SEGA's New Sonic Strategy

[Agent York]

SEGA is ruining their franchise brand. why can't they let the Programmers/developers speak.

SEGA Doesn't believe it has a large fan base that are Excited about Sonic Colors? just by Telling them its for kids, that a lone could cause trouble to sonic colors sales.

their is a lot of passion been put to the game, Sonic 3 similar level design, Wisps are optional, badniks from the old games more than sonic 4, Yellow springs return, water levels return, great music.

i would not trust this guy, first he said black knight is a good game (which is okay since its his opinion) then Free riders is for adults and sonic colors is for kids.

i think the explanations of this would be that I think : iizuka wanted to create a sonic game for the Wii so he told hayes that its going to be for kids so it would sell Just so they could get the development kits for the Wii and Hayes is repeating what iizuka told him.

in any case, Colors is really for Every one That what the developers want. Hayes is so conveinced that its just for kids just because iizuka told him so so that they could publish the game...

such a shame really. i could expect a better answer like 'for kids and adults', does he even realize that this is sonic unleashed without the werehog and more platforming?

wow enough said. SEGA's mind is Destroyed, they can't get it right.

Hayes please stop... Let the developers say that its for Every one for once and for all.

First iizuka says it for kids then changes his mind. then Hayes says its for kids and riders is for adults, then The game's brand manger says its For Kids and fans then Hayes says its for kids.

*sight* Just Let the Programmers/developers speak, i am sure the Actual Programmers/developers/Coders would have said its for every one, its obvious after all, they have unleashed without the werehog and more platforming and old badniks returns and explorations return. its sad such a great job would be ruined by the president of SEGA him self.

I Feel sorry for the Developers of sonic colors. Sonic Team are probably die hard sonic fans and wants to Advertise this game too much but SEGA isn't allowing them, and instead SEGA is telling the fans not to buy it, 'COZ Sonic colors is for kidz and free riders is for adults', I AM NOT EVEN JOKING, HAYES SAID FREE RIDERS IS FOR ADULTS AND COLORS IS FOR KIDS AND SONIC 4 IS FOR THE CORE GAMERS -.-

you know if the Developers (the ACTUAL Developers not Mike Hayes Not iizuka) were able to speak, they would have said 'Colors is for both kids and fans. you know more like mario being for every one and satisfied the fans of the classic mario and kids and sold very well. we are also doing that for colors, making it for every one , classic fans will be happy and fans of the classics will be happy.

probably would have been better better than what SEGA Says now. they Need to let the black knight team speak, Sonic Reputation would have been better this way. Colors is for every one, Mike Hayes is only speaking for the sake of Money, he doesn't know what the black knight is aiming , they are aiming that its for Every one and for the classic fans (PROVE NO WEREHOG DAY TIME UNLEASHED AND MORE FOCUSE ON PLATFORMING), JUST LET THE BLACK KNIGHT TEAM SPEAK, STOP RUINING SONIC'S REPUTATION, SEGA.

I will admit I didn't read all the post, but I can comment on the first point. It's called spokespeople, they speak for the company and/or product and either were chosen/elected/hired to do it by the team/company. Like how Ruby and AAUK also speak a lot as the community managers, those two speak for the game development staff. It's part of their job, and maybe the programmers don't want to speak? With that, they haven't done anything wrong.

Hell I disagree with a lot that Miyamoto says on game philosophies lately and Keiji Inafune (creator of Mega Man, Dead Rising, etc) says on a lot of games and his gaming philosophies too, hell he says he hates his job and just wants to retire soon. However, both make great games, and Colors is shaping up to be a great game, and if this new method means better quality games, who are we to complain about their philosophies if it works for them to bring quality?

