got intense negative bias and can only see the bad within the good he’s done.

If so, my God, I’ve never related to Shadow more in my life. Even now, when I get tons of upvotes on one post and barely any on the next one, my mind is like “OKAY, SO WHY DID PEOPLE HATE THIS ONE????”

It’s a terrible wire to have in your brain and I wish someone would fish it the fuck out of my head.

Shadow being a lot more vulnerable and honestly a lot more childlike in this comic is a bit hard to wrap my head around still. It was back then and I’ll fully admit to that still being the case now. I’m not saying it’s BAD just that it’s different and hard to adjust to.

We literally cut to a scene of him in a hiding spot on some random mountain, sulking by himself. A little girl, our friend Hope, has to come onto the scene and cheer him up about his failure. 

Shadow says he was made to be the Ultimate Lifeform and therefore is supposed to be perfect. He’s not supposed to fail. Hope responds to this by GRABBING SHADOW AND SHOUTING INTO HIS FACE ABOUT HOW HE’S NOT THE ONLY ONE WHO FAILED politely confiding into him that they’re not so different and sharing a similar experience she’s had.

Look at Shadow’s face there. I swear, he’s just a slightly more serious Sonic in these books. He’s just wearing a mask. I can tell.

He explains to her why it wasn’t her fault and how, if anything, Snively saved her and she ended up making the absolute best of her situation by assisting the United Nations in ways that actually help to fight against the doctor’s forces.

News of Eggman’s insanity hasn’t reached them yet, of course. 

Hope hears what Shadow says and then throws it back at him. At first, Shadow does his tried and true strategy of saying “Hmph!” but it fails this time. Hope uses the same logic on Shadow that he just used on her.

By Jove, I do believe she’s got me!

Then Hope hugs Shadow and we end on a scene of the two of them reaffirming that they’ve got each other’s back. Shadow sees Maria in the clouds and agrees. 

Boy, the clouds sure are forming the shapes of the Robotnik family a lot today. I wonder what that’s about.

Also, what the fuck is up with the sun in that last panel? It looks like it’s firing laser beams everywhere. Good God. Run you fools! The sun’s going nova!

Imagine getting a chance to hug Shadow the Hedgehog and also imagine that his response would be to not push you away and instead smile in acceptance. 

Do you think he’d be fluffy? Does he smell like black coffee? Why are these the questions that are going through my mind? Can’t I just say “That was cute” and move on? No. I refuse to be normal.

What’s funny is how a scene later, after Shadow was all mopey and then smiley, as soon as he’s about to go on the mission again he’s back to that serious face mask he always wears.

They also mutter about the Team Dark name, making it official.

And by “In time” I mean “Never”.

If it did, then I seriously don’t remember.

Maybe their conduct in Treasure Team Tango was some sort of hint? I dunno.

Anyway, they arrive and Omega immediately wants to douse things in fire… but he keeps asking for permission to do it because he’s a good boy, technically.

Back in the day, I had a huge hang-up about Omega working for GUN too. Nowadays I don’t really care about it that much. One, it doesn’t seem like it matters anymore seeing as how fucked the continuity is, and two, it’s not that important in the grand scheme of things. 
I mean, it’s important to me as a fan of the character but when it comes to the Archie book, he’s one character in a sea of hundreds with like 50 different groups and factions around. It’s important to remember that sometimes things just won’t go the way you wish and try to make the best of it.

Thankfully, Omega’s lines are often amusing and genuinely well written. He may not be wired exactly how I want him to be, and a lot of the jokes with him are hit and miss, but when they hit, they hit really well. 

The line “Permission to regulate with fire?” is just a really funny thing to say, honestly. Even I can’t deny it.

Anyway, Feist is hovering over them and he’s got a new challenge for them. He basically says “SOLVE MY MAZE” and Team Dark is pumped to go do that.

It takes some doing but they eventually reach the center… only for Feist to cheat his cheating ass off by covering the way with tons of other emeralds.

Shadow tries to nab it still but he’s too late once again.

Oh no! 

Does that mean we need to hurry our way to the mountains to sulk a bit more until another little girl shows up to deliver a speech?

No. Instead they go with Plan B.

