Megathread Archie Sonic Main Discussion

[Mando-Whirl-Wind]

you could easily argue that Flynn is doing with this arc what he did with a ton of penders stuff, which is clearing it out and making it relevant

[Soniman]

I wonder how different the new universe's character will become from the old universe that  we will start calling them oldArhcie!Knuckles and newArchie!Knuckles or something 

[CrownSlayers Shadow]

I don't mind the Black Arms as aliens, personally. Actually, I don't think they were handled poorly, necessarily, but they were kind of forced in and the general timeline felt like it had to have some twisting done to make everything work (the crappy localization doesn't help matters). I have more of an issue with Gerald's role in the whole thing because we just don't get much or any insight about first making contact with Black Doom to the GUN Raid to his eventual imprisonment/loss of sanity and presumably quietly reprogramming Shadow for revenge. Maybe if you could've collected diary notes--think the "Ansem Reports" from the Kingdom Hearts games--just stuff to make the scenario and Shadow's history in the game universe make a little more sense.

If this was all fleshed out better before ShTH I might have thought differently of the Black Arms coming into the picture. Do what Battle sort of did with Gerald's Journal, make mentions of their being something before, except he actually knows about the Black Arms; make things ambigous over who may have helped him in creating Shadow before revealing it in the next game, and this might have worked better.

 

I don't really know that for sure, because ShTH has a lot more work needed to even make it acceptable beyond improving its story. Which is why I suggest a GUN splinter group because you could simply build off of the small snippets already done in SA2; why did we have an Eclipse Cannon? Because the splinter group wanted more destructive weapons. Why was the ARK a secret facility for WMDs? Because the splinter group set it up that way. Why create Shadow? Because they wanted a new kind of weapon, maybe a template for a new kind of soldier. And why did they lock up and execute Gerald? Because he either outlived his usefulness and/or they wanted to keep their activities in the dark until the time was right and they needed a scapegoat for their activities.

 

And then come around ShTH, you just reveal the splinter group as they make their global power grab going by what was already there instead of using what was there but now with world conquering aliens. I'm not against aliens in this series, but the Black Arms in the games just really hit a sour note with me looking back in hindsight.

[Your Vest Friend]

Black Doom can't be used as an active character due to mandates. Flash backs are different. Just a prompt.

[Komodin]

Black Doom can't be used as an active character due to mandates. Flash backs are different. Just a prompt.

 

Hmm, I wonder what's the mandate for this case. "No blatant references to generally panned games?"

[Your Vest Friend]

Hmm, I wonder what's the mandate for this case. "No blatant references to generally panned games?"

 

Given that Eggman Nega is under the same sweep, I doubt it. Maybe it's to do with villains they aren't sure what to do with or something.

[Mando-Whirl-Wind]

though apperently Gemerl(or was it emerl cant remember which was rebuilt) now exists and lives with Cream and Vanilla, although that was a mention and not a full apperance

[Dejimon11]

Black Doom can't be used as an active character due to mandates. Flash backs are different. Just a prompt.

Even though sonic rush came out 9 years ago and we've seen Nega in various spinoffs

[Zaysho]

Black Doom can't be used as an active character due to mandates. Flash backs are different. Just a prompt.

 

Huh, didn't realize that. Man, some of these mandates are just weird. I guess using a new faction of the Black Arms makes sense then.

 

 

If this was all fleshed out better before ShTH I might have thought differently of the Black Arms coming into the picture. Do what Battle sort of did with Gerald's Journal, make mentions of their being something before, except he actually knows about the Black Arms; make things ambigous over who may have helped him in creating Shadow before revealing it in the next game, and this might have worked better.

 

I don't really know that for sure, because ShTH has a lot more work needed to even make it acceptable beyond improving its story. Which is why I suggest a GUN splinter group because you could simply build off of the small snippets already done in SA2; why did we have an Eclipse Cannon? Because the splinter group wanted more destructive weapons. Why was the ARK a secret facility for WMDs? Because the splinter group set it up that way. Why create Shadow? Because they wanted a new kind of weapon, maybe a template for a new kind of soldier. And why did they lock up and execute Gerald? Because he either outlived his usefulness and/or they wanted to keep their activities in the dark until the time was right and they needed a scapegoat for their activities.

 

And then come around ShTH, you just reveal the splinter group as they make their global power grab going by what was already there instead of using what was there but now with world conquering aliens. I'm not against aliens in this series, but the Black Arms in the games just really hit a sour note with me looking back in hindsight.

