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As a quick notice because I know we have collectors in here, Archie currently has the exclusive Comic Con Variant for Sonic #251 (Worlds Collide Part 12) on their store on sale for $5. Which roughly translates to £3.50 in the UK (This isn't counting P&P though, which Archie are an absolute rip off with if you live outside of the US)

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Personally, I think Archie's current financial and logistical difficulties entitles them to more than a little bit of understanding.

Here's a fun fact - IDW has suffered delays and cancellations just as much as Archie has. There was a point where More Than Meets the Eye disappeared off the shelves for two months and Sins of the Wreckers has a hiatus coming as well.

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21 minutes ago, Razorsaw said:

Personally, I think Archie's current financial and logistical difficulties entitles them to more than a little bit of understanding.

Its hard when they're making some really questionable decisions as to were their limited funds are going. *cough1000pagerscough*

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I don't know if it was the fault of the hiatus or what but when the final issue of the Silver Age finally hit my Books-A-Million and I bought it I was kind of like "Meeehhh..."

It was far better than that really badly written SU Arc Silver had before but I for some reason I felt this one petered out a bit. It's a good thing I still enjoyed it. 

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I think what sorta killed my interest in Silver Age was that the Council was immediately brushed away for the Second Devourer and that it just-oh-so-happens-to-be-the-same-monster that ruined Gold's world.

Though Gold's uninspired backstory is another factor in Silver Age's mehness  

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56 minutes ago, TheFatPanda said:

Its hard when they're making some really questionable decisions as to were their limited funds are going. *cough1000pagerscough*

* cough vomit* WorldsUnite*coughVomit*

Woo, need  some water. 

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God. You know, my opinions on the Sonic Universe arcs are all over the place. I really don't think the 4 issue format is working for the kind of stories he keeps trying to tell with them. Since I'm feeling particularly bitter I'll focus on my favorite characters and their story arcs to explain my position here. 

I thought I would like the Chaotix Quest because it was supposedly supposed to be about my three favorite homeboys but instead it ended up being about Mighty, whom I couldn't really care much for and the story beats leading up to them finding him weren't all that spectacular and didn't offer much in lue of interesting interaction or diverse character moments. It was mostly a lot of explaining between the two story set pieces they presented with a really rushed and kind of weirdly handled emotional punch at the end.

The Sonic Universe arcs have been a lot better for me since the reboot though. The Great Chaos Caper was the total opposite of Chaotix Quest for me. Sure, it was still relying on the popularity of Knuckles to carry the Chaotix forward but their character moments and interactions were a lot more entertaining. Not to mention, Charmy got to actually do and say things now that the whole offensive mental reduction to his brain thing had been undone (on top of the side swiped genocide of his entire family and kingdom on top of the loss of his best friend and girlfriend soon after).

But then there's something like Shadow Fall, where I'm not sure what I think about it as a whole. It had some very weak and tired troupes within it, like the stupid mind-control bit with Shadow (and the really intelligence insulting "Shadow's Gone Evil?!" cover that came with it). But I also think it did a good job of developing Eclipse as well as his master, Black Death. And yet I also think it's morals were a little confused because despite Shadow's justification for wiping out the Black Arms, the way he went about explaining why all of them should die didn't come off sounding right to me. Unlike with Black Doom, when Black Death was killed I felt a little unclean. Also, Rouge was nothing but Team Dark's Team Mom in that arc. Going to full time G.U.N agent in these comics drastically reduced the originality behind her character.

And then there's Pirate Plunder Panic which was just awful. The whole way through it was just really badly written. 

Oh and The Second World Collide! Goddamn that was worthless. I really loved the old one. It had my favorite fight in the entirety of these comics with Sonic and Megaman vs. Metal Sonic and Base (mostly because the fight was an entire issue long and it got a chance to breathe and have ups and downs as well as a lot of creative beats leading up to a spectacular ending). 

But this second one was just sludge. Ugh. 

Sorry but if Sigma was supposed to sell me on him being a badass there, mission failed.

And holy shit the Deadly Six were there too! I was actually interested in seeing how they'd enter the comics world but they just kind of... showed up. Again. Just like in Lost World with NO explanation except it was worse because they're literally just expendables here. 

So I don't know. I've been enjoying the comics recently far more then I did before the reboot but that's probably because familiarity with the characters is restored a bit more for the better concerning the way I got into the series. 

