Curse you dubbers!

[Emmett L. Brown]

If you're a scandinavian or resident of other international non-English locations, then be ye fairly warned that those dastardly fiends handling localisation saw fit to dub the entirety of Epic Mickey with, and this is the evil part, NO ENGLISH OPTION(!)

But I outsmarted both my wallet and those dastardly localisers by giving the tainted dubbed version as a gift to my nephew and ordering a proper English version of the game on ebay for a very reasonable amount.

But this is a thread for debate, so I'm curious if there are any other stories of unpleasant unforeseen dubbing wrecking products you've hoped for.

(Note: I have nothing against my native tongue, but dubbing systematically fails to replicate the quality of the original work and is a heinous crime against the hard-working voice actors who are never ever replaced with actors of equal talent)

[-Mark-]

All the Sonic games *shot*

Seriously though, I have nothing against the dub voices in Sonic games in general, so long as I'm given a Japanese voice option, and admittedly I'm usually a little gutted in the cases where there isn't one.

English-only voices are kind of the reason I haven't bothered buying the Xbox version of Shenmue II, as well. Although in that case I can kind of understand why they didn't put both sets of audio on, considering just how much dialogue there is in the game.

Also, I'll almost never buy a Naruto game unless it has Japanese audio. Granted, most of my Naruto games are Japan imports anyway, but still. >.> Playing Naruto in English just doesn't feel right to me, as someone who watches the anime subbed.

[Blue Blood]

If there's the option for dubbing, why on Earth would I want to watch/play something in a language I don't understand? Really. I've never understood this at all. Dubs aren't bad by nature, simply by design sometimes. Like you know, 4Kids and their famed dub of One Piece. It usually doesn't make sense when games don't give you an option for the language of dialogue (note that I did say usually, Mahzes already pointed out cases like Shenmue 2), but so long as I can play in English it never bothers me personally.

[Ekaje]

If there's the option for dubbing, why on Earth would I want to watch/play something in a language I don't understand? Really. I've never understood this at all. Dubs aren't bad by nature, simply by design sometimes. Like you know, 4Kids and their famed dub of One Piece. It usually doesn't make sense when games don't give you an option for the language of dialogue, but so long as I can play in English it never bothers me personally.

The only time I would ever listen to a game/show in something other than English is if the dub is terrible or nonexistent. So for me it's:

Good dub>Subtitled>Bad dub

Edited December 20, 2010 by Ekaje

[Blue Blood]

The only time I would ever listen to a game/show in something other than English is if the dub is terrible or nonexistent. So for me it's:

Good dub>Subtitled>Bad dub

Nah, for me it's: any dub > sub. If characters and story and changed then I can go sub, but the changes have to be pretty major.

[Barry the Nomad]

For cases like Epic Mickey, in which the English voice actors are a huge part of defining the characters, I think the origin country language is much preferred. Same goes for the Kingdom Hearts series. I'd much prefer playing KH 1&2 in English as the voices are accurate to the Disney characters, despite the game being Japanese.

Of course, this brings us into a murky territory in which it could be argued that kiddies in other countries know Mickey and the gang by their localized voices, however I'd argue that the true audio is the one recorded in the country of origin.

While recent Miyazaki films have had good english dubs, I think seeing the movie in the original language is much preferred. Lip synch is much better, characters who are of Japanese origin are speaking their native language and it is what the filmmaker intended. It just fits.

Bringing the Sonic series into this, I think it's more 50/50. Sonic is a series created for the world, not just Japan, so both the English and Japanese versions are equal.

[-Mark-]

If there's the option for dubbing, why on Earth would I want to watch/play something in a language I don't understand? Really. I've never understood this at all. Dubs aren't bad by nature, simply by design sometimes. Like you know, 4Kids and their famed dub of One Piece. It usually doesn't make sense when games don't give you an option for the language of dialogue (note that I did say usually, Mahzes already pointed out cases like Shenmue 2), but so long as I can play in English it never bothers me personally.

