Megathread Archie Sonic Main Discussion

[bwrosas]

That still sounds less like Mega Man and more of Power Rangers, in all honesty.

 

 

EDIT: Not that PR is bad, mind you, it just doesn't seem appropriate for a crossover that celebrates two franchises that almost have nothing to do with either of them.

 

But it would be getting more use out of their Robotized masters forms than what has been shown.  And people/readers/subcribers wouldnt' have seen it coming.

[DarkLight]

As I stated before, having them roboticized longer than they were would've meant less time to shine and actually contribute something to the plot and to actually kick some ass after being used for most of the crossover.

[Potada]

Power Rangers: Mecha Mobians.

 

...I actually wouldn't object to that idea.

[Dantemustdie00]

As I stated before, having them roboticized longer than they were would've meant less time to shine and actually contribute something to the plot and to actually kick some ass after being used for most of the crossover.

Yeah, that and I rather the comic not suffered the stupidity of certain Anime and Manga's like Dragon Ball Z that don't make any progress at all in a number of episodes.

[goku262002]

Yeah, that and I rather the comic not suffered the stupidity of certain Anime and Manga's like One Piece that don't make any progress at all in a number of episodes.

There, made you sound less dated due to the fact that we have DBZ KAI now and those jokes are void.

[Mauro Fonseca]

kai isn't mana from heaven, pacing issues from the manga are still present

[Dantemustdie00]

kai isn't mana from heaven, pacing issues from the manga are still present

Exactly, plus I specifically said both Manga and Anime in my post. Kai still feels sluggish without the filler, actually.....it feels rather empty without the filler cause I actually liked the Filler in DBZ back when it originally aired on Toonami back in the good days of cartooning.

 

Shoot, most of Shonen Jumps stuff have some snail-style pacing, really puts me off reading or watching their stuff sometimes

[bwrosas]

Fan's Take on 

Why the Weaponization = Vivisection.

 

 

Okay, onto the subject at hand: Mecha Sally getting weaponized. Now, we've all been pushing the idea that whay happened to Sally at the end of 232 was too dark for the comic, simply because she's standing their, conscious, while Eggman takes a blowtorch to her face.

Now, since we know that Robians have their senses intact, and are simply unable to control their bodies. So Sally was not only forced to watch her body get carved up, but she was also able to feel it. Yeah, what the fuck, Flynn. Was this really necessary? No, of course not. There was absolutely no bloody reason to do this. Sally's death at the start of Genesis was unnecessary, yes, but at least it did raise the tension a bit. This, on the other hand... There are some things that you don't put in stories like this. One of them is take a blowtorch to a hero's face while she stands there, unable to stop it from happening, able to see it coming, and feel what happens to her. That's just... barbaric. While I do hate 172 more than the Mecha Sally arc, this event is, without a doubt, the worst thing Flynn has ever produced for the comic. Especially since, like 172, it was entirely unnecessary. If Sally was able to perform as she does in the comic without weaponizing, I could buy that. It wou;dn't be badly written, in fact, it would be better if she wasn't weaponized, since then it wouldn't be a case of her being the worst ultimate weapon ever.

Now, recently, the idea has been passed around that she was not cut apart, but instead, her weaponizing is actually just a shell added to her, and if one were to remove it, her form from 230-232 would be found underneath. Now, I would love to believe this, and go along with this theory, except for a few things:

1) Eggman used a blowtorch. You can say he used it to weld the armour on, but she's still going to feel that.

2) Her proportions and size do not differ that heavily from her base form. If anything, her feet are smaller. Furthermore, her new shell is much smoother to look at, with her lips completely merging together when her mouth is closed. It is also riddled with ports that can open up for her new weapons. If it was simply added armour, then there would not be enough space to contain all of her weapons.

3) On a similar path, the brain laser. Now, adding a hidden gun to her head is not simply a case of adding a barrel and being done with it. She also needs the firing mechanisms, the power supply/ammo, the cooling systems, pistons and hinges to lift up her 'hair' so that the gun can extend out, etc, which all boils down to a distinct lack of space in her head for other things like, I dunno, a brain/processor? And this just happens to be the lead-in for the introduction of the girlier-looking SEGA Sally, who seems to have no problem with wearing the remains of her Mecha Sally shell as clothing, despite where it came from... yeah, maybe that explains it.

4) Again, we have something similar. THe Power Ring Matrix. Now, aside from the stupidity of Eggman being able to just find a 'modified' Power Ring (How the fuck do you modify a gold hoop of metal and energy? With Flynn-brand plot convenience, of course.) that somehow reinforces brainwashing instead of of curing it, then being able to replace it with another Ring that was actually used to de-brainwash someone (Ken, in this case) with no ill effects, this thing is all that's powering Mecha Sally. Anything that would normally be doing this job is not present, which generally amounts to her roboticized heart. This part has been either disconnected or removed entirely, otherwise she would have still been able to keep fighting after the Ring died. Oh, yes, after about a week, the ring burns out, severely limiting her lifespan from now. This is also despite the fact that when someone, usually Sonic, actually uses a Ring's power as opposed to just using it to shield against mind control, it tends to burn out in about 30 seconds. And yet Eggman decides to use one, which he only has one of, to power Mecha Sally. THe only reason she's not lying on a table with her torso opened up while Eggman tries to find another Ring is because he just happened to be fighting the one character in the whole book with a Power Ring on his person.