 

Well, I haven't played Battle in full, so I wasn't even aware of Gerald's Journal in that game, but I do see what you're saying (though for the sake curiosity, where exactly does Battle fit in canon? I was under the impression that, despite being released earlier, it took place after ShTH because Shadow seems more clear on his own purpose compared to ShTH, at least from what I played).

 

I must say that your take on what the Black Arms should've been is interesting though, and it would definitely shed light on things surrounding the mystery of the ARK and Project: Shadow. Honestly if I was much of a writer at all, I'd probably steal that and try to work with it That said, I don't think fleshing it the Black Arms (as they actually appeared, I mean) when they reveal themselves in ShTH would've been an issue. Out of left field? Sure. Out of place? Not really, IMO. It'd require a total overhaul of ShTH's main narrative as well as an overhaul of how the various scenarios can play out, but I don't think it's something that's necessaily impossible. But I suppose that's all moot given that the game's been released and we're stuck with what SEGA gave us. Still worth thinking about some more (don't be surprised if I send you a PM picking your brain about it at some point).

[Red Hot Jack]

I still don't get the thing about Nega. He is always mentioned when the plot is about alternate realities, sometimes when Blaze is involved, and Captain Whisker said he works for him, at this point it's pretty clear they want to use his Rush incarnation.

 

Maybe there's hope; if not, why mention him at all in PPP?

[Big Panda]

though apperently Gemerl(or was it emerl cant remember which was rebuilt) now exists and lives with Cream and Vanilla, although that was a mention and not a full apperance

I doubt they'de mention him as a still living/existing character if they whern't going to use him. Why bring him up only for a future scene at Cream and Vanilla's house to make no indication of the sort that he's there?

[Emerald Chaos]

Is it just me or has poor Ian spent more time in this book having to clean things up and reorganize than actually just tell stories?

 

Must be frustrating having to deal with that sometimes.

[antyep]

Penders sure knows how to make a mess.

[Fletch]

It's that time of the month again! Mysterion's Sonic The Hedgehog comic review post! 

 

Ahem! So, finally got issue #258 in the mail! Story thoughts in spoiler one, favorite moments in spoiler two. 

 

Okay, well, story still moving nicely along. It's still like last issue with the Freedom Fighters working together (which I love to see), but this time the chase is on to rescue Professor Pickle and Uncle Chuck (no, literally!) There's really nothing big that happens in the story. I mean, the problems are still somewhat small, and I'm fine with that since I'm sure the more things the team will tackle will continue to lead up to the point where they understand how to restore the world and have to deal with bigger and badder things that'll come their way. I do like E-106 Eta design. Eta sure is looking a bit beast in my honest opinion. Appearing and pretty much just attacking without caring what collateral damage is being done is a plus. I'm extremely excited to see next issue seeing how the final page says "Sonic vs. E-106 Eta" is happening next issue. I'm going to assume some big explosions, nice thrash talk (coming from Sonic, at least), and probably Professor Pickles and Uncle Chuck getting in a bit more trouble, but they'll be rescued in the end. I think the action and team work in this action is really what shines the most...along with Professor Pickle and wanting them sandwiches.

 

This issue really had a lot of moments that I loved... Though, I'll try and choose a few. 

 

 

You just have to love the old man. XD

 

 

You only had ONE job, Sonic... 

 

 

Amy is a beast!  Piko Power FTW! 

 

 

AAAANNNNNDDDDD.... Amy still just can't win. XD

 

 

Oh, Sonic... Never change...

[CrownSlayers Shadow]

 

Well, I haven't played Battle in full, so I wasn't even aware of Gerald's Journal in that game, but I do see what you're saying (though for the sake curiosity, where exactly does Battle fit in canon? I was under the impression that, despite being released earlier, it took place after ShTH because Shadow seems more clear on his own purpose compared to ShTH, at least from what I played).

It has to come after ShTH by that fact alone. As for where is a question of "how canon is Battle?" because that's the debatable part as much as I'm fond of the story.

 

I must say that your take on what the Black Arms should've been is interesting though, and it would definitely shed light on things surrounding the mystery of the ARK and Project: Shadow. Honestly if I was much of a writer at all, I'd probably steal that and try to work with it  That said, I don't think fleshing it the Black Arms (as they actually appeared, I mean) when they reveal themselves in ShTH would've been an issue. Out of left field? Sure. Out of place? Not really, IMO. It'd require a total overhaul of ShTH's main narrative as well as an overhaul of how the various scenarios can play out, but I don't think it's something that's necessaily impossible. But I suppose that's all moot given that the game's been released and we're stuck with what SEGA gave us. Still worth thinking about some more (don't be surprised if I send you a PM picking your brain about it at some point).

