What forgotten Sonic characters should be brought back

[BradAric]

Or you could just keep debating and be respectful: you could ask me why I hold that position and ask me how I could change my mind, or ask me something about it that concerns you. I'm a lot of things, but I am definitely not to close-minded to exceptions, and provided you treat me with respect I'm not going to be an asshole towards you.

Really, I'm pretty open to whatever makes sense and is fair here. It's when people start playing favorites is when things start to get rocky, because I don't tolerate that one bit. If anything, I'm actually the one who gets fiery if the debate has any hint of classic (or modern) fanboyism.

Very well...that is something I'm not used to. So I'd like to steal those first two questions from you: Why do you feel those are the only "good" characters, and what would cause you to change your view?

[CrownSlayers Shadow]

Very well...that is something I'm not used to. So I'd like to steal those first two questions from you: Why do you feel those are the only "good" characters, and what would cause you to change your view?

Edited October 28, 2010 by ChaosSupremeSonic

[BlueBlur360]

since there seems to be a big conflict in this forum could someone please tell me what it is there's so much to read and im lazy.

Edited November 2, 2010 by BlueBlur360

[Vulpine]

Marine should come back. She was awesome in Sonic Rush Adventure and it is a shame that she still does not have a VA nor playable role, yet. I know that not everyone likes her, but come on, Marine was way better then Cream. Other Sonic characters I would like to see come back are Mighty the Armadillo and Shade the Echidna (she's from Sonic Chronicles).

[Chaos Walker]

You know what? The president. Yeah, what happened to that guy anyhow? He only RUNS THE COUNTRY! Meh, maybe there hasn't been ocassion for him to show up lately, but the world doesn't have to end for us to see his face.

[Ebby]

I'd like to see Hyper Sonic.

I just remembered how fun he was....

[Uklo]

I'd love more Tikal, not reviving and such stuff but like in Advneture 1, flashbacks and so on.

Tikal still to me, is a good plot point for Knuckles to show up and I just like her.

You know what I also want? Knuckles summoning Chaos out of the Master Emerald and giving him the 7CEs, cause Sonic lost his final battle against Robotnik.

In Sovitet Russia On Angel Island MOTW is played by YOU!

Edited November 6, 2010 by Uklo

[Blacklightning]

Well, I figured I might as well go through a list of the forgotten folks instead of cherry picking a few at random.

Nack/Fang/whateverthefuckhisnameisnow

I wouldn't really have an issue with him returning, but there's a few hurdles for it. Some people consider the popgun way too silly even for the Sonic atmosphere, others consider a genuine gun going a bit too far (personally I'd rather the latter, but that's just me). Another thing is that he's kinda hard to imagine as a playable character without breaking the game (give him a gun and badniks and bosses alike cease to be a threat). At least there's demand for him yet, anyway.

Bean

Extremely underrated. Honestly, you could just make him a green bomb-throwing Daffy Duck and it wouldn't seem terribly out of place. No fuckin' way he would work for a sidescroller though, chances are he'd function best in a 3D game or a spinoff.

Bark

Hm, not so much. It goes without saying that he'll have to show up wherever Bean does, but honestly, he's not nearly as appealing. He'd be a perfect Werehog replacement though, his arms are so fuckin' big that they serve almost the same purpose.

Mighty

Mighty's popularity baffles me, especially considering this is a fanbase that is generally against these kinds of clone characters. But what confuses me more is that the people pessimistic to the character have some kind of strange disapproval to him improving for the better, citing that "it wouldn't be Mighty anymore". What the fuck? Who the hell cares? If Sonic Team can make him something other than a clone and give him gameplay more unique to the character, what right do you have to complain? Fucking hell. I'll admit I don't exactly hate Mighty if only because I could see what could come of him if he's brought back, but all the same, justifying it would be pretty difficult for several reasons - namely obscurity and his established pacifist tendencies.

Ray

I could see him gliding in much the same way as Knux does, but otherwise, Ray doesn't really deserve it. He's even more obscure and flat than Mighty is, which is really saying something.

Metal Knux

No fucking question about it, he needs more love. Hell, pair him up with Metal Sonic and make them a duo, I'd hit it.

