Megathread Archie Sonic Main Discussion

[Mangoaxe5]

This just in

TSSZ has learned Ken Penders’s motion to either transfer Archie Comics’s lawsuit to California or have it dismiss outright has been denied. We have been covering the ongoing case, in which Archie is seeing a declaratory judgment of rights regarding work Penders produced while employed at the company, for months.

A five page order, filed on Tuesday and made a part of public record shortly after, said Penders, acting as defendant in the case, did not “make a ‘clear and convincing showing’ of “exceptional facts” warranting transfer,” wrote U.S. District Court Judge Richard M. Berman in his decision. Berman also concluded the original agreement between Penders and Archie, the contract in question that is central to the case, constitutes prima facie “showing of jurisdiction”–in effect keeping the case in New York State, close to Archie headquarters. A central part of Penders’s defense is his assertion those agreements are not authentic.

While the ruling adds more of a burden to Penders, no key ruling has been made on the validity of his contract. Nearly all signs point to this turning into a full blown jury trial, an arduous process that could take many months or more. We will continue to keep you informed of key developments in the Archie/Penders lawsuit.

[-Mark-]

Bloody hell. I can't even remember now, just how long has this legal mess been going on between Penders and Archie? It feels like forever already.

EDIT:

Also, has anyone else noticed that, in SU#26, when Lara-Su/ Jani-Ca/ Whatever draws her sword against Silver, the hand movement and sword swing she makes make absolutely no sense and are physically impossible?

Edited April 7, 2011 by -Mark-

[The-Master-Board]

God, this pretty much confirms Sally isn't going to die in 225. Well, shit.

Hahahahahaha! suck it up.

You act all as though Sally is just a love interest and has no personality whatsoever yet go on to say how much Amy has? Uh yeah. Amy is pretty much the games version of what you think Sally is; a one sided character (or at least started off that way) created purely to pine over Sonic.

Sally is a great leader and has lots of personality to boot. There is no way she suffers from only being there just to be a love interest syndrome.

Edited April 7, 2011 by The-Master-Board

[Flyboy Fox]

Well, Sally was never really in the running for being the one who died, anyway. They tried the whole killing her thing before and it bombed. Sally is, and always will be, a key character in the comics, and people need to just accept that. That doesn't mean we should stay quiet about the way she as a character is portrayed or handled, or that we don't have the right to complain when she sidelines even Sonic or says/does ridiculous things... if anything, we should be more vocal than ever, because she's NOT going anywhere, so the only influence we're ever likely to have is on what happens with her.

I agree that Ian is horribly biased towards her and grants her protections and excuses equivalent to some kind of diplomatic immunity just because of a character favouritism... but he IS the guy with the right and power to script her as he pleases, and constant complaining about Sally isn't going to make her go away.

And I say all of this as a HUGE fan of the chipirrel. I adore Sally as you know, but I also agree that much of the sentiment against her has absolutely reasonable grounds and in many instances I agree that she's been handled horribly. But while I'm happy for that to be discussed, I'd really appreciate it if people would stop with the "I wish she would die" ranting. You don't like Sally and I do, but those opinions alone have no discussion basis and she's not going anywhere so let's stop being redundant.

Also, please no more Sally vs Amy either. How many times have we all dragged THAT one out?

[CrownSlayers Shadow]

The more I read the comics, the more I begin to think that there elements could REALLY be used to bring fresh new material while still remaining in the series parameters. And by parameters, I mean by sticking to the current material we already have without having to create a lot new characters.

Not that we can't introduce a few new ones, but seriously: Using the Master Emerald to become a godlike being (I'm talking more than Super Sonic), a few new villians to work under Eggman, a world seemingly under an endless war between Sonic and friends vs Eggman and henchmen, some non-robotic enemies working under Eggman, and better characterization of the game cast.

Although I'm really just saying that because it is really awesome to have Knuckles as such an all-powerful character who's previous alias was one of his greatest foes.

EDIT: That and because the Knuckles Comic series was just that damn awesome. Who's wit me on that?

Edited April 7, 2011 by ChaosSupremeSonic

[The-Master-Board]

The more I read the comics, the more I begin to think that there elements could REALLY be used to bring fresh new material while still remaining in the series parameters. And by parameters, I mean by sticking to the current material we already have without having to create a lot new characters.