Edited October 27, 2010 by Dusk the Wisp Keeper

[speedduelist]

I know they are spoke persons. but they are doing it wrong, the development team is probably not happy of what they are saying.

if a developer step up and explain them self :

'welcome, this is sonic colors. for both kids and fans, kids to sell and inspire new fans while making the old fans of the classics happy. you see we have the old badniks returns! and new levels! you can explore. we also have more platforming, we adressed every issue

instead of :

'colors is for kids. free riders is for adults. sonic 4 is fans., this is our strategy to satisfy every one ^^'

fans would have been much happier. the fact that Hayes thinks its for kids, and he doesn't want it to be heavily advertised 'just because its for kids' despite the fact that it has almost all of what the fans asked for.

its developed that it could be enjoyed for every one and hayes refuses to admits it...

Edited October 27, 2010 by speedduelist

[Badnik Zero]

Pretty much what Flyboy said, but I still have a problem.

See I like kiddie games, but I don't think Sega knows what we really want. When Sega says kiddie I think of lines from Heroes and Sonic X. If they mean a fun cartoony game, good. I love it. Something can be intended for kids and still be awesome. But if this is kiddie what do they think older demographics want? Sega screws this up all the time.

Edited October 27, 2010 by Dabnikz

[speedduelist]

"Where I think we provide Sonic for a younger audience, there we have to take innovation ourselves and try and understand and work out what will be the best game for a more 8 to 12 year old audience," he said. "For the core fans, we definitely want to hear what they have to say about Sonic."

http://uk.wii.ign.com/articles/113/1130518p1.html

I really can't figure what Hayes is saying in this interview in any case..

i might have understood. bu i don't know what SEGA is saying, iizuka said its for Every one for kids to Sell and Enjoy while for fans to Enjoy.

---

Now lets talk about another interview where Hayes says Free Riders is doing what the fans asked for While satisfying the old fans While saying that sonic colors is for kids... :

I hope so. You and I talked about this before with Sonic; we've got this big segmentation opportunity, although it's also a real challenge.

We've got to make games that appeal to the 7-to-12-year-old which is exactly what Colours will do - and then we need to appeal to the core gamer, which is what Sonic 4 is doing.

Riders, funnily enough, is actually where the boundary is grey, and we like to say it will appeal to both. The feedback we're getting from retailers is that because it's branded is very popular both in America and Europe, it's an easier sale when they're talking about Kinect to consumers - "look you've got Sonic".

So whether it's the core gamer that wants Kinect titles that are more gamey or whether it's the animals game-type [type of consumer] I think Sonic fits in between.

So I'm hoping we get a bit of both on that but until we see where Kinect ends up in terms of who is going to buy it, and the price point is interesting, it's difficult to call.

http://www.computerandvideogames.com/article.php?id=255367

SEGA is promoting their titles wrong. the developers probably wants it and are making it for Every one (specially with all of the fan services their). but Hayes seems like he is refusing to advertise or promote sonic colors and generally speaking of the market.

Edited October 27, 2010 by speedduelist

[BradAric]

Guys, listen to yourselves. You don't seem to realize that he's right. The different audiences look for different things. Do we want to play Sonic Colors? Yes. Is the idea gimmicky, bright, etc? Absolutely. Do I want all Sonic games to be like Colors? No.

Someone else illustrated my point in the "Where do you want Sonic to go" thread (or whatever it's called). They talked about how the wisps cannot be carried through all the games and how Sega keeps trying to run and hide from full 3D games. I would like them to keep that separate from their main line of games if at all possible. I want them to work on 3D games.

[Tara]

Guys, listen to yourselves. You don't seem to realize that he's right. The different audiences look for different things. Do we want to play Sonic Colors? Yes. Is the idea gimmicky, bright, etc? Absolutely. Do I want all Sonic games to be like Colors? No.

[Mangoaxe5]

As I said before, I just hope this new strategy doesn't mean that all future Sonic games will be kiddy, and I hope that it doesn't mean the end of Shadow, and Rouge appearing in future Sonic games.

[speedduelist]

Guys, listen to yourselves. You don't seem to realize that he's right. The different audiences look for different things. Do we want to play Sonic Colors? Yes. Is the idea gimmicky, bright, etc? Absolutely. Do I want all Sonic games to be like Colors? No.