Well, in terms of the Sonic and Naruto voice cast, it's basically personal preference since they're what I'm used to.

But yeah, I get what you mean. In no way to I think 'dubs = bad', it's just that a lot of the time they're done badly, as you said. The fact that something's dubbed doesn't make it bad, rather the quality of the dub itself.

[Sean]

I prefer watching media in their original language (with some exceptions, such as FMA), while with games, I don't really care all that much anymore. The Persona games had only an English dub option, but I was satisfied with it.

I honestly stopped caring about having Japanese voices in Sonic games, but I was excited to hear that Fumihiko Tachiki is the announcer for Sonic Colors, so I'm definitely going to be playing it in that language.

[Carbo]

I don't see where Epic Mickey falls as a problem considering 95% of the entire game is just subs, so dubs is a pretty poorly attributed term to the case.

Even then Disney has probably some of the most talented Scandinavian dubbers. While I'd preffer English anyday, they're still damn good and sound like their English dubbers could speak in multiple languages.

[Chooch]

For cases like Epic Mickey, in which the English voice actors are a huge part of defining the characters, I think the origin country language is much preferred. Same goes for the Kingdom Hearts series. I'd much prefer playing KH 1&2 in English as the voices are accurate to the Disney characters, despite the game being Japanese.

Of course, this brings us into a murky territory in which it could be argued that kiddies in other countries know Mickey and the gang by their localized voices, however I'd argue that the true audio is the one recorded in the country of origin.

Pretty much all that needs to be said.

There are special cases where I honestly enjoy English dubs far more than their original Japanese incarnates (See: Cody and Cammy in Super Street Fighter IV), but generally it's a matter of things typically sounding better in their original language.

[JezMM]

While recent Miyazaki films have had good english dubs, I think seeing the movie in the original language is much preferred. Lip synch is much better, characters who are of Japanese origin are speaking their native language and it is what the filmmaker intended. It just fits.

Just to turn your world around, Miyazaki specifically said in an interview he'd rather people watch the dubs of his films - he wants you to watch the animation, not read the subtitles.

For me there are a handful of things I'll watch subbed just because that's how I first saw them, but mostly it's just... easier to watch something dubbed. It means you can do stuff and not have to 100% concentrate on it the whole time.

[Emmett L. Brown]

I don't see where Epic Mickey falls as a problem considering 95% of the entire game is just subs, so dubs is a pretty poorly attributed term to the case.

Even then Disney has probably some of the most talented Scandinavian dubbers. While I'd preffer English anyday, they're still damn good and sound like their English dubbers could speak in multiple languages.

Call it a scar in my soul. When I was a kid I watched He-Man, GI Joe and the rest of the saturday morning lineup in English and picked up the language well enough to understand it even before I started school. As I got older the dubbing started, at first translating only a few shows, until finally it was done. If I want to watch classic Bugs Bunny, I'd have to hook up cable, buy a DVD, or go online - because the TV version turned the line "What's up, doc?" into "What's going on?" All that's left untouched is Tom & Jerry, and that's just because hardly anyone ever talks in those shorts.

So when I popped Epic Mickey in today, and found language options for Danish, Norwegian and Swedish, but nothing else, well, it pissed me off. As a result of the dubbing ruining all my favourite old-time shows, I can't help but feel I'm watching a cheap imitation. It's probably a pretty good dub, though, and I hope my nephew enjoys it. Kinda sucks that he won't get the bonus of having already learned a second language before attending school, but them's the kicks. Children's brains are far more adapted to learning languages than adult brains, so it seems such a terrible waste not to utilise that advantage.

EDIT: Er, just to avoid a misunderstanding, my nephew is in school now. Otherwise he'd be too young for this game. I'm very picky about the recommended ages for games I show the kids.