Tails Doll

Y'know, for all the memetic creepiness this character's already spawned, I'm kinda amazed it hasn't netted him another appearance yet, not even as a background prop or something. A playable role is almost certaintly out of the question if only for the fact that, well, his gameplay sucks (well okay, maybe I could see him playing a non-mainstream role, like a Riders appearance or something else of the spinoff nature), but as an NPC, joke boss or even background decoration, hell, I'd like to see him again.

Chaos (Zero)

Not as a mainstream role, that's for sure. When they threw him into Sonic Battle it felt like the most massive shoehorning you could ever imagine - granted, it could have been done better, but all the same I feel like it'd kinda ruin the closure that SA1 gave him. Make him an unlockable noncanon character or a multiplayer addition like they did in SA2 and I wouldn't complain. Like Bark, he'd make a neat Werehog replacement too, a bit moreso because he had stretchy limbs long before the Werehog ever did.

Tikal

I like Tikal more, mostly on account of her actually having a discernible personality, but the same stuff still applies. If she got another mainstream role it wouldn't make much sense to me, and it'd just diminish the impact of SA1's ending more. She was by far my favourite treasure hunter in SA2's multiplayer though, and I'd love to see some non-serious roles from her again. What I do want to see from her is some of that "ball of light" stuff she did in SA1 explored as an actual game mechanic, floating through the air and going through walls and other such crazy spiritual shit, if only to make her less of a Knux clone in practice. Incidentally I never really understood how dreadlocks are supposed to make you glide.

E-102 Gamma

Gamma's dead, and Omega serves just about every purpose Gamma could've these days had he survived. As emotional as his story was, some people just have to let it go and move on, especially considering we already have a practical clone of him in his footsteps. Even as a multiplayer cameo he wouldn't make much sense.

Silver

Maybe it's a bit early to consider him "forgotten", but considering the bad rep he got just by existing in Sonic '06 it just seems like that's where he's headed right now. He's got a solid enough gameplay scheme to warrant another appearance (even if it could use a bit of tweaking to remove the bugs and fit it to Sonic style a bit more), and hell, just throwing enemies at each other is fucking fun so why not? Only issue is that, well, he's from the future, an alternate, prevented one at that, so short of some spontaneous dimensional anomaly it's hard to tell how he could reappear again. I guess they could just bring a Silver from the new future in and lock him in the present somehow so they don't ever have to deal with that plothole ever again. Yeah, I'd like that.

Mephiles

Yeah, he's as stereotypical as they come. I don't care. I wouldn't mind seeing a bit of expansion. Hell, I'd laugh if they brought in some alternate Mephy that's completely different to what he was in Sonic '06. Like a happy, peppy, Caramelldansen kind of guy with shadow and time powers, ahahaha. But yeah, failing that, cameo roles are fine too. Wouldn't mind a playable multiplayer appearance at least once, he did have some pretty interesting moves demonstrated ingame and it'd be fun to toy around with them - making several clones of himself and making them all perform his biggest move was a massive "OH SHIT" moment as far as his boss fights were concerned.

The Babylon Rouges

Honestly? I'd love to see at least one playable appearance from Jet in a non-Riders game just to see how the mechanics would translate. Yeah, his abilities are kinda vauge, but as long as he used his Gear at high speed I honestly don't think anyone would complain, and if you can throw some wind-based mechanics in with it, all the better. Wave and Storm on the other hand is kinda difficult to justify. Wave more or less does most of the things Tails is known best for, and Storm is just a generic brawler outside of his board, so it's kinda hard to imagine how they'd turn out outside of a Riders game. Maybe they could just show up as NPCs, or act as strikers for some of Jet's moves in his gameplay. Who knows.

The Chaotix

These guys were kinda underdogs to begin with, but I figure they're due for another appearance by now (well, after that massive SONIC ONLY drought a lot of characters are, but that's besides the point). Personally I like Charmy the most for some reason (Espio's alright but just more of the same, Vector... he's like Big to me, but a bit less stupid), but it's kinda obligatory for all three to show up at once so I don't particularly mind. Just vary them a bit so they finally grow out of the clone status they got from Sonic Heroes and we're pretty much set.