Someone else illustrated my point in the "Where do you want Sonic to go" thread (or whatever it's called). They talked about how the wisps cannot be carried through all the games and how Sega keeps trying to run and hide from full 3D games. I would like them to keep that separate from their main line of games if at all possible. I want them to work on 3D games.

Sonic colors is a 3D Game. at any ways, Huge fan service : Tons of Badniks from the old games return , Water Levels , Unleashed day time levels with more platforming , Wisps are made for explorations.

the Wisps are even suppose to appeal to the fans, while the old badniks from the classics and water levels and yellow springs from the old games are suppose to appeal to fans of the classics.

Wisps and sonic games appearing in Colorful Worlds and minimum Real world environment (See planet wisp) appeals to Kids.

But ironically, Hayes is saying Free Riders 'appeals to sonic fans and kids' , 'Sonic colors with old badniks and unleashed day time stages with more platforming and Light heart story line like sonic and tails vs robotnik to save animals isn't appealing to fans'.

[BradAric]

Sonic colors is a 3D Game.

You use bold too often. It doesn't have impact when you're emphasizing every other point you make. Anyway, no, it's not a 3D game. Not really. It has some 3D elements, but it's no Sonic Adventure 2. I'm seeing a lot of 2D sections.

[Chaos Walker]

"Where I think we provide Sonic for a younger audience, there we have to take innovation ourselves and try and understand and work out what will be the best game for a more 8 to 12 year old audience," he said. "For the core fans, we definitely want to hear what they have to say about Sonic."

Lol, judging by Color's reception, we want the same thing as the kids. Just don't make the game about colors and even brooding Shadow Fanboys might buy it. We'd buy Paper Sonic, Sonic's Epic Yarn, Sonic in Wonderland, and the whole lot of it if the games are good.

[blackherox]

I don't really see the problem with saying that Sonic Colours is 'for kids'. It's a pretty indisputable fact that the game was created with a younger target audience in mind. That doesn't mean that it has any less play-value for older fans, just that it was created to be accessible and easily playable by a younger audience.

Every game in existence has a primary target audience. This can be age-specific, genre-specific, gender-specific, hobby-specific, casual-vs-hardcore-specific etc etc. I think it's more a reflection on people's easily wounded pride (oh no, I can't play a game that's aimed at KIDS!) than on poor labelling.

Colours is for 'everyone' in that most fans should be able to get good play-value from it regardless of age. But it was created mostly with a younger audience in mind, to ensure that they will be able to get good fun out of it without being overwhelmed or put off by too-steep learning curves or presented with unsuitable themes, and I think it's perfectly fair and accurate to say that.

This very much this.

Like I said in my above post, practically all developers/publishers do this, it's just Sega has a habit of announcing it.

[speedduelist]

You use bold too often. It doesn't have impact when you're emphasizing every other point you make. Anyway, no, it's not a 3D game. Not really. It has some 3D elements, but it's no Sonic Adventure 2. I'm seeing a lot of 2D sections.

i remember iizuka saying their are stages with more 2d and stages with more 3d.

as far as i have seen from the footages he is right. although I am aware of the balance between 3d and 2d, wait for the final game to judge, we have already seen Stages with tons of 3D or even balance between 3d and 2d while others unbalanced between barley any 3d and little 2d, i hope the game is over all enjoyable.

"Where I think we provide Sonic for a younger audience, there we have to take innovation ourselves and try and understand and work out what will be the best game for a more 8 to 12 year old audience," he said

unleashed day time stages with more platforming and old badniks and Yellow springs...etc elements from the older games is only appealing to kids?

"For the core fans, we definitely want to hear what they have to say about Sonic."

More like :

'you can like it if you want, i just won't guarantee because its for kids, its not for you and this is why we brought back unleashed day light levels and got red of the werehog and added more platforming like the old games.

all for kids'

'thought free riders which the fans didn't ask for, actually appeals to fans of the classics and kids, while sonic 4 is only for fans

this is our huge strategie'

Edited October 28, 2010 by speedduelist

[CrownSlayers Shadow]

How the hell where the Adventures post apocalyptic? If you mean the final battles, they were only one or two levels. Unlike Shadow, in which at least every second level was post apocalyptic. But I don't think we need to beat that horse too much, do we?