Not that we can't introduce a few new ones, but seriously: Using the Master Emerald to become a godlike being (I'm talking more than Super Sonic), a few new villians to work under Eggman, a world seemingly under an endless war between Sonic and friends vs Eggman and henchmen, some non-robotic enemies working under Eggman, and better characterization of the game cast.

Although I'm really just saying that because it is really awesome to have Knuckles as such an all-powerful character who's previous alias was one of his greatest foes.

EDIT: That and because the Knuckles Comic series was just that damn awesome. Who's wit me on that?

[Your Vest Friend]

Honestly, I don't see the comic cast being given any better characterisation than the game cast. Certainly different characterisation, but not better.

Then again, you're talking to someone who can analyse a rock and get an essay of the trials of the universe out of it.

[turbojet]

Hahahahahaha! suck it up.

You act all as though Sally is just a love interest and has no personality whatsoever yet go on to say how much Amy has? Uh yeah. Amy is pretty much the games version of what you think Sally is; a one sided character (or at least started off that way) created purely to pine over Sonic.

Sally is a great leader and has lots of personality to boot. There is no way she suffers from only being there just to be a love interest syndrome.

I'm sorry. The title of the series is called, "Sonic the Hedgehog." Do I see any mention of Sally the Princess Squirrel and Sonic the Hedgehog? No. "Do I see Sonic and his Cassanova tendencies?" No. As far as I'm concerned, Sally really shouldn't be a key character at all, but she is and I deal with it. As for saying Sally has personality. I don't buy it. I already hate that there is a institution that Sonic has to oblige to and I already hate that Sonic isn't the adventurer that he claims to be. Here comes the argument of "Sally keeps Sonic from being Scourge." If Sonic has too much free time, he might go bad. Really? I rather have Sonic be the universal hero that he should be. I rather have Sonic fight for what "he believes his right" and not have a master of his own. Disobeying orders occassionally is one thing, but why should he be following orders from some obviously corrupt officials(*cough* Elias and papa Acorn*cough*).

As for Sally's personality versus Amy. Hahahaha. NO. Amy being defined as a fangirl stalker is bullshit. She has shown to have matured and everytime that she goes back, it is Ian Flynn's writing and blatant favortism towards Sally and nothing else. Amy routinely fights the battles and she routinely suceeds in her missions. Even if you call her out on the games, she has shown more character than Sally. Amy finds a bird that fell out of the sky. Amy nurtures the bird. She is chased by a robot that is after the bird throughout her adventure. She asks Sonic for help and shows annoyance with Sonic*gasp*. She even protects a robot that saved her life when Sonic didn't. Sonic Adventure 2, she shows more character and saves the world by compelling Shadow to fight. The characters don't acknowledge it, but the viewer has to be blind not to see it. Screw Flynn. Amy isn't the mindless fangirl that he makes her out to be. She is a competent fighter that even puts fear into your avatar. If he can't see that, then he probably shouldn't be writing for Amy anymore.

What has Sally done individually? Compell a Council who half of was already in her favor to begin with? She handles the political nonsense in Acorn? Yeah, considering that the whole village hates Nicole, Great Job. Leading a band of Freedom Fighters and friends who consist of two physical gods(Sonic and Knuckles), two great mechanical geniuses(Tails and Rotor), and a small army of extremely competent fighters(everybody else)? Yes, really impressive. People give her way too much credit and we are forced to say, "Without Sally, they wouldn't have a chance" or that is atleast what the writer wants us to think when in reality, Eggman isn't too concerned about her when it isn't she who messes up his plans. It is Sonic, Tails, Shadow and Team Dark, or Knuckles and his Chaotix team that deals the heavy damage to his empire.

[Sega DogTagz]

Disobeying orders occassionally is one thing, but why should he be following orders from some obviously corrupt officials(*cough* Elias and papa Acorn*cough*).

9 times out of 10, those orders point Sonic right to Eggman's doorstep. Even if Sonic was out on his own, he'd basically be doing the same things he is doing now.

[Vertekins]

The Anti Sally-Sue club on DA already made extremely convincing and extremely well compiled and well thought-out evidence as to why Sally Acorn is a Black Hole Sue. And it's clear as day these days in the Archie comics that Sally's being put on a pedestal and Amy's reputation amongst the head writers is nothing more than an amalgation of wankdom towards Sally and complete obliviousness towards Amy's development.