Plan B is to just rain fire directly into Feist’s face, yoink the Emerald, and leave.

This is definitely one of those issues where Archie Omega is in top form. There’s very little to complain about his handling here, aside from all that I’ve already talked about last issue but it doesn’t even matter because it isn’t relevant towards what’s currently going on.

The point is, they managed to grab the emerald and with one last line of assurance concerning their victory, Shadow regains his confidence and Feist is left without an emerald.

Mission accomplished. 

Good, God, they’d better not have to go BACK there for anything now that they’ve severely pissed him off.

Everyone’s happy. The day has been… had. 

Rouge found it thrilling. Omega says admonishing a haughty God-like being with fire makes this a good day and Shadow congratulates his team.

We get a little bit of that more child-like Omega when Rouge congratulates him and he scratches his head and says something modest. It threw me off a tiny bit but not enough to ruin all the good will.

No, what ruins the good will is how, immediately after Shadow hands the emerald to the commander, the next page just has a caption box that says “30 YEARS LATER!” and suddenly we’re back in that alternate futuristic prison. Again!

By the time THE LARA-SU CHRONICLES IN ALL CAPS  releases its first issue it really will be 30 years later. 

Ah man. I’m not looking forward to this one. I don’t even remember this being that bad… just a really weird waste of my time. 

That was a very fine, simple, story and it was handled in a very fine, and simple way. The highlight of the issue is no doubt the scene with Shadow and Hope and if you’re a big Shadow fan, you probably got the warm fuzzies reading it. If you’re just someone who just likes him fine then you were probably like me and couldn’t stop thinking weird stuff like, “I bet he smells like black coffee” or whatever. The issue was good though. Everyone, including Omega, was written really well and it was a nice way to give Shadow’s little mini-arc of being unable to properly handle the nature of his successes and failures some closure.

Next, we check back in with Lara-Su before she got her disgusting face lift and discovered the wonder of tight, white string bikinis… FOR THE LAST TIME (thank God).

 

Sonic Universe - Issue #5: 30 Years Later - Part 1 of 4: Five Years of Peace

I… I’m just… why… hmmmm…

To this day, the nature of the original Mobius: 25 Years Later story is something I find to be a very strange anomaly. Back in the day, I was aware of it before I read this SU story arc. This arc acted as my introduction to it since this was most likely before I had decided to order all the back issues I could and managed to read Ian’s first crack at this alternate future. That first story Ian did, I remember being fine, if not problematic at its core due to the nature of what it was concluding.

The original Mobius: 25 Years Later was something I first got a chance to read doing this retrospective and it still amazes and impresses me just how much that story was an expert at wasting time. I truly do believe, without hyperbole, that it’s the most impressive time waster I’ve ever read. If going on for so long and having NOTHING happen was a skill, that story would take the cake, the keesh, the pudding, and the entire bakery. It should be sent to a lab and studied.

That brings me to THIS one… 

I… don’t know what my re-read of this has in store for me. I really don’t. All I really know is that back in the day, I found this to be a colossal waste of time. “Why am I here?”, “What the fuck is happening?” and “Why should I care?” were questions I’d often ask myself and today, lamenting over the fact that Moebius will never be seen again, I just really wish it could have been replaced with a story about Anti-Tails/Miles’ upbringing. I would have gotten so much out of something like that. 

All I can really say is… I’m excited to see what I’ll think of now. This is the first story in a while where I’m anticipating something bad happening but not necessarily feeling that secure as to why… or how.

Spoiler

Writer: Ian Flynn
Pencils: Tracy Yardley
Inks: Jim Amash
Colors: Jason Jensen
Letters: Teresa Davidson
Editor & managing editor: Mike Pellerito

I didn’t say anything about the cover during the preamble like I usually do. It’s fine. It looks really good and it’s well drawn. What it’s depicting was the stuff that’s more important though. 

I can get into all that stuff once I get started on the actual issue. This is gonna be a long whatever number of pages this is. 

First off, OH MY GOD! 

Immediately, when I turned the page to open the book, I was greeted with the character that made me cringe and laugh my ass off the first time I read it.