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2 hours ago, TheFatPanda said:

 

56 minutes ago, Dr. Chaotix said:

God. You know, my opinions on the Sonic Universe arcs are all over the place. I really don't think the 4 issue format is working for the kind of stories he keeps trying to tell with them. Since I'm feeling particularly bitter I'll focus on my favorite characters and their story arcs to explain my position here. 

I thought I would like the Chaotix Quest because it was supposedly supposed to be about my three favorite homeboys but instead it ended up being about Mighty, whom I couldn't really care much for and the story beats leading up to them finding him weren't all that spectacular and didn't offer much in lue of interesting interaction or diverse character moments. It was mostly a lot of explaining between the two story set pieces they presented with a really rushed and kind of weirdly handled emotional punch at the end.

The Sonic Universe arcs have been a lot better for me since the reboot though. The Great Chaos Caper was the total opposite of Chaotix Quest for me. Sure, it was still relying on the popularity of Knuckles to carry the Chaotix forward but their character moments and interactions were a lot more entertaining. Not to mention, Charmy got to actually do and say things now that the whole offensive mental reduction to his brain thing had been undone (on top of the side swiped genocide of his entire family and kingdom on top of the loss of his best friend and girlfriend soon after).

But then there's something like Shadow Fall, where I'm not sure what I think about it as a whole. It had some very weak and tired troupes within it, like the stupid mind-control bit with Shadow (and the really intelligence insulting "Shadow's Gone Evil?!" cover that came with it). But I also think it did a good job of developing Eclipse as well as his master, Black Death. And yet I also think it's morals were a little confused because despite Shadow's justification for wiping out the Black Arms, the way he went about explaining why all of them should die didn't come off sounding right to me. Unlike with Black Doom, when Black Death was killed I felt a little unclean. Also, Rouge was nothing but Team Dark's Team Mom in that arc. Going to full time G.U.N agent in these comics drastically reduced the originality behind her character.

And then there's Pirate Plunder Panic which was just awful. The whole way through it was just really badly written. 

Oh and The Second World Collide! Goddamn that was worthless. I really loved the old one. It had my favorite fight in the entirety of these comics with Sonic and Megaman vs. Metal Sonic and Base (mostly because the fight was an entire issue long and it got a chance to breathe and have ups and downs as well as a lot of creative beats leading up to a spectacular ending). 

But this second one was just sludge. Ugh. 

Sorry but if Sigma was supposed to sell me on him being a badass there, mission failed.

And holy shit the Deadly Six were there too! I was actually interested in seeing how they'd enter the comics world but they just kind of... showed up. Again. Just like in Lost World with NO explanation except it was worse because they're literally just expendables here. 

So I don't know. I've been enjoying the comics recently far more then I did before the reboot but that's probably because familiarity with the characters is restored a bit more for the better concerning the way I got into the series. 

Oh my go I hate this sites quoting system I have to frigging retype this

I liked Plunder panic, and I though the chaotix Caper one was pretty neat, jokes on point. And I suppose you kind of have to come to terms with knuckles carrying those dudes around. Ironically enough, I'm going to in the new couple paragraphs explain why its a bad Idea for other characters. 

You mention shadow fall, I think its fine in many regards, but it is very very flawed. It is a shining example, and the next thing i'm going to mention of why team dark kind of don't need to exist and the sort degradation of rouges character. So ok, so because this is a children comic about animals , i'm going to ignore the continued flaw of bringing spies, on assault missions. And get to the biggest problem, communication. Shadow is... going through some stuff, and... no one says anything. The most rouge says required shadow to have to almost murder her to get it out of her. And when it was shown shadow was being mind controlled her rant immediately proved to be irrelevant, because shadow was good the hole time. She didn't say anything when her boss, told him not to trust him, she said barley anything when he entered a literal space faring monument to his self loathing. So you can see why I found rouges attempt at like an emotional moment at the end to be... fake? By the number, " Oh you made it back from the explosion, I must be mad at you like generic girlfriend to-be character" like if she showed she cared the whole time, that may have had an effect. Shadow in this comic was just, dragging people around, and all it did was raise questions on why people weren't talking to the guy. And it isn't as if he wouldn't listen, people break it down to shadow all the time. He's actually pretty good at it, you have to be if you don't like talking. But , no... just nothing. You call her mom, but moms care, she didn't do shit. 

Like if you wanna see shadow do a cool thing, sure the comic is fine. But if you like the rest of team dark or have an actual interest in the story , the lack of communication brings it down. To be honest, the whole comic, if it was just shadow, stealing a ship , flying to the meteor, fighting the aliens off by himself, breaking the mind control ( all of which he does in his game ) and then killing the guy and the eclipse escapes. And then he has to tell gun and rouge, and then rouge is upset because he let some of those aliens get away and it could have been handled with help. That would have effectively tough shadow a lesson, that would have been actual introspection , instead this comic just showed how useless gun and team dark actually are. 