Hell, even Issue 222's cover is nothing more than blatant SonSal with a purposefully placed Amy as if to snipe at her and the SonAmy fans in all of Archie's praising of their OTP.

[CrownSlayers Shadow]

Sorry I am probably not reading it correctly but are you saying they should utilize the comics characters more or that the games could really take some ideas from the comics? If it's the latter then I totally agree!

It's the latter. As of now, we have a fair amount of characters to compare to the comics, and I don't think we should directly bring the comic charcters into the series. Maybe influenced, like they tried with Chronicles, but keep the other comic characters in the comics.

[Badnik Zero]

Favoritism is a funny word. Sally debuted in the comic 28 issues before Amy did, and is central to SatAM setting and plot. Meanwhile Amy only appears for the Sonic CD adaptation, and proceeds to be unimportant for the entire classic run of the game series except playable appearances in games like Sonic R. Guess who of the classic cast didn't appear in the Sonic OVA even though it starred Metal Sonic? She was losing to another princess then too. Amy just wasn't important until 1998, when they chose to return her to the love interest/typically female "power of heart" character type before confusing her already shallow role with attempts at overbearing girlfriend humor. So tell me how do you write in a character that's never been important, in order to make her important, and get accused of favoritism because one of the main cast can't be bumped to support your favorite ship? No matter how shallow Sally might be, Amy will be shallower. She might as well be Mina Mongoose for all her history in the book.

Edited April 7, 2011 by Dabnikz

[turbojet]

9 times out of 10, those orders point Sonic right to Eggman's doorstep. Even if Sonic was out on his own, he'd basically be doing the same things he is doing now.

Sonic is not so helpless that he can't figure out where the hell Eggman is. Shit, it is not like the guy doesn't leave a giant factory everywhetre he goes. A fuckin' mall rat can tell you where the hell Eggman is if he is around. He is really distinguishable. He doesn't try to play hide & seek. And those orders point Sonic at Knothole's enemies and not just Eggman. Any help defeating Eggman could be entailed to Tails or anybody else who just happens to be around. Why should the Kingdom that made Eggman who he is and put him power even dare to stop him?

Dabniz, let us do a comparison here. Amy has been in several media, almost every game since Sonic CD, Sonic X(comic and show), Fleetway, and this comic series. All of which has been fairly recent.

Sally: SATM and this comic book which has been based on a show that has been gone since 1995.

And Dabniz, I have been anti-shipping in regards to this series since day one. So drop the accusation that I just want to have Sonic and Amy shack it up. I have said this so many times that it is ridiculous. I am defending Amy's position in regard to what the writer said and at the same time accusing Flynn of favoritism towards Sally since he doesn't see her as an issue, but Amy is.

Edited April 7, 2011 by turbojet

[Mangoaxe5]

Bloody hell. I can't even remember now, just how long has this legal mess been going on between Penders and Archie? It feels like forever already.

It's been going on for a while now. It started July 7th of last year. I don't see Penders winning this case now that his attempt to get the case thrown out has failed.

[The Conductor]

So, Ixis' beef is that HE is the true king of New Mobotropolis, same as before. Except...King Acorn swore the Kingdom of ACORN to Ixis, this is an entirely new, and separate crown. All Ixis really has a claim to is the nuclear slag that was once Mobotropolis!

[Sega DogTagz]

Sonic is not so helpless that he can't figure out where the hell Eggman is. Shit, it is not like the guy doesn't leave a giant factory everywhetre he goes. A fuckin' mall rat can tell you where the hell Eggman is if he is around. He is really distinguishable. He doesn't try to play hide & seek. And those orders point Sonic at Knothole's enemies and not just Eggman. Any help defeating Eggman could be entailed to Tails or anybody else who just happens to be around. Why should the Kingdom that made Eggman who he is and put him power even dare to stop him.

But Either way they are fighting Eggman. Who cares that Elias/Sally/Ect is the one calling the shots. The only difference is that Sonic has a few extra hands on his side, which according to the SATAM roots, is not a bad thing.

[Rynnec]

But Either way they are fighting Eggman. Who cares that Elias/Sally/Ect is the one calling the shots. The only difference is that Sonic has a few extra hands on his side, which according to the SATAM roots, is not a bad thing.

Because Sonic isn't the the one to be loyal to a Kingdom, which is what people like Turbojet are talking about.

[Sega DogTagz]

Because Sonic isn't the the one to be loyal to a Kingdom, which is what people like Turbojet are talking about.