Say hello to “Leading you on with what should be your appropriate reaction to what I’m saying” News reporter cat lady. She’s here to deliver exposition and then cringe, cry, and be as cartoonishly unprofessional about her job as possible, all so that she can make sure you know how you’re supposed to be feeling about the things she’s saying. Let’s take a gander, shall we?

There you go. Cringe for the camera. That’s right. No, do it harder. Reel to the left in your seat like you’re about to fall out of it Sasha. Good. Continue.

That’s right Sasha. Make sure to put your head down, close your eyes, and cry. Wipe the tears from your eyes in front of the camera. Make sure everyone knows just how good the constitutional monarchy is. 

And cut. We got it. 

Wow, you’re so good at this Sasha. We’re lucky to have you.

I remember this scene being something I made fun of and was one of the few things some agreed with me on back when initially discussing it. This news reporter kind of floored me with her reactions here. I understand why they drew her making these faces but I can’t stop laughing at it. I want to see Sasha Cat talk about the Gay Frogs now.

This was one of four things that I remember from this story arc. I’ll list the other ones when I come across them. 

Suffice to say, Sonic is king again. After the time stream got all wibbly-wobbly and Sonic (and the few people that remembered the old days) returned to normalcy, Sonic reclaimed what he had lost and seems to have RE-given birth to Sonia and Manik. Somehow.

Again, timey-whimey stuff. You know the score.

Ian brought them back because the idea that they’d been scrubbed from history was really sad and dark to a lot of people. I wouldn’t have cared since the idea of Sonic with children is still a bit hard to process. Like, even now, this 30 Years Later universe feels like the weirdest of all weird things in association with the series. It just FEELS the most like fan-fiction in a comic that already kind of had that twinge.

Nothing makes that sink in more than the fact that Sonic is king and he’s wearing a fucking crown and a cape and waving at the people on a balcony… 

It’s SO wrong to me. I can’t… I CAN’T!

Well, for the duration of these four issues I’m gonna have to I guess.

Perhaps I’ll finally discover the point to this arc in this re-read. I know the first one Ian did was to give that story a conclusion for those who liked it but this…?

Well, Sonic’s worried about a speech he has tomorrow. Sally says the two of them are going to take the night off to relax and the kids really don’t want their parents to go… but then a special babysitter arrives.

The relationship here is quite different. First of all, the kids are a lot younger. That’s a good idea. Having them all be teenagers was a bit much, especially when it came to, I think it was Manik, having a crush on Lara-Su or whatever. I’ve got no tolerance left for stories with younger boys or girls having crushes on older guys and girls who are out of their league. With Amy it at least felt way more plausible and the age difference was so miniscule it barely mattered.

Also different is how Lara-Su reacts to the kids. I like how it’s more playful. The kids have this, “We don’t want our parents to leave BUT OH WAIT, the FUN babysitter is here! NEVERMIND!” energy and it’s good. That kind of energy totally does exist and it’s nice to see it acknowledged where another story would just have them all hate each other.

I mean, of course they get a little rowdy but Lara-Su can handle that.

She’s got Chaos Control powers now.

She’s had them for five years now it seems. I’d imagine she’s had them the entire time she’s known these kids too as a result.

Side-note, I guess it is a little sad that these designs are literally just Sonic and Sally but with minor changes in hair for one and a different color of eyes plus a missing tooth for the other. That middle panel just literally looks like Sonic. Adding an extra strap to his shoes doesn’t change that. It feels like something I would have done when I was 8 and trying to make a new character (which I rarely did since I cared more about learning to draw the official characters). Just draw some weird patterns on a drawing of Sonic you did and viola. You’ve got yourself Rad the Hedgehog.

Rad the Hedgehog, by the way, is the name of a  Deviantart original fan character. It was literally a picture of some Sonic Riders art of Sonic colored red. When someone in the comments pointed that out, the reaction was. “BLAH BLAH HOW DARE YOU! IT’S RAD THE HEDGEHOG!” and the guy, shockingly calm, just responded by saying “Dude, it’s Sonic colored red. I don’t know what else to tell you.”

Never left my mind. The perfect conversation if you ask me.

Lara-Su contacts her parents, Knuckles and Julie-Su (I almost typed Lien-Da…) and they talk about how the Peace Talks are going.