All this said, total eclipse is worse. Not only does it suffer from , the same communications issues, it suffers from more communication issues because not only does rouge continue to just not address the black and red alien elephant in the room. just addresses knuckles island situation... which in comparison is kind of fine. Knuckles protects the master emerald, he likes doing it. Don't know why you needed to talk about that instead of that guy who had his mind controlled by alien, who is on this island, and he almost killed you. One seems way more pressing than the other. That's horrible, and then her and omega job out and all her character can do instead of being proficient at fighting or something. Is tell the knuckles and shadow to stop being silly, yep... that's her character. " I can't actually do it , so I yell at men to do it for me" not like a cool super spy, nope. Not to mention the giant ass plot holes, in which twice shadow could have ended the problem,

 

Why didn't shadow use the master emerald to stop time and kill eclipse, with chaos blast like with his boss. 

Why didn't shadow use the master emerald to go super shadow and kill eclipse

Why didn't in the subsequent fight with knuckles, on the hypothetical it still happened, didn't shadow just teleport back to the emerald, wait for knuckles to get back would have been absorbing chaos energy the whole time, Knock him out, then kill eclipse when he could come back 

Why didn't knuckles just agree to move to an undisclosed location, where gun didn't even know. Solving his problems of not trusting gun, and watching out for eclipse. 

Why didn't knuckles actually trust shadow more given in this time line shadow the hedgehog happens, and he witnessed shadow murder his own family to protect the world, the thing he just lost giving him a prospective on how serious shadow is about this

Why didn't they just hide, wait for eclipse , pop out, and jump him. 

All this ignored, so they could push a fight between characters who in all honestly don't really have reasons to fight. Heck in sonic runners, he kind of seems like he wants to talk to him. But that's another thing entirely , my point is not only did it suffer the issues of the previous arc, it also has the problems of trying to fit way too much into the arc, and trying to push something that really isn't there. Who's outcome we saw from the get go, and who's entire plot could have been solved with ease. 

I done talked my head off about this, so I'm not going into worlds unite as you mentioned, but it just seems like a lot of meddling and trying to do too much with very little materials. And some of those materials... sort of unnecessary ( why are the archie characters even around during this ) you know that edgelord fight between the two edgelord kings of sonic and mega man we promised in that poster, one of em explodes so that don't happen. Also nothing does, no one really gets to do much of anything and you will question who was this crossover for in the first place. 

I could go one about worlds unite, but I don't think i'm treading unfamiliar waters, most folks reactions to it was.. " this shit is awful " so, so one has probably explained my points more eloquently somewhere else. 

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2 hours ago, Dr. Chaotix said:

God. You know, my opinions on the Sonic Universe arcs are all over the place. I really don't think the 4 issue format is working for the kind of stories he keeps trying to tell with them. Since I'm feeling particularly bitter I'll focus on my favorite characters and their story arcs to explain my position here. 

I thought I would like the Chaotix Quest because it was supposedly supposed to be about my three favorite homeboys but instead it ended up being about Mighty, whom I couldn't really care much for and the story beats leading up to them finding him weren't all that spectacular and didn't offer much in lue of interesting interaction or diverse character moments. It was mostly a lot of explaining between the two story set pieces they presented with a really rushed and kind of weirdly handled emotional punch at the end.

The Sonic Universe arcs have been a lot better for me since the reboot though. The Great Chaos Caper was the total opposite of Chaotix Quest for me. Sure, it was still relying on the popularity of Knuckles to carry the Chaotix forward but their character moments and interactions were a lot more entertaining. Not to mention, Charmy got to actually do and say things now that the whole offensive mental reduction to his brain thing had been undone (on top of the side swiped genocide of his entire family and kingdom on top of the loss of his best friend and girlfriend soon after).

But then there's something like Shadow Fall, where I'm not sure what I think about it as a whole. It had some very weak and tired troupes within it, like the stupid mind-control bit with Shadow (and the really intelligence insulting "Shadow's Gone Evil?!" cover that came with it). But I also think it did a good job of developing Eclipse as well as his master, Black Death. And yet I also think it's morals were a little confused because despite Shadow's justification for wiping out the Black Arms, the way he went about explaining why all of them should die didn't come off sounding right to me. Unlike with Black Doom, when Black Death was killed I felt a little unclean. Also, Rouge was nothing but Team Dark's Team Mom in that arc. Going to full time G.U.N agent in these comics drastically reduced the originality behind her character.