Edited April 8, 2011 by Sega DogTagz

[Kuzu]

Which stems from an overdose of Sega Sonic Ideology.

Archie/Satam Sonic has no qualms with it and we shouldn't hold the Sega interpretation against him for it. They are different characters after all.

Sonic's barely loyal as it is anyway. As I pointed out earlier he has committed a laundry list of treason half a mile long. His rap sheet is probably second only to Eggman.

[SBR2]

Am I like the only one who notices absolutely no difference between SEGA and Archie Sonic they're the same character people Archie Sonic lives in a kingdom yes but he still has a personal rivally with Robotnik, he's still the primary character, he's still the one everyone gushes over, there have been several times he has went against direct orders he's not the Kingdom of Acorn's puppet Sonic is still a free spirit even more so under Ian Flynn than he ever has been before.

[Sega DogTagz]

If the comic is based on Sonic, then he should act like his game counterpart right?

Down at the core maybe, but just because they are drawn from the same source, doesn’t mean that they will be 100% 1 for 1. Nobody here will look as Satam Sonic and see all same qualities as his game counterpart. Sure they are both heroes, but how they think and act in certain situations can be miles apart at times.

That's like being ok with Superman being a jerk in one interpretation, and letting it go, because "Its another continuity", should we be ok with the Flanderization of some of the characters in Sonic X then, because they're different characters right?

At the same time, we can be okay with AOSTH Sonic putting on a dress and parading in front of Robotnik. At the same time we can be cool with AOSTH Robotnik building a bouncing raccoon cannon. Neither of those fit into the game cannon, but rather into the cannon that was established by that particular TV show. They are different characters because there are different authors/animators at the helm of each iteration.

What is OOC for Sega Sonic is not necessarily OOC for a Sonic of another interaction. Appling the same strict rules for each iteration would be too narrow of a mindset. Each Sonic is fundamentally different. If you don’t like a particular interaction of a character, that is one thing, but it is foolish to hold the expectations of one iteration over another. Especially when the primary medium has less space to fill than the ones following suit.

I don't mean to sound rude but, the comics are supposed to represent Sonic based on the source material, and like what has been said many times, Sonic doesn't let anyone dictate his actions, and will fight based on what HE thinks is right, and not on the behalf of a kingdom that can barely keep its citizens under control. He's an Adventurer that goes where the wind takes him and helps out wherever he can, he's not supposed to be tied down to one place because his girlfriend needs him.

Why does everyone try to pin Sonic’s freedom to fight on his own terms against Archie Sonic. We have seen again and again (recently even) that no-one but Sonic in the Acorn Kingdom has the final say on what he ultimately does and does not do. Nobody in that city stops Sonic from choosing right from wrong for himself. He chooses his own fights and his own path.

The comics seem to be more of a loose adaption of Satam anyway. That was pretty liberal with its interpretation of Sonic in the first place.

Am I like the only one who notices absolutely no difference between SEGA and Archie Sonic they're the same character people Archie Sonic lives in a kingdom yes but he still has a personal rivally with Robotnik, he's still the primary character, he's still the one everyone gushes over, there have been several times he has went against direct orders he's not the Kingdom of Acorn's puppet Sonic is still a free spirit even more so under Ian Flynn than he ever has been before.

Thank you for pointing out the free spirit thing. I feel that a lot of people ignore it just because he lives in proximity to royalty.

Well, if you want an immediate difference, look no farther than how he interacts with his friends. Archie Sonic has much more of a dependence on the people around him. He has had to lean on several of them from time to time and actually confides in a few people here and there as well. Game Sonic can’t usually be bothered to stick around his friends for too long (long time no see, guys) and is an infallible pillar of strength and ideology. Archie Sonic can get shaken up a bit from time to time, but Game Sonic is really set into stone regarding his ways.

Long story short, Archie Sonic is built up in a way to receive more from the characters around him (which is understandable considering the larger Satam main cast). Game Sonic is more inside out, which is easier to pull off with the limited airtime he gets.