Apparently, Vector and a guy named Mace are trying to get the Mazuri Separatists to rethink some things so they can talk to Bill.

I have no idea what any of that means and I imagine when I initially read this it literally zoomed in one ear and out the other. I read the word “Mazuri” and that made me happy though because that’s a place I know and recognize from that one game I like.

The two parents overhear the commotion going on in Sonia and Manik’s rooms and Julie-Su is thankful Lara-Su was an only child. Honestly, as someone with two younger siblings, I couldn’t imagine life without them. The benefits of growing up with someone close to your age to talk to on your way home is something I’m only ever thankful for.

She’s speaking as a parent of course so I can’t relate. The scenes with Lara-Su and the kids feel more comfortable and homey to me though.

He’s so happy to be hit by his one weakness.

This may be the future but there is something nostalgic about this.

Not TOO nostalgic though, since we were told to stop having pillow fights so often I don’t think we ever fully got to have a complete one; much less a babysitter who’d ever join in.

I don’t recall ever having any babysitters. Instead, we would go to rec-centers or care centers and wait for our parents to pick us up and drive us home. Then when we were a bit older, in Elementary School, we’d be left home by ourselves. 

It was fine. No one needed to watch us. We’d make blanket forts and bounce on the couches, sure, but aside from that one time we jumped on the table and made it collapse, we were pretty good about not ruining the house.

Anyway, a bunch of pervs in black outfits are spying on the teenage girl and some kids.

This person works for the Dark Presence, which is an awful name, and it’s led by Lien-Da. When she hears the report of who’s inside, she tells her men to pull out. She says she doesn’t want to risk the children if she can help it since they’re innocent in all “this”.

Whatever “this” is. 

I was guessing this was for King Shadow but it seems to be more than that.

Way more.

I remember him. Lien-Da’s son. He’s the boy that Lara-Su threatened with her status and was later seen making out with Espio’s daughter behind the bushes in that really, really fucking weird scene that I still can’t believe was released in an officially licensed Sonic the Hedgehog comic book for children.

We then cut to… some even stranger stuff.

We’re introduced to the uh… the Prowers, as it were.

I honestly don’t remember… but uh...

Who’s idea was it that Tails and fucking Mina should get together and have children? I remember seeing this back then and thinking it was just really random but not caring. Now, knowing more about Mina and all the ages and stuff, this has transcended into being shell-shockingly weird with a mere extra helping of random.

It’s like Tails opened the Mystery Flavored Air-Heads of wives and got Mina.

Like, I’m sure at least ONE of these guys could have ended up marrying someone they didn’t know 30 years ago when they were children and teenagers, right? That’s fine to do sometimes. Even if you couldn’t think of anyone else, picking names from a hat doesn’t yield the best results sometimes.

Well, at least Skye is cute.

Oh shit. He’s me when I was a kid. Nervous about everything and quiet to the point of barely being able to respond when someone said hi to me. Then someone would get upset with me and demand I say hello to whoever it was I didn’t know.

My mom said that when I was a baby, I was so quiet that they had to go check on my crib repeatedly to see if I was still alive. Like, it was unusual for a baby to be so silent but that was me. When I heard my parents tell that story I wasn’t surprised. I don’t talk unless I absolutely have to. The fact that it’s been a trait of mine since I was an infant is a weird point of pride.

Anyway, the Dark Presence (such a bad name) is scattered around this kingly event.

Team B, D, and A are all setting up but Team C for this terrorist plot can’t make it because they’re stuck in traffic.

Which is pretty funny.

Anyway, Lien-Da gives the go-ahead because the teams that are here are enough for the mission to work. 

The mission is to assassinate Sonic while he gives his speech to the people. 

Everyone is ready. Sonic takes a deep breath and is ready, Tails hikes his son over his shoulders and is ready, and Lien-Da holds up a fucking rocker launcher and hears her team proclaim that they’re all ready.

It wasn’t until I saw Tails hike his son on his shoulders that it sunk in that I was looking at Tails… married and with a kid. 

Tails “got busy” with Mina Mongoose and had two kids. 

GOD.