I wouldn't mind if you stole it just as long as you acknowledged that I brought the idea up. Now as for how you execute it is entirely in your court.

 

As for the Black Arms, I wasn't saying that they were ever out of place. As I said before, if this was done earlier during SA2 I probably wouldn't be ranting against them and would likely have a different view of them. My beef with the Black Arms is primarily to do with how they came out of left field as far as Shadow's backstory went prior to their introduction. I've no problem with aliens being part of the series, such as the Wisps or the other Twilight Cage residents in Chronicles, but it's mostly a matter of execution with any idea you bring up.

 

 

 

 

 

You only had ONE job, Sonic... 

 

I get the feeling this is going to be my favorite scene in this issue.

[Zaysho]

It has to come after ShTH by that fact alone. As for where is a question of "how canon is Battle?" because that's the debatable part as much as I'm fond of the story.

Well, I won't argue the level of canonicity, I just wanted to know, roughly, where it fell. I don't think (most) Sonic games directly feed into each other, even when there appeared to be a much looser connection between everything prior to Colors. Though perhaps I'm seeing that because everything prior to Colors was the last time anyone not Sonic and Tails had a major role.

 

I wouldn't mind if you stole it just as long as you acknowledged that I brought the idea up. Now as for how you execute it is entirely in your court.

Hey, I'm a pencil monkey, not a writer, I don't see myself being able to competently put together a story that complex (or any story, honestly) without it being more of a clusterfuck... though if you ever get a script going, maybe I can do something with it

 

As for the Black Arms, I wasn't saying that they were ever out of place. As I said before, if this was done earlier during SA2 I probably wouldn't be ranting against them and would likely have a different view of them. My beef with the Black Arms is primarily to do with how they came out of left field as far as Shadow's backstory went prior to their introduction. I've no problem with aliens being part of the series, such as the Wisps or the other Twilight Cage residents in Chronicles, but it's mostly a matter of execution with any idea you bring up.

Nah, I feel you. I'm just saying that, despite being out of left field (and boy howdy were they) I just think things can pick up quickly if the narrative of ShTH was allowed to introduce them properly and give some context to Gerald's dealings with them and any alterations he made to Shadow's memory/programming leading up to the events of SA2 (he obviously made some alterations to counteract Doom, and he may have used Shadow's trauma of seeing Maria gunned down as a way to alter him further for the purpose of revenge when Gerald went insane). Even just collectible journal material or something of that nature that have some effect on how Shadow progresses through the story as he learns what really happened would've helped a lot.

 

The main problem, for me, was that we're told Shadow's memory is supposedly a mess, but we're shown he hasn't really forgotten much--he's mostly fuzzy on the details of his time living on the ARK and what his purpose really is (interestingly enough, the Shadow we know was maybe only awake on the ARK for maybe less than a week before the GUN raid). Black Doom coming and filling in the details that Gerald evidently removed from Shadow's memory (Doom even outright says this, I believe) just made him more confused and desperate to get the real answers any way he could (even if that meant teaming up with Doom himself).

 

As far out of left field the aliens are, and I'm not implying you automatically hate the idea of aliens, I think not having any real hints prior to their debut is what makes them and their connection to Shadow all the more interesting. We're just as confused as Shadow then, and get to uncover all that stuff with him. Then again, I'm probably giving Sonic Team too much credit in that regard, since it's clear they were making up Shadow's backstory as they went along. As I think about it, it would've been interesting if the existence of the Black Arms and Doom's involvement in perfecting Project: Shadow was discovered by Rouge just like how she discovered the Biolizard back in SA2.

[Dejimon11]

Is part 3 of shadow fall out yet?

[Your Vest Friend]

It's been out a while. I bought it last week.

[Dejimon11]

Well my comic store is behind i went this past weekend and they didn't have it. Hopefully Wednesday they'll get it

[Pearl98]

The comic orders were late this week, and they didn't come until yesterday, sadly, i didn't get the chance to go to the comic shop to pick up SU #61... Oh, and STH #258's out this week

[Toby]

My copy of Shadow Fall part 3 just came in the mail from midtowncomics, so it's out there.

[CrownSlayers Shadow]

Same here. I just got back from reading it from Barnes and Nobles.

[leemour84]

I ordered mine off ebay in the u.k :-) should be here soon.

anyone fron the u.k who has trouble finding a place ebay is best I go through acecomics on there :-) hope it helps

[goku262002]

Any 5-page previews as of late?

[Your Vest Friend]

The Sonic Stadium is up to date as of writing. If there's one due out, it'll either arrive in the next 24 hours or be up next week.