5) The presence of things like the brain laser and the Power Ring Matrix within Sally's body means that he had to cut her open to get them in. The brain laser is inside her head. He had to at least scalp her to get it in. And he had to remove/disconnect the original robo-heart and squeeze the Power Ring Matrix in there.

6) There are too many cosmetic changes to her head, like the completely smooth face and muzzle, the lack of eyelids, and the completely different hair shape (Which is lower than her original, leaving even less space for the brain laser), etc, show that he has obviously modified her actual body.

So there you have it: Six reasons why Mecha Sally MkIII is the darkest, most out of place thing in this whole run of the comic.

Edited June 28, 2013 by bwrosas

[Kuzu]

Nothing to see here folks, just more fans complaining about Sally. Move on.

[The Tenth Doctor]

Is it me or is Shadow really looking bad? Nothing wrong with him becoming a robot master & him leaving after, but now he seems to have his ass handed to him in every panel. Not a show stopper but it's kinda weird to notice.

[Kuzu]

Is it me or is Shadow really looking bad? Nothing wrong with him becoming a robot master & him leaving after, but now he seems to have his ass handed to him in every panel. Not a show stopper but it's kinda weird to notice.

 

Yea. This is something I noticed about how Ian writes Shadow in general recently, he doesn't seem to take the character very seriously anymore. I like it when he has the piss taken out of him once in a while because I get a good laugh out of his reactions, but generally it just seems like he shows up to be made the fall guy in some way. Either he gets smacked around by other characters, or Sonic is taking the piss out of him. He has his moments here and there, but generally speaking he's just mostly fodder. 

 

He's like how Sega treats Knuckles in the main games ironically enough.

[Soniman]

Didn't Shadow kick Metal Sonic's ass and troll a god back in his own arc though?

 

Also it's been awhile since we seen Shadow back in the main comics (like when Enerjak came back I think) so I think it's a bit to early to pull out the fodder card.

 

And also he was pretty great during the Treasure Team Tango arc.

Edited June 29, 2013 by Soniman

[Kuzu]

Didn't Shadow kick Metal Sonic's ass

 

Technically Metal kicked his ass first, then he teamed up with Blaze & Marine with the latter blowing up with a cannon.

 

and troll a god back in his own arc though?

I count that more of a Team Dark moment considering the plan hinged on Omega...and Shadow didn't do much beside talk shit. It was pretty cool tho, but that was four years ago(holy shit time flies.)

Edited June 29, 2013 by Azure Yakuzu

[Mauro Fonseca]

how much of it is ian, considering sega's been actively trying to downplay shadow

[Marcello]

Have they?

[Mauro Fonseca]

In the specific case of the comic, there's been at least one case of him wanting to use Shadow, presumably seriously, and being refused (The Eggman arc, it was meant to be Shadow and not Omega)

[Kuzu]

how much of it is ian, considering sega's been actively trying to downplay shadow

 

If that is the case, then its hilarious considering how they treated him in the past. 

 

 

So he's either a spotlight stealing overpowered whore, or a glorified punching bag. Good job Sega :V

[CrownSlayers Shadow]

Geez, Sega never seems to know of the concept of a "middle ground," do they?

[Your Vest Friend]

That case was a bit different though. In most cases, while Shadow may appear to get beat down for part, he still comes through and succeeds (or they, if he's working with someone). In SU#38, he would have been required to fail, which it seems SEGA wasn't willing to do for Shadow.

[Vertekins]

Fan's Take on 

Why the Weaponization = Vivisection.

 

Okay, onto the subject at hand: Mecha Sally getting weaponized. Now, we've all been pushing the idea that whay happened to Sally at the end of 232 was too dark for the comic, simply because she's standing their, conscious, while Eggman takes a blowtorch to her face.

Now, since we know that Robians have their senses intact, and are simply unable to control their bodies. So Sally was not only forced to watch her body get carved up, but she was also able to feel it. Yeah, what the fuck, Flynn. Was this really necessary? No, of course not. There was absolutely no bloody reason to do this. Sally's death at the start of Genesis was unnecessary, yes, but at least it did raise the tension a bit. This, on the other hand... There are some things that you don't put in stories like this. One of them is take a blowtorch to a hero's face while she stands there, unable to stop it from happening, able to see it coming, and feel what happens to her. That's just... barbaric. While I do hate 172 more than the Mecha Sally arc, this event is, without a doubt, the worst thing Flynn has ever produced for the comic. Especially since, like 172, it was entirely unnecessary. If Sally was able to perform as she does in the comic without weaponizing, I could buy that. It wou;dn't be badly written, in fact, it would be better if she wasn't weaponized, since then it wouldn't be a case of her being the worst ultimate weapon ever.