Lara-Su’s job is security detail and she does her job really well. She spots someone about to blow Sonic’s brains out as he’s giving his speech about peace and interrupts it. This leads to a fight scene where, as Sonic talks about peace, we cut to Lara-Su beating the shit out of some John Wilkes Booths. 

What’s even funnier about this scene is that Lien-Da goes after the one who was trying to run away and the one who stood firm grabbed the rocket launcher when she was focused on him. I’d have taken them out the opposite way really but I guess it doesn’t matter. All it takes is one hit for them both and they go down.

Unfortunately, when she takes the rocket launcher, she notices there’s no rocket inside which clues her into the fact that this was a diversion.

Honestly, even if it was, I don’t understand why you wouldn’t still have a rocket in there. One, to make sure Lara-Su doesn’t realize it’s a diversion and two as a back-up plan in case Plan A doesn’t work.

I guess they couldn’t afford two rockets for their planned out, assassination against the royal family.

Also, yeah, it’s not just Sonic. Everyone is going to be killed here.

When Lara-Su realizes she’s been duped, we cut back to Lien- “I don’t want to involve the children if I can help it” Da and watch as she merrily fires a rocket at all four of them.

Sonic and Tails are so OLD.

That’s all I could think of looking at this scene.

They’re not grandpas or anything, obviously, but they’re in that range of years where the back-pain starts to creep in. Kicking away rockets probably isn’t going to feel as good as it used to, naturally.

It’s funny that Tails is a part of this whole thing at all now. His absence in the original Mobius: 25 Years Later where apparently he and Sonic just… stopped talking was such a strange thing to read. 

It really does astonish me STILL how little Penders knows about these characters. Treating Sonic and Tails’ relationship as though they were like… friends in middle school who went on with their lives as the years went on is such a massive underselling of how close their bond was. It’d be an even harder sell were this the main series since Tails’ life probably would have been a garbage fire had he not met Sonic on that island. 

Now, here he is. He’s married with kids, watching a rocket fly overhead that’s about to blow Sonic up and can’t really do shit about it since the time they all realized something was up was the time it took for it to almost hit them.

Almost.

Boy, you just got your asses saved by a flying, time-traveling, not-a-wizard from the future!

No, whoops.

It’s Silver.

Silver the Hedgehog.

He’s here to deliver your pot in 30 minutes or less or it’s free. 

Thank God, Silver is here. 

Him being around was the one thing I could cling on to back when this arc came around. I can’t recall why he’s here or why he needed to go 30 Years into Sonic’s future to find what he’s looking for. I doubt he knows this is an alternate future too (and yes Ken, it’s an alternate future you fuck).

It’s funny to think that the 30 Years Later story is still considered the past as far as Silver is concerned. He hails from a time where all the main characters are long dead.

We still haven’t reached the second of the things I remember from this arc though, which means, I don’t recall this assassination attempt or how Silver showed up in this story. 

Kind of funny to think about, honestly.

This is the second full page, body spread Silver has had since his introduction. He’s also still got that cyan colored ring around his speech bubbles which indicates… that he speaks… future-ese…?

So yeah, this is a story that’s currently happening.

It sure is… a thing that I’m reading.

… 

...I dunno. I guess as an issue it’s written fine. The babysitter stuff was fun and legitimately cute. Sonic being nervous about giving speeches was a nice humanizing moment. That one terrorist not making it because he got stuck in traffic was funny.

As for the story itself… we’ll see. It’s more Dark Legion shit and I’m struggling to see why I should lend too much credence to it at the moment. The only thing I feel I can say with confidence is that this is all very, VERY weird and strange to me. Even years and years later this all just doesn’t FEEL quite right so, I’ll be happy to give it it’s second chance and then probably not engage with it for another two decades maybe.

[CrownSlayers Shadow]

1 hour ago, Dr. Detective Mike said:

We’ve reached the final page of the issue and one that I remember really, really well from back in the day.

When I saw this panel as a teenager who hadn’t read a thing from before Enerjak Reborn, my reaction to this huge full page spread reveal of who was coming to take over Eggman’s kingdom was, “Who the fuck is this?”

I’ll never forget it.

We both thought alike.