[Diogenes]

Some people consider the popgun way too silly even for the Sonic atmosphere, others consider a genuine gun going a bit too far (personally I'd rather the latter, but that's just me).

Simple solution, give him a laser gun. Serious enough to be a dangerous weapon, safe enough to keep the tone from getting too dark. Plus it gives them the option to expand into more fantastic effects; charge shots, reflecting shots, ice beams, all sorts of weird stuff can be justified.

Another thing is that he's kinda hard to imagine as a playable character without breaking the game (give him a gun and badniks and bosses alike cease to be a threat).

Hm, not really. The mechs in SA2 had far better weaponry than one dinky revolver, yet that didn't make them all that much more powerful than the other characters in the game. I can imagine it being not that much worse than the homing attack; give it a single lock-on, a decent range, and a decent delay between shots, and design enemies and bosses that have some sort of defense against it (Egg Pawns with bulletproof shields, bosses with weak points that you have to reveal and/or reach before you can attack, etc). Even if it's still stronger than the homing attack, I figure it'd be a fair trade considering Fang's not as fast or as agile as Sonic.

But what confuses me more is that the people pessimistic to the character have some kind of strange disapproval to him improving for the better, citing that "it wouldn't be Mighty anymore". What the fuck? Who the hell cares? If Sonic Team can make him something other than a clone and give him gameplay more unique to the character, what right do you have to complain? Fucking hell.

The effort needed to make Mighty viable would be almost as much as it'd take to make an entirely new character. And since Mighty offers basically nothing, I'd rather they use that effort either to revive a character that actually has something to offer, or to make a new character that's not tethered down by Mighty's useless restrictions.

[Blacklightning]

Hm, not really. The mechs in SA2 had far better weaponry than one dinky revolver, yet that didn't make them all that much more powerful than the other characters in the game.

Actually it did, because they could literally clear entire screens in an instant - something even the Homing Attack can't keep up with. Not that I don't see where you're coming from, it's just that you used a really bad example there. Admittedly I was thinking about this as far as the 2D games were concerned, which is pretty much an entirely different scenario to how it would play out in, say, an Adventure game where projectiles are a lot easier to justify.

The effort needed to make Mighty viable would be almost as much as it'd take to make an entirely new character.

Which is funny, because that's pretty much exactly what they did with the rest of the Chaotix and they turned out okay. It'd be no less of a hassle than de-cloning Espio or Vector was. Hell, even Tails and Knux were once nearly as similar to Sonic than Mighty is, looks aside of course.

And since Mighty offers basically nothing, I'd rather they use that effort either to revive a character that actually has something to offer, or to make a new character that's not tethered down by Mighty's useless restrictions.

What restrictions? If we're talking about making Mighty worth something, what reason do we have to stick to anything that made the character suck in the first place? This reasoning makes no sense.

[LunarEdge]

I would like to see Mighty come back. I don't care if he was a re-color/edit of Sonic's old sprite or whatever, if done correctly, Mighty would be one of those characters that can actually fit in the newer Sonic games/stories without looking out of place. Hell, I would take him over Vector and Big any day. I can't see Fang, Bean, Metal Knuckles, Tails Doll or Ray fitting in at all in Todays Sonic world and we gotta be realistic here, they're never coming back. I can't imagine a story or scenario where those characters can fit in. Not to mention that Sega whores the crap out of Metal Sonic now, so we are not seeing Mecha Knuckles or Tails Doll any time soon

Btw~ That was not geared towards you Blacklighting, I was just saying is all.

[Diogenes]

Actually it did, because they could literally clear entire screens in an instant - something even the Homing Attack can't keep up with.

Yeah, but you'd still get shot, bombed, and water tentacle raped by anything you didn't shoot in time, right?

Admittedly I was thinking about this as far as the 2D games were concerned, which is pretty much an entirely different scenario to how it would play out in, say, an Adventure game where projectiles are a lot easier to justify.