There were more than a few levels that weren't apocalyptic ShTH: Mad Matrix, Circus Park, Glyphic Canyon, Digital Circuit, Lost Impact...as a matter of fact, there weren't many levels that fit the tone of being apocalyptic in that game even with Black Arms invading. Only when you were in a city stage or mutated forest could you consider it such.

But if we're going to go along that route, not even Sonic 06 was apocalpytic, having the same structure as the Adventures in terms of the plot, and only two or three levels throughout the entire game that you could consider such.

But regardless, my point still stands. Just because they failed to pull it off in one game doesn't mean they'll fail every other time they do it in future games.

Edited October 28, 2010 by ChaosSupremeSonic

[Rusty Spy]

But ironically, Hayes is saying Free Riders 'appeals to sonic fans and kids' , 'Sonic colors with old badniks and unleashed day time stages with more platforming and Light heart story line like sonic and tails vs robotnik to save animals isn't appealing to fans'.

[speedduelist]

post

Edited October 29, 2010 by speedduelist

[SuperStingray]

Honestly, I have to disagree with about everyone in this thread. It just sounds like that Sega created a game intended for a younger audience and you find it insulting on THEIR part that YOU happen to think it looks good. It sadly isn't as simple as "make a good game and everyone will enjoy it." There's an old saying "chase two rabbits and you end up with none." For better or worse, Classic and Modern Sonic have fundamentally different design philosophies, principles and tones. And face it, Modern Sonic's formula has always seemed intended for kids. (Classic Sonic was as well, but it's more in a timeless way than in a marketing way. It's kind of like comparing Transformers to The Little Prince.) You can ask Sega what you want to see in a Sonic game, but you can't tell them who they should sell it to.

Besides, even if you tried to adapt their better ends, some things would have to be diluted. As long as they can improve their principles on both the ends of the spectrum, I think it would be for the best if they just split it into two sub-franchises under the same name but with different design formulas, creators and perhaps even canon. Sounds drastic, I know, but at this point, I can't see a much better way to get the best of both worlds rather than just the average of them.

Edited October 29, 2010 by SuperStingray

[speedduelist]

when all the fan services in this game indicates that its also for the fans, hayes says no its for kids, but its ok you can express your opinion, core fans.

Mike hayes denies that its for the fans. He never said its for every one, infact he said its for Kids but its ok if the fans like it and free riders is for both fans and kids while sonic 4 is for the core fans.

i see contents old badniks,unleashed day light that indicates that its for the fans too but what mike hayes is saying with all those fan services in the game 'its not necessry for the fans'.

my only complain that Hayes is ruining their brand reputation, Sonic team is doing a great job for fans and kids (Just look how much problems that were adressed and now we get sonic colors)

Look at the old badniks. look at unleashed day light with more platforming

iizuka keeps saying its for kids and fans to enjoy. and they fixed all the problems from the previous games

hayes keeps saying its for kids. we like to hear the fans opinion if they want to express it thought.

that indicated that their is some thing wrong. maybe hayes is trying to Promote Kinect Free Riders by ditching sonic colors out of the core fans hand?

i would like some one to say that their is no thing wrong with the difference of what iizuka and what hayes said. developers are thinking of Quality Between satisfying kids and fans and Hayes is talking about marketing.

Hayes even said free riders is appealing to both kids and fans. while calling sonic 4 for fans.

its a bad theory, now lots of people are going to stop buying this game if the news spread out.

Edited October 29, 2010 by speedduelist

[Flyboy Fox]

Honestly, speedduelist, all you are doing is repeating yourself over and over. We get it. As an aside, littering your posts with bold, italic and underlined paragraphs (mostly bold but I've seen you abuse the other styles too) doesn't make your point any more valid or make anyone pay more attention. It just makes you look like you're shouting and ranting and it puts everyone off. Please try to tone it down a little.