I had only read the comics up to at least Endgame and some Specials. Then I rediscovered them around the 100s. So when I first saw these newbies, I was like, “Who the fuck are these guys?”

I and as much as it has flaws that even I didn’t care for, but among the Pre-Reboots, the Iron Dominion arc is one of my top favorites!

I actually had to re-look back into who these characters originally were, and Ian really did quite an admirable rework to make them more interesting. They would have risked being completely forgettable for who knew how long.

[SanPolo4389]

5 hours ago, Dr. Detective Mike said:

Sonic Universe - Issue #5: 30 Years Later - Part 1 of 4: Five Years of Peace

I… I’m just… why… hmmmm…

To this day, the nature of the original Mobius: 25 Years Later story is something I find to be a very strange anomaly. Back in the day, I was aware of it before I read this SU story arc. This arc acted as my introduction to it since this was most likely before I had decided to order all the back issues I could and managed to read Ian’s first crack at this alternate future. That first story Ian did, I remember being fine, if not problematic at its core due to the nature of what it was concluding.

The original Mobius: 25 Years Later was something I first got a chance to read doing this retrospective and it still amazes and impresses me just how much that story was an expert at wasting time. I truly do believe, without hyperbole, that it’s the most impressive time waster I’ve ever read. If going on for so long and having NOTHING happen was a skill, that story would take the cake, the keesh, the pudding, and the entire bakery. It should be sent to a lab and studied.

That brings me to THIS one… 

I… don’t know what my re-read of this has in store for me. I really don’t. All I really know is that back in the day, I found this to be a colossal waste of time. “Why am I here?”, “What the fuck is happening?” and “Why should I care?” were questions I’d often ask myself and today, lamenting over the fact that Moebius will never be seen again, I just really wish it could have been replaced with a story about Anti-Tails/Miles’ upbringing. I would have gotten so much out of something like that. 

All I can really say is… I’m excited to see what I’ll think of now. This is the first story in a while where I’m anticipating something bad happening but not necessarily feeling that secure as to why… or how.

Something I’ve been thinking of lately about this arc is that, why was this made in the first place? Was there people that desperately wanted this to continue years after the fact? 

[CrownSlayers Shadow]

2 hours ago, SanPolo4389 said:

Something I’ve been thinking of lately about this arc is that, why was this made in the first place? Was there people that desperately wanted this to continue years after the fact? 

Penders...

He just seems to sum up everything, doesn’t he? I don’t have a clue why Ian continued it beyond what I can only assume was filler for Silver, and even that guess is a stretch.

[SanPolo4389]

1 hour ago, CrownSlayer’s Shadow said:

Penders...

He just seems to sum up everything, doesn’t he?

Ok I’d like to not blame him for everything. 
 

But yeah this feels like filler for Silver since besides a few references to this, it’s never mentioned or brought up again so it’s like why even make it?

[GentlemanX]

10 hours ago, SanPolo4389 said:

Something I’ve been thinking of lately about this arc is that, why was this made in the first place? Was there people that desperately wanted this to continue years after the fact? 

I realize that given M25YL's reputation in the fandom this isn't going to sound the most believable, but Ian confirmed on Bumbleking back in the day that the M25YL stories were very popular with kids and that's why it kept coming back. Maybe kids liked seeing Sonic and Knuckles older? Maybe they liked seeing their kids? I don't know the actual responses they got, but it was enough that Ian was told to make the two part finale in 166/167 and was still popular enough that Ian's plans for Echoes of the Past were pushed back to make room for 30YL. The only reason we likely didn't get anything more is that Ian confirmed 30YL was a nightmare to get approved by Archie and Sega. Don't know why that is though or if they ever considered another story after this.

[Razule]

Was a kid at the time, can confirm Adult Sonic with kids was a very intriguing concept, even if I had nearly no idea what was going on. 30YL was the first time I saw it though, so I can't say if I would've been invested with it through Penders. 

It's not hard to imagine why SEGA wouldn't have wanted more of it. The entire concept is the antithesis of the character and brand. King Sonic the Hedgehog, a married man with kids, complaining about back pain because he's middle-aged. It's amazing looking back at stories with premises that would never be approved today.