Well, it's not as if 2D platformers never have projectiles. Some of the same stuff still applies; a slow firing speed, enemies with some defense against bullets, bosses that require more than "just hit it a lot" to win. You can also limit the directions he can fire in; Mega Man does a lot just by limiting Mega to forward shots, which becomes very obvious playing as Bass in MM10.

Which is funny, because that's pretty much exactly what they did with the rest of the Chaotix and they turned out okay. It'd be no less of a hassle than de-cloning Espio or Vector was. Hell, even Tails and Knux were once nearly as similar to Sonic than Mighty is, looks aside of course.

All those characters had traits to build off of, though. Espio changed colors and could walk on walls, thus his ninja invisibility and sticky feet during Triangle Jumps. Vector's a big-ass croc with a love of music, thus his role as a power character and his music-based attacks (plus he and Espio gained a lot of general skills by being forced into Heroes' Speed-Flight-Power templates). Tails could fly as an NPC even before the player could control it, his mechanical interests were introduced early, and he was cemented as Sonic's sidekick from the start. Knuckles had his signature gliding and climbing, as well as his massive strength, from his first playable appearance (which is also essentially his actual first appearance, S3&K being what it is).

Mighty has...what? A shell, a walljump (which now Sonic has too), and a copy of Sonic's abilities? There's a lot more blanks to fill in...and a lot less reason to do it.

What restrictions? If we're talking about making Mighty worth something, what reason do we have to stick to anything that made the character suck in the first place? This reasoning makes no sense.

I'm not saying we have to keep anything that sucks, but if we take out everything that sucks, all we're left with is a name and a face, and if so, what's the point of reviving him in the first place? What reason is there to revive a character, if the end result is nothing like him? It's like Frankensteining your beloved dead wife; it may look like her, but it isn't her.

Mighty would be one of those characters that can actually fit in the newer Sonic games/stories without looking out of place.

Only because he looks like Sonic.

I can't see Fang, Bean, Metal Knuckles, Tails Doll or Ray fitting in at all in Todays Sonic world

How so? What about them is so out of place?

and we gotta be realistic here, they're never coming back.

If we're going to be "realistic", neither is Mighty.

I can't imagine a story or scenario where those characters can fit in.

Fang could be hired by Eggman to capture or kill Sonic, or show up to steal the emeralds for himself. Bean could be a hero simply because Eggman invades wherever he lives and he fights back. Metal Knuckles and Tails Doll can team up with Metal Sonic to fight Team Sonic, same as their purpose in Sonic R.

Ray sucks about as much as Mighty. *shrug*

[LunarEdge]

I'm not gonna argue my point cuz everyone and their mother are going to try to shoot it down anyway

I just like Mighty and all I hear from people are that "He looks like Sonic or He is Sonic" blah blah blah that's all I hear. Sega can easily change the character design up so he doesn't look as much as Sonic anymore, plus we need another animal character that isn't a hedgehog.

Bean looks like a retarded green Daffy Duck if you ask me

Tails Doll was introduced in a crappy game and thus he should stay

Mecha Knuckles... come on Sega just threw him in advance just for the fuck out it

Fang/Nack is a gun wielder and we don't need any of that after ShTH do we?

Ray.... just... Ray

Bark will be cool though

[Blacklightning]

Yeah, but you'd still get shot, bombed, and water tentacle raped by anything you didn't shoot in time, right?

[/implying that the same logic doesn't apply to every other character in the game]

Mighty has...what? A shell, a walljump (which now Sonic has too), and a copy of Sonic's abilities? There's a lot more blanks to fill in...and a lot less reason to do it.

That's not taking into account either his supposed strength or pacifistic nature, both of which could contribute to a moveset just as much as any of the other things you just listed. Hell, even if you were to take just the shell into account, the ability to block is a surprisingly unique trait in the Sonic universe. Maybe he can lift and throw stuff? Maybe he causes small tremors whenever he lands after a certain falling distance? I dunno, say what you will about what there is to work with but it's pretty clear to me that you're not even trying. This ain't rocket science.

I'm not saying we have to keep anything that sucks, but if we take out everything that sucks, all we're left with is a name and a face, and if so, what's the point of reviving him in the first place? What reason is there to revive a character, if the end result is nothing like him? It's like Frankensteining your beloved dead wife; it may look like her, but it isn't her.