Or you can just look at his libido. Many iterations of Sonic are willing to stop for a week or two in order to pick up some arm candy, but game Sonic is always in motion (save for the rare instances with Rouge)

Edited April 8, 2011 by Sega DogTagz

[The-Master-Board]

I'm sorry. The title of the series is called, "Sonic the Hedgehog." Do I see any mention of Sally the Princess Squirrel and Sonic the Hedgehog? No. "Do I see Sonic and his Cassanova tendencies?" No. As far as I'm concerned, Sally really shouldn't be a key character at all, but she is and I deal with it. As for saying Sally has personality. I don't buy it. I already hate that there is a institution that Sonic has to oblige to and I already hate that Sonic isn't the adventurer that he claims to be. Here comes the argument of "Sally keeps Sonic from being Scourge." If Sonic has too much free time, he might go bad. Really? I rather have Sonic be the universal hero that he should be. I rather have Sonic fight for what "he believes his right" and not have a master of his own. Disobeying orders occassionally is one thing, but why should he be following orders from some obviously corrupt officials(*cough* Elias and papa Acorn*cough*).

As for Sally's personality versus Amy. Hahahaha. NO. Amy being defined as a fangirl stalker is bullshit. She has shown to have matured and everytime that she goes back, it is Ian Flynn's writing and blatant favortism towards Sally and nothing else. Amy routinely fights the battles and she routinely suceeds in her missions. Even if you call her out on the games, she has shown more character than Sally. Amy finds a bird that fell out of the sky. Amy nurtures the bird. She is chased by a robot that is after the bird throughout her adventure. She asks Sonic for help and shows annoyance with Sonic*gasp*. She even protects a robot that saved her life when Sonic didn't. Sonic Adventure 2, she shows more character and saves the world by compelling Shadow to fight. The characters don't acknowledge it, but the viewer has to be blind not to see it. Screw Flynn. Amy isn't the mindless fangirl that he makes her out to be. She is a competent fighter that even puts fear into your avatar. If he can't see that, then he probably shouldn't be writing for Amy anymore.

What has Sally done individually? Compell a Council who half of was already in her favor to begin with? She handles the political nonsense in Acorn? Yeah, considering that the whole village hates Nicole, Great Job. Leading a band of Freedom Fighters and friends who consist of two physical gods(Sonic and Knuckles), two great mechanical geniuses(Tails and Rotor), and a small army of extremely competent fighters(everybody else)? Yes, really impressive. People give her way too much credit and we are forced to say, "Without Sally, they wouldn't have a chance" or that is atleast what the writer wants us to think when in reality, Eggman isn't too concerned about her when it isn't she who messes up his plans. It is Sonic, Tails, Shadow and Team Dark, or Knuckles and his Chaotix team that deals the heavy damage to his empire.

Oh man, after seeing the awesome that was the teaser trailer for the new Sonic game that looks like everything I want I made a personal swear that I wouldn't bitch on Sonic stadium for a whole day. Unfortunately your idiotic post has made me break that promise.

First off using your logic this series should be called "Sonic the hedgehog his Two tailed sidekick and the evil scientific genius Robotnik" and that's simply for starters.

Just because it's called Sonic the hedgehog doesn't mean the comic book should have every single second of every minute, every panel of every page about Sonic. Your logic simply fails. So because Sally isn't in the title she shouldn't be in the comics or have a major part? Yeah right ok whatever you say. I'd love to see the series if you made it: Sonic the hedgehog featuring the eponymous Sonic and nobody else!

How do you expect characters to even get any development if everything is entirely Sonic centric? The very flaws you critisize characters for you would be enabling by having a comic only ever develop the protagonist and nobody else. Sally shouldn't be a key character, but what reasons do you give? I see none other than the fact you don't like her.

Second. I'm guessing you've never actually had a girlfriend? Or if you have she did a real number on you! Let me get this right. If I start dating a girl she has the ability to magically change me from my beliefs of say, me being a opinionated Atheist into some devout sky person worshipper.....just because we're dating....and like because I totally lose all my free will because dating equals being under some kind of personality limiting/changing spell?

How exactly does the fact that Sonic and Sally have feelings for each other/date equal Sonic automatically not being himself? Sure I'll admit that in every realtionship some small changes occur to people, but it's hardly like a complete personality lobotomy. In real relationships people actually stay for the most part who they are. Sonic and Sally are no different.

Point out to me exactly where Sonic is this little bitch to the Kingdom of Acorn, or better yet where he would've done something different to what he did had he not been infatuated with Sal? All I see is Sonic being Sonic. The needs of the Kingdom usually fall under people needing a hero and to be saved, and the traits of Sonic describe him as a hero, and then he fills that need. I seriously doubt Sonic has ever done anything that has been ordered of him by the kingdom that he didn't agree with. He is a hero, he is a member of the kingdom, he is a hero of the kingdom, he is not however some mindless soldier who will just take orders. Sonic still adventures and Sonic still does his own thing, just in this medium he has a love interest he likes to come back to or be around.