EDIT2: Even if it's 95% text, I'd be spending the whole game wondering what is "really" being said. I've seen too many dubs butcher the puns and cleverness out of a narrative to trust them anymore. Oh, Daffy Duck, your hilarious catch-phrases are lost to the Scandinavians.

Edited December 20, 2010 by Grumpy Old Guy

[Vec]

Well, I usually use the english dub, because the spanish that it's used often is the one of Spain that most of the times have lines that makes you cringe. Neutral spanish is rarely used (Halo 3 for example) it's good but it's not that good also.

[Conando]

Why would Epic Mickey even be dubbed? All the characters do is talk Banjo-Kazooie gibberish.

Edited December 21, 2010 by Hero Of Christmas

[Vec]

Why would Epic Mickey even be dubbed? All the characters do is talk Banjo-Kazooie gibberish.

You mean with wordless sounds?

[Conando]

Pretty much that, yes. I don't think dub is the term he's looking for.

[Marcello]

For cases like Epic Mickey, in which the English voice actors are a huge part of defining the characters, I think the origin country language is much preferred. Same goes for the Kingdom Hearts series. I'd much prefer playing KH 1&2 in English as the voices are accurate to the Disney characters, despite the game being Japanese.

[Glenn]

Just thought I'd drop in and add a post, as I returned a copy of Naruto Shippuden: Ultimate Ninja 5, for PlayStation2, because it had nothing but the original Japanese audio. It was a proper PAL release and everything... the lazy fools just thought we'd all be happy listening to incomprehensible noises while we try and read subtitles and watch a cutscene at the same time. Well, they thought wrong, frankly.

All very well and good when I'm English, and the rest of the world (mostly) speaks my language anyway. I guess that's why I was shocked and pretty disgusted at Ultimate Ninja 5, to be honest. There's the whole "Oh, but this is the original intent!" argument for Japanese, or other, voices but I steer well clear of it. Mostly because I'm the type of chap who stands in the Tate Modern and laughs because somebody with more money than sense purchased a messy bed for a six-figure sum. Stuff intent. It is what it is, just like I am what I am... and I'm English, damn it!

[Blue Blood]

Just thought I'd drop in and add a post, as I returned a copy of Naruto Shippuden: Ultimate Ninja 5, for PlayStation2, because it had nothing but the original Japanese audio. It was a proper PAL release and everything... the lazy fools just thought we'd all be happy listening to incomprehensible noises while we try and read subtitles and watch a cutscene at the same time. Well, they thought wrong, frankly.

[-Mark-]

Just thought I'd drop in and add a post, as I returned a copy of Naruto Shippuden: Ultimate Ninja 5, for PlayStation2, because it had nothing but the original Japanese audio. It was a proper PAL release and everything... the lazy fools just thought we'd all be happy listening to incomprehensible noises while we try and read subtitles and watch a cutscene at the same time. Well, they thought wrong, frankly.

All very well and good when I'm English, and the rest of the world (mostly) speaks my language anyway. I guess that's why I was shocked and pretty disgusted at Ultimate Ninja 5, to be honest. There's the whole "Oh, but this is the original intent!" argument for Japanese, or other, voices but I steer well clear of it. Mostly because I'm the type of chap who stands in the Tate Modern and laughs because somebody with more money than sense purchased a messy bed for a six-figure sum. Stuff intent. It is what it is, just like I am what I am... and I'm English, damn it!

Again, bear in mind (and as you told me), Ultimate Ninja 5 wasn't released in the US, which is by and large the reason the game never got dubbed. Since the European anime-fan market is generally a lot more tolerant of subtitles than the US, given it wasn't getting a US release, I guess that's why they didn't see fit to dub it.

Especially given that anime is still a niche (if admittedly growing) market, and that the majority of people would be okay with a subtitle-only release, I can understand why they didn't from a business perspective, at least. Considering the time and money it takes to dub something, to do so for the minority of a market for an already-niche product isn't the most commercially-wise decision to make.