So? I've yet to see anybody else disagree with that proposition as far as Mighty is concerned. As long as the end result tops the original, nobody will give a shit and neither should you. It just so happens that the face is the most popular part of the character, and that need be the only thing intact for it to work.

[Diogenes]

I just like Mighty and all I hear from people are that "He looks like Sonic or He is Sonic" blah blah blah that's all I hear. Sega can easily change the character design up so he doesn't look as much as Sonic anymore,

At which point I'd imagine he'd stop looking like Mighty, so, what's the point?

plus we need another animal character that isn't a hedgehog.

How about a weasel? Or a duck? Or a polar bear? Or one of the thousands of identifiable animals that haven't been made into a Sonic character yet?

Bean looks like a retarded green Daffy Duck if you ask me

And Sonic, a retarded blue Felix the Cat.

Tails Doll was introduced in a crappy game and thus he should stay

Is Silver irredeemable just because '06 sucked (even harder than R, I'd say)?

Fang/Nack is a gun wielder and we don't need any of that after ShTH do we?

ShtH's problem wasn't simply that the protagonist had guns. That, in itself, is pretty far down the list. Fang could be a chance to introduce a gun user in a way that isn't an embarrassment to the series.

[/implying that the same logic doesn't apply to every other character in the game]

No, actually, that's kind of my point. In spite of the mechs being able to pepper the room with homing shots, there are still going to be guys you miss and guys that get the drop on you, the same as any other character. Hell, one of the more infamous spots, as I remember it, is during the Cannon's Core 100 ring mission, a room in Eggman's part with just two of those hiding Artificial Chaos, simply because the mechs have no good way to handle it. Their firepower advantage is completely negated, and their clumsy handling and large size mean you're all but guaranteed to get hit unless you come in with a plan.

That's not taking into account either his supposed strength or pacifistic nature,

His strength is questionable, and even if he does have it, plenty of other characters in the series have "being strong" as a trait, so it doesn't do much to give Mighty an edge. And I think his supposed pacifistic nature has been exaggerated; his Japanese profile is just something to the effect of not liking violence but being willing to stand up to protect people, which is hardly more pacifistic than Sonic's usual attitude. Also I'm not sure how being a pacifist contributes to a moveset...

I dunno, say what you will about what there is to work with but it's pretty clear to me that you're not even trying. This ain't rocket science.

Well, y'know, my point was that there's not much to work with, not that nothing can be done. But with so much of it having to be invented from the vaguest of scraps and even out of nothing at all, why waste it on Mighty?

So? I've yet to see anybody else disagree with that proposition as far as Mighty is concerned. As long as the end result tops the original, nobody will give a shit and neither should you. It just so happens that the face is the most popular part of the character, and that need be the only thing intact for it to work.

Maybe his fans won't mind if they see his face stapled on another body, but I simply can't accept that as a good strategy. It reminds me too much of how people would worship Shadow no matter what missteps Sonic Team made with him.

[LunarEdge]

At which point I'd imagine he'd stop looking like Mighty, so, what's the point?

I meant in terms of accessories and maybe shoes that aren't a complete rip off of Sonic's. The face and shell can stay the same for all I care.

And Sonic, a retarded blue Felix the Cat.

Fuck you're Felix the Cat, Mickey Mouse all da way

Is Silver irredeemable just because '06 sucked (even harder than R, I'd say)?

I'm one of those people that believe Silver should have never been used past '06. I even feel that way with Shadow with Sa2

ShtH's problem wasn't simply that the protagonist had guns. That, in itself, is pretty far down the list. Fang could be a chance to introduce a gun user in a way that isn't an embarrassment to the series.

If the bullets are made to be lethal, I'm pretty sure Sonic is going to dodge them all the time seeing how Sonic is not going to see his end at the hands of Fang also for game rating purposes. If the bullets aren't lethal what are going to get? Corks like in Sonic Fighters? Tranqs? Lasers? Than what's the point?

How about a weasel? Or a duck? Or a polar bear? Or one of the thousands of identifiable animals that haven't been made into a Sonic character yet?