I think you are really deluded.

Now let's not get into a Sally vs Amy war. I like Amy, not as much as most characters, but she is still cool. That doesn't stop the fact that she was always created and has always been as such since; a fangirl. You call bullshit on it? Well look at the games. Sonic CD's story description practically states it. That Amy was Sonic's biggest fan. Amy's motivation throughout the entire games has always been so she can be closer to Sonic. She turns up in games simply because she has been looking for him! Then in some games even goes so far as to be creepy by telling Sonic there's no way he can get out of marrying her. Yeah not a fangirl stalker at all.

In the comics I admit that Amy is actually developing quite well, I like the independence and leadership that she shows, she's still a little psychotic (see her #222 plotting to win Sonic after he bores of Sally plot) but in the comics she comes off as a lot better. Oh and Amy does NOT put fear into Nack! The fact that was added is hilariously stupid! Nack is a badass and shouldn't be frightened of the likes of Amy! Like he said himself "I've taken down Sonic before"

As for Sally, the fact that you even compare her to Amy let alone think Amy's personality is better is laughable. Sally doesn't stalk Sonic. At times Sally isn't even sure she likes Sonic. She doesn't know if he is good for her, she doesn't know how things with them will work out what with her being a princess and him being so reckless. She has feelings, she doesn't act on them. There was always a certain chemistry between Sonic and Sally because both were headstrong and never wanted to be the first to show weakness by revealing their feelings towards the other. Sonic and Sally went through all the begining of everything with Robotnik and the Freedom Fighters together, they were even childhood friends. The personality practically is on display!

You wanna talk personality. Sally gives up Sonic because she knows her kingdom will need her more even though it hurts her to do it. She later gives up a sure thing with Monkey Khan to pursue that love again in the off chance it still exists because she has grown and has learnt to cope with the stresses her title brings. She's a princess yet she still fights, is a tomboy, defiant in the face of image.

What has Sally done? You say she leads a band of two "practically demi-gods" two geniuses and a band of good fighters but you say it as though it's an insult, like it's a disgrace to her personality. Well have you ever thought that this might be just the opposite? Ever read the Avengers? Ever wonder why Captain America, the guy who essentially has no powers beyond peak human abilities manages to lead a team of superpowered meta-humans and gods themselves? It's called personality, it's called leadership. It's the ability to strategise and co-ordinate a team of big persoanalities. Just because you have a team of powerful fighters, powerful thinkers and overpowered super-dudes doesn't mean you'll always win. It takes a great leader to keep all those personalities in check, keep morale up and organise everything into a solid plan.

Without Sally a lot of the time you'd have a ragtag team with no guidance. Hell even Sonic needs sally's advice sometimes.

People give Sally credit because credit is due.

I laugh at your little crusade against Sally though

If you really wanna see her dead just go back and read End Game over and over again.

Edited April 8, 2011 by The-Master-Board

[Flyboy Fox]

Sigh. I really hate how personal people on both sides of the Great Sally Debate make things. You'd think the other person had slept with your mother, run over your dog and stolen your bestest most amazing fancharacter all in one afternoon. I'm all for debate, but things HAVE gotten out of hand over the whole Sally argument, and too many times this thread has become less "Archie's Sonic the Hedgehog" and more "Sally Lovers VS Sally Haters, Round 9,023".

So, you know... chill. Has it been said already (most likely yes)? Then don't repeat it for the twenty-fifth time. Has it not been said (unlikely but possible I suppose)? State it in a calm and rational manner without personal attacks or sarcasm.

To everyone else? PLEASE talk about other things related to the comic so that this thread can be of interest to all Archie Sonic fans and not just those obsessed with the Great Sally Debate.

Thank you and goodnight (;

[\Lennox]

OOOOOOKAAAAAY, on a lighter note, any of you guys have a picture of Angry Shadow from SU #1?

_{Please? Anyone at all have it? WUT}

[Your Vest Friend]

OOOOOOKAAAAAY, on a lighter note, any of you guys have a picture of Angry Shadow from SU #1?

_{Please? Anyone at all have it? WUT}