I guess the fact is, most anime fans prefer subtitled versions (or, at the very least, don't have an issue with watching something subtitled)- from what I've seen, people who are massively averse to anything but English-dubbed stuff in the anime fandom are few and far between. That said, I do think it's wrong for them to not give people an English option as well, even if a lot of people won't use it. Like I said, though, given the circumstances surrounding Ultimate Ninja 5's English release, I can understand why they didn't dub it.

Getting back to the subject of dubbing in general though, the only thing I find a little... disappointing, perhaps, is that in any translations, from and to whatever language, there are going to be little quirks, mannerisms and what have you that simply don't carry across or are outright untranslatable. As Grumpy Old Guy said regarding Bugs Bunny, it's little things like that. That's usually not a matter of bad or lazy dubbing, just incompatibility between languages.

I still wonder what they did with the Spanish Buzz section of Toy Story 3 in the Spanish dub, mind you.

Edited December 21, 2010 by Mahzes

[Glenn]

THAAAAAAAAAAAAAANK YOU! That is exactly my gripe. Especially with films. I pay to watch them, not read them. If I wanted to read them I'd buy a book.

Spookily (you word thief), I've used those exact words many a time before, my friend... many a time!

And I can't post without giving *hugs* to Mahzes. We've discussed this far too much before!

[Octarine]

There is exactly one reason why I tend to prefer dubs to subs.

Snacks.

I'm perfectly okay with reading subtitles when I'm watching something, but reading, watching and occasionally having to look away to avoid spilling food all over myself? That's just a little too much for my stupid monkey brain to handle. I'm almost always watching something while I eat these days since the only flat surface in my room is my computer desk and I've never gotten used to using our dining room, so this is actually a bigger issue for me than it has any business being. Also, I watch a fair bit of tokusatsu, and for obvious reasons that's always subtitled. Watching dubbed anime provides some variety after that.

I've got very little experience with dubbing vs. subbing in video games, though. I guess I don't usually think about it; the default option is nearly always good enough for me. About the only example I can think of where it's ever been an issue for me is with the One Piece games that were dubbed while 4Kids had the license. I was interested in maybe picking one of them up while on a bargain bin rampage a while ago, but the probable lack of a Japanese option turned me right off.

...speaking of books, have we got a book thread here? I totally don't know. Would anyone else post in it if there was one?

Edited December 21, 2010 by Octarine

[Emmett L. Brown]

Yeah, I guess it's a wholly different matter when the origin language is one you have no hope of ever learning to understand without years of strict study. But the Scandinavian case is that almost everyone born in the last fifty years understands English perfectly, as the language is taught right from the first year of school. It seems unnecessary to dub anything from English when that's the case. If you haven't learned English in school yet, then even better - you're young enough that your brain is super-focused for learning new languages without you even being aware of it.

[Glenn]

Yeah, I guess it's a wholly different matter when the origin language is one you have no hope of ever learning to understand without years of strict study. But the Scandinavian case is that almost everyone born in the last fifty years understands English perfectly, as the language is taught right from the first year of school. It seems unnecessary to dub anything from English when that's the case. If you haven't learned English in school yet, then even better - you're young enough that your brain is super-focused for learning new languages without you even being aware of it.

Definitely true, especially in the European mainland countries. English is the second language (no matter what the French tell you, bless them) of nearly everywhere. I was genuinely shocked to hear of no English option in Epic Mickey.

[-Mark-]

There is exactly one reason why I tend to prefer dubs to subs.

Snacks.

I'm perfectly okay with reading subtitles when I'm watching something, but reading, watching and occasionally having to look away to avoid spilling food all over myself? That's just a little too much for my stupid monkey brain to handle. I'm almost always watching something while I eat these days since the only flat surface in my room is my computer desk and I've never gotten used to using our dining room, so this is actually a bigger issue for me than it has any business being.

Edited December 22, 2010 by Mahzes