I said Bark would be cool, READ CAREFULLY MAH FRIEND!! Cuz Armadillos are AWESOME!!!

[Diogenes]

I meant in terms of accessories and maybe shoes that aren't a complete rip off of Sonic's. The face and shell can stay the same for all I care.

So then he looks like Sonic with bling. Can't say that's doing it for me.

If the bullets are made to be lethal, I'm pretty sure Sonic is going to dodge them all the time seeing how Sonic is not going to see his end at the hands of Fang also for game rating purposes. If the bullets aren't lethal what are going to get? Corks like in Sonic Fighters? Tranqs? Lasers? Than what's the point?

Why not lasers (or some similar technobabble energy pistol)? Like I said before, they're dangerous enough to be intimidating, but "safe" enough that people can still get hit from time to time. There's a reason so many cartoons used them, even if they've made them a cliche in doing so.

[LunarEdge]

So then he looks like Sonic with bling. Can't say that's doing it for me.

Why not lasers (or some similar technobabble energy pistol)? Like I said before, they're dangerous enough to be intimidating, but "safe" enough that people can still get hit from time to time. There's a reason so many cartoons used them, even if they've made them a cliche in doing so.

Either that or yes, they can completely rehash his look and still call him Mighty. I mean, wtf is the big problem here lol, not many people outside big Sonic fans know who he is so why would it matter if he didn't like the Mighty we knew in Chaotix?

[Sega DogTagz]

Why not lasers (or some similar technobabble energy pistol)? Like I said before, they're dangerous enough to be intimidating, but "safe" enough that people can still get hit from time to time. There's a reason so many cartoons used them, even if they've made them a cliche in doing so.

Lasers would work for me. Personally, I always imagined that if he were to ever show up again he'd have nothing more than an over glorified stun-gun and keep his trademarked pop-gun in his back pocket for "emergencies".

[LunarEdge]

I'm getting tired of seeing lasers everywhere... it's getting old. Since It's Sonic I can see him using explosives, like rocket launchers and grenades. Nintendo did it with Snake in Brawl to be "less" lethal and I can see it working in Sonic. Not to mention it would be hilarious to see him pull out a number of explosives out of nowhere.

Sonic:"Where are you getting all those!!?"

Edited November 7, 2010 by LunarEdge

[Aquaslash]

Mighty is supposed to be strong as frag. Even more so than Knuckles. Knuckles has shifted from a strong man to a brawling brute anyway. Plus he has the wall kick, and you can basically have him invulnerable from behind.

There's actually a LOT to do with Mighty. You pretty much can't ruin him. If retooling him requires all this supposed effort, then so be it. It's INFINITELY more acceptable than another new face right now. Do you know how many inactive characters we have? Let's bring these guys back and or give them closure, and THEN introduce new faces.

Also, Metal Sonic is cool and all, but Metal Knuckles is better. Just sayin.

[Core]

Silver

Only issue is that, well, he's from the future, an alternate, prevented one at that, so short of some spontaneous dimensional anomaly it's hard to tell how he could reappear again.

You know he was in the Rivals games? He's no longer from an alternate, prevented future; he's just from the future.

Also I don't see how Silver is a forgotten character at all. His last playable appearance was in a game released just a few days ago.

[The-Master-Board]

I'm pretty much the advocate of any and ALL the forgotten characters returning before we even consider adding more new characters. Well maybe not Ray, he's pretty boring. But I see huge potential for Mighty, Bean, Bark, Metal Knuckles possibly Tails Doll and maybe even Bomb and Heavy. But especially Nack!

I'm getting tired of seeing lasers everywhere... it's getting old. Since It's Sonic I can see him using explosives, like rocket launchers and grenades. Nintendo did it with Snake in Brawl to be "less" lethal and I can see it working in Sonic. Not to mention it would be hilarious to see him pull out a number of explosives out of nowhere.

Sonic:"Where are you getting all those!!?"

Edited November 7, 2010 by The-Master-Board

[Blacklightning]

His strength is questionable

[Core]

Didn't Rivals come out before '06? And have absolutely no connection to it whatsoever? Maybe I'm thinking something else.