And then there's Pirate Plunder Panic which was just awful. The whole way through it was just really badly written. 

Oh and The Second World Collide! Goddamn that was worthless. I really loved the old one. It had my favorite fight in the entirety of these comics with Sonic and Megaman vs. Metal Sonic and Base (mostly because the fight was an entire issue long and it got a chance to breathe and have ups and downs as well as a lot of creative beats leading up to a spectacular ending). 

But this second one was just sludge. Ugh. 

Sorry but if Sigma was supposed to sell me on him being a badass there, mission failed.

And holy shit the Deadly Six were there too! I was actually interested in seeing how they'd enter the comics world but they just kind of... showed up. Again. Just like in Lost World with NO explanation except it was worse because they're literally just expendables here. 

So I don't know. I've been enjoying the comics recently far more then I did before the reboot but that's probably because familiarity with the characters is restored a bit more for the better concerning the way I got into the series. 

To be fair, a few of the post reboot arcs weren't even written by Ian. Oh, and I actually liked Rouge a hell lot better post-reboot.

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1 hour ago, shdowhunt60 said:

To be fair, a few of the post reboot arcs weren't even written by Ian. Oh, and I actually liked Rouge a hell lot better post-reboot.

To be fair to what exactly? The opinions expressed above range from positive to middling to negative so I'm not sure what particular aspect is being defended. I also didn't say anything about Ian so I'm a little confused as to why who wrote what matters when it comes to this. 

I will say that Rouge is one of the few characters liked more before the reboot. If only because of the ambiguity they were going with her before the hero assimilation she succumbed to later.

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Just now, Dr. Chaotix said:

To be fair to what exactly? The opinions expressed above range from positive to middling to negative so I'm not sure what this is trying to defend. I also didn't say anything about Ian so I'm a little confused as to why who wrote it matters when it comes to this. 

I will say that Rouge is one of the few characters liked more before the reboot. If only because of the ambiguity they were going with her before the hero assimilation she succumbed to later.

You did call out Ian in the first paragraph. Unless "he" collectively refers to him, Alleah-Baker, Tracey Yardley!, and Evan Stanley now.

And I seriously hated Rouge before the reboot. You know, it's fine for her to get into a bit of trouble here in there, but she was out-right malevolent before the reboot. And I honestly hated her. If there's anything "Team Mom" about her now, it's because she actually cares about people's wellbeing, which IS more true to her original character.

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1 hour ago, shdowhunt60 said:

You did call out Ian in the first paragraph. Unless "he" collectively refers to him, Alleah-Baker, Tracey Yardley!, and Evan Stanley now.

And I seriously hated Rouge before the reboot. You know, it's fine for her to get into a bit of trouble here in there, but she was out-right malevolent before the reboot. And I honestly hated her. If there's anything "Team Mom" about her now, it's because she actually cares about people's wellbeing, which IS more true to her original character.

He or they. Whoever's fault it is doesn't matter. The point was that the 4 issue format doesn't work with the kind of stories being told with the Universe story-line. I'm still not sure why who wrote it matters though. 

The only instance I can recall of her malevolence going too far would be the Treasure Team Tango arc where she didn't want to let the Sol emerald go. Other then that, I thought she walked the line fine. There were plenty of characters I hated that are gone now too, which is another plus for me. 

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1 hour ago, shdowhunt60 said:

I don't know why it matters either, you're the one being defensive right now. 

First of all, no I wasn't. You're reading my posts in a defensive tone.

Second, this statement is a little confusing as well. If I actually had been defensive I'm not sure why pointing that out would correlate back to why who wrote it matters. I brought it up because you pointed it out and I explained why it wasn't an issue. Not to mention, I also asked a question about how pointing out that Ian didn't write it was being fair. I'm not sure who it's being fair to or why because my opinions were varied in the post you quoted.

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1 hour ago, shdowhunt60 said:

I only pointed that out, because you singled Ian out, and leveled your criticisms at him, even though he didn't write half of those arcs.

The post wasn't about Ian. It was about the structure of the Sonic Universe story arcs and why they don't work. The one "he" you found in that long quote wasn't tailored to be the heart of the issue and it wasn't for the sake of leveling my criticisms at him but at the writing. If he didn't write most of them then that's fine. I didn't know that. I'm still not sure why it's an issue about being fair when not everything said was a negative criticism though. 

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