Honestly, I'm not even sure where you're getting the idea that anyone has said that only kids can play Colours. Just because Hayes stated the game is for kids but didn't specifically go on to say that everyone should play it, that doesn't mean he is saying that only kids can play it. He was merely pointing out the Target Audience. Other spokespeople have, as you pointed out yourself, said that the game is aimed at kids BUT everyone should give it ago. There is plenty of publicity for Colours' accessibility and broad overall appeal. You seem to be hung up on one tiny thing and I think you need to let it go, because 99% of the people here (who are mostly not people who would consider themselves to be a 'kid') don't seem to have a problem ^^;

i would like some one to say that their is no thing wrong with the difference of what iizuka and what hayes said.

[Marcello]

I wish SEGA would stop saying the games are for kids. Despite everyone agreeing on this before SEGA said so, everyone gets so angry when SEGA says it.

[Flyboy Fox]

One or two people getting angry and posting the same rant over and over again ad nauseum is not "everyone" getting angry. Only people who are determined to twist the statement into "This game is ONLY for kids and we don't care about older fans or want them to play it!" are getting upset over a simple factual statement.

Like it or not, SEGA are going to market most Sonic games towards a 'kid' audience, because that's where the numbers are. It would be incredibly naive and somewhat arrogant to expect them, in their open daily marketing, to aim their press at a niche group of older gamers. Particularly for a game like Colours which IS meant to be particularly kid-friendly.

I wonder about the people who get so offended by the thought of a Sonic game being labelled as "for kids". I feel like saying "Well, duh." Doesn't mean you can't play it or that there's no fun in it for 'adult' fans. But seriously, do people honestly expect SEGA to try to target Colours to an older niche or to forgo completely the important point that it IS a kid-friendly game?

I really really do not see the problem/issue. If it offends your sensibilities to play a game that's marketed mainly to kids then... that's really your problem more than SEGA's. Ironically, I think that the whole attitude a select few are having about a game being targeted to a younger audience is pretty childish. So, uh, I guess you're okay to play it after all, then (;

[speedduelist]

Honestly, speedduelist, all you are doing is repeating yourself over and over. We get it. As an aside, littering your posts with bold, italic and underlined paragraphs (mostly bold but I've seen you abuse the other styles too) doesn't make your point any more valid or make anyone pay more attention. It just makes you look like you're shouting and ranting and it puts everyone off. Please try to tone it down a little.

Honestly, I'm not even sure where you're getting the idea that anyone has said that only kids can play Colours. Just because Hayes stated the game is for kids but didn't specifically go on to say that everyone should play it, that doesn't mean he is saying that only kids can play it. He was merely pointing out the Target Audience. Other spokespeople have, as you pointed out yourself, said that the game is aimed at kids BUT everyone should give it ago. There is plenty of publicity for Colours' accessibility and broad overall appeal. You seem to be hung up on one tiny thing and I think you need to let it go, because 99% of the people here (who are mostly not people who would consider themselves to be a 'kid') don't seem to have a problem ^^;

Of course different spokespeople have different platforms. Perhaps Hayes was specifically advised (or chose to) to push the fact that Colours is aimed at a younger target audience, and Iizuka's platform was to push the game's broader accessibility. Neither approach is wrong, and neither cancels the other out.

This is silly. You are being incredibly daft and I have faith that the majority of fans don't give a doggie's doodoo about the crazy conspiracy against older fans that you seem to have dreamed up here.

[Kuzu]

Dude, you've said the same thing for 5 pages straight.

[Rusty Spy]

Saying Colors is for only kids, When it seems it appeals to both obviously with old badniks/Unleashed day time with more platforming.

We've got to make games that appeal to the 7-to-12-year-old which is exactly what Colours will do - and then we need to appeal to the core gamer, which is what Sonic 4 is doing.

Point out where Hayes says "for kids ONLY". Because I don't think you are reading the same article that we are.

[Marcello]

What Sonic game isn't for kids?

[batson]

But nobody can deny that it IS a pretty weird thing to point out how the new Riders installment is apparently for both fans and kids, because that seems to suggest that fans are more interested in Riders than they are in Colors. Which is just wrong, plain and simple.

Edited October 30, 2010 by batson