Now, recently, the idea has been passed around that she was not cut apart, but instead, her weaponizing is actually just a shell added to her, and if one were to remove it, her form from 230-232 would be found underneath. Now, I would love to believe this, and go along with this theory, except for a few things:

1) Eggman used a blowtorch. You can say he used it to weld the armour on, but she's still going to feel that.

2) Her proportions and size do not differ that heavily from her base form. If anything, her feet are smaller. Furthermore, her new shell is much smoother to look at, with her lips completely merging together when her mouth is closed. It is also riddled with ports that can open up for her new weapons. If it was simply added armour, then there would not be enough space to contain all of her weapons.

3) On a similar path, the brain laser. Now, adding a hidden gun to her head is not simply a case of adding a barrel and being done with it. She also needs the firing mechanisms, the power supply/ammo, the cooling systems, pistons and hinges to lift up her 'hair' so that the gun can extend out, etc, which all boils down to a distinct lack of space in her head for other things like, I dunno, a brain/processor? And this just happens to be the lead-in for the introduction of the girlier-looking SEGA Sally, who seems to have no problem with wearing the remains of her Mecha Sally shell as clothing, despite where it came from... yeah, maybe that explains it.

4) Again, we have something similar. THe Power Ring Matrix. Now, aside from the stupidity of Eggman being able to just find a 'modified' Power Ring (How the fuck do you modify a gold hoop of metal and energy? With Flynn-brand plot convenience, of course.) that somehow reinforces brainwashing instead of of curing it, then being able to replace it with another Ring that was actually used to de-brainwash someone (Ken, in this case) with no ill effects, this thing is all that's powering Mecha Sally. Anything that would normally be doing this job is not present, which generally amounts to her roboticized heart. This part has been either disconnected or removed entirely, otherwise she would have still been able to keep fighting after the Ring died. Oh, yes, after about a week, the ring burns out, severely limiting her lifespan from now. This is also despite the fact that when someone, usually Sonic, actually uses a Ring's power as opposed to just using it to shield against mind control, it tends to burn out in about 30 seconds. And yet Eggman decides to use one, which he only has one of, to power Mecha Sally. THe only reason she's not lying on a table with her torso opened up while Eggman tries to find another Ring is because he just happened to be fighting the one character in the whole book with a Power Ring on his person.

5) The presence of things like the brain laser and the Power Ring Matrix within Sally's body means that he had to cut her open to get them in. The brain laser is inside her head. He had to at least scalp her to get it in. And he had to remove/disconnect the original robo-heart and squeeze the Power Ring Matrix in there.

6) There are too many cosmetic changes to her head, like the completely smooth face and muzzle, the lack of eyelids, and the completely different hair shape (Which is lower than her original, leaving even less space for the brain laser), etc, show that he has obviously modified her actual body.

So there you have it: Six reasons why Mecha Sally MkIII is the darkest, most out of place thing in this whole run of the comic.

 

I fail to see why Mecha Sally is a particular point of contention regarding the implications about what Eggman's done to her when we all know that her restoration is a foregone conclusion, that Roboticized Mobians don't even feel pain like their fleshy counterparts (Roboticization is acclaimed for the way it toughens-up Mobians, how do you think Knuckles fought Mecha Sonic?). I also disagree that it Flynn's biggest mistake (The House of Cards arc is that) and Robians were often depicted as having weapons as a result of the roboticization process rather than augmentation.  And I disagree that it's the darkest thing in the book when there's been this;

 

 

and this;

 

 

You're just taking the "Dan Drazen" approach by looking for things in this comic that aren't there and making a big deal about your 'findings' when it's not a profound work with this level of detail.

[yippie]

That case was a bit different though. In most cases, while Shadow may appear to get beat down for part, he still comes through and succeeds (or they, if he's working with someone). In SU#38, he would have been required to fail, which it seems SEGA wasn't willing to do for Shadow.

 

Shadow never needed help beating or defeating opponents back in the day, it was the other way around with him saving others necks at the last minute while they were getting whooped. He's getting the Vegeta treatment nowadays.

[DarkLight]

Anyone up for more Bates-goodness?

 

 

EDIT: Spoilerd for courtesy's sake.

Edited July 1, 2013 by DarkLight

[Spin Attaxx]

Love how Sonic's like "what kind of pitch was that?!" and Strike Man's deep shame.

 

And Drill Man's Oh Crap at the Dive Missile.

 

Actually, I think Bates does better expressions than Yardley. I love the Met and the Motobug angrily headbutting each other and Dr. Light's all "whatever".

Edited July 1, 2013 by Spin Attaxx

[DarkLight]

Yeah, Sonic's expression was basically, "Dude, really? You're using a baseball against ME?" Also loved Light's expressions of "WTF?" to, "Bitch, please. I have no time for this."

 

Said it before, but I'll say it again. It was definitely a good choice to save Bates for last IMHO.

 

EDIT: Also, LOL'd at Sonic running over Ring Man, grab his rings, and be all like, "Huh? Hey, these aren't like mine!".

Edited July 1, 2013 by DarkLight

[Echidna Adventurer CC14]

It's that time again! We're inching towards endgame, folks!

Expect the usual in a bit.