European customs ordered to seize PlayStation shipments

[Patticus]

The fuck? How can LG claim copyright infringement, on blu ray, against Sony? Isn't Sony part of that big damn board that designed blu ray and the blu ray player?

The patent isn't about Blu-Ray technology as that's owned by three companies (Toshiba, ARM, Sony) which are all happy. The issue is about how the Playstation 3 streams Blu-Ray; more accurately, how PS3/Bravia TV's handle said data. In a nutshell, LG has a strong case, but it's all tit-for-tat. Sony Ericsson chased LG about patents in December, and this is LG's response.

Expect a compromise sometime soon, there's no way either company can afford to be taken to the cleaners on either case.

[Dobkeratops]

Okay, as somebody who's currently saving up to purchase a new PlayStation3 within the next month, I'm now officially worried.

Hopefully it'll all blow over, as many legal battles do, and I won't have to fight an old lady for the last console in Argos.

[Glenn]

You, sir, are a genius!

I'm also quite flattered to be likened to Arnie!

[eXtaticus]

LG are cunts.

http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2010-12-29/sony-files-patent-lawsuit-to-ban-lg-mobile-telephones-from-u-s-.html

Gotta love how LG are being portrayed as the "evil" "king of the trolls", when it was, in actual fact, Sony themselves who started this pathetic, backstabbing, cash-grabbing vengeance-fest of a patent war back in December...

"Cunts" is a rather inaccurate (and rather strong) descriptor for LG, especially when taking into account Sony's recent legal affairs with their paying customers (see: GeoHot and his merry little band of indie developers being treated like shit for doing precisely zilch but modify their own property) and now their product-partnered electronics corporations; the term "cunts" would be far better used to describe this particular case's defendant rather than the accuser.

[Badnik Mechanic]

(see: GeoHot and his merry little band of indie developers being treated like shit for doing precisely zilch but modify their own property)

LOL!!!!!!????!!!!???!!!

Let me see if I understand this correcdtly... You just called that group of people 'indie game developers'... bloody hell are you their defense lawyer or something?

Also I think you need to get your facts right on something.

They're being sued because they made the hack/tool, released and distributed it, which is allowing people to run games without paying for them and a whole other bunch of lovely things like totally bugger up many online games, had they kept it quiet and to themselves I doubt very much Sony would be as angry as they are right now.

Oh yes lets all bring up that quote about not using it for malicious use, yes lets, lets also have a big reality check here because thats exactly what it's being used for, their original demo video of it was showing off how they could run various games without owning the disk for goodness sake.

the term "cunts" would be far better used to describe this particular case's defendant rather than the accuser.

Also you calling Sony that is hardly shocking since if a PS3 so much as has a fart near someone you practically cry about it.

Edited March 6, 2011 by Hogfather

[Velotix von Skruviktorrius]

IN BEFORE ONCOMING SHITSTORM TO DROP A WISDOM BOMB:

Oh yes lets all bring up that quote about not using it for malicious use, yes lets, lets also have a big reality check here because thats exactly what it's being used for

Whilst common sense would indeed infer that as piracy is the primary use of the hack's derivative works - not the actual hack itself - then it should be treated as the main focus of the hack, technically the hack itself could not be used to pirate nor was modifying the code to enable piracy condoned.

Technically. We're talking a legal battle here, and those guys just love their delicious technicalities.

...Anyway, you all know my view on this by now, carry on.

[eXtaticus]

They're being sued because they release the hack and distributed it, which is allowing people to run games without paying for them and a whole other bunch of lovely things like totally bugger up many online games, had they kept it quiet and to themselves I doubt very much Sony would be as angry as they are right now.

That's like blaming the creators of Islam for terrorism and suicide bombings; sure, a brainwashed extremist would probably quite happily blow themselves to bits on a western tube train or airplane in the name of religion, but equally there are peaceful worshipers of that very same religion who are harmless in every aspect, but painted with a broad brush by those who see only the villains with which Islam is associated with.

Just like terrorists abusing religion for their own diabolical ends, people are bound to use GeoHot's PS3 manipulation techniques for piracy and other less-than-legal activities; you quite simply can't blame the producer for the customers' uses of the product. Hell, even Mr. Hotz himself has expressed his personal objections to software theft on his own website, even calling himself an "advocate against mass piracy".

Let me see if I understand this correcdtly... You just called that group of people 'indie game developers'... bloody hell are you their defense lawyer or something?

I never called them "indie game developers" and am thus technically correct, and no, I'm not their defense lawyer; I'm just somebody who whole-heartedly disagrees with what Sony is doing in its recent legal cases - GeoHot and LG included.

Edited March 6, 2011 by eXtaticus

[Tornado]

They're being sued because they made the hack/tool, released and distributed it, which is allowing people to run games without paying for them and a whole other bunch of lovely things like totally bugger up many online games, had they kept it quiet and to themselves I doubt very much Sony would be as angry as they are right now.

Actually, the original hack and the CFW that Hotz released were programmed in a way that went out of their way to prevent backup loaders from being able to be used. It wasn't until a few weeks later that people took (some of) the stuff that Hotz released and hacked it apart for their own purposes, including scratch-building tools that Hotz had nothing to do with that are/were required to be made in order for backup loaders to run. Tools that were actually somewhat based on the tools that were made for the 3.41 Jailbreak dongles.

Though I'm rather confused as to why this line of discussion was brought up in this thread when the other thread is still going strong.

Edited March 6, 2011 by Tornado

[Scar]

This is business folks move on now.

Shit like this happens to many companies. Again, Sony are no worse, than LG, who are no worse than Microsoft, who are no worse than any other multinational corporation. Right now its Sony in the spotlight for trying to [rather vicously and irrationlly] protect their financial interests (Sony makes most of their money from game sales, if the games are being pirated, they are losing a LOT of money), however I do agree that they are going about in the wrong way though.

Anyway, right now its Sony vs LG (who'll soon come to a compromise and drop their injunctions, because its something neither company can afford0. Sooner or later, it will be another company causing a shitfest.

Edited March 6, 2011 by Scar

[eXtaticus]

Though I'm rather confused as to why this line of discussion was brought up in this thread when the other thread is still going strong.

And, while I'm still here:

Also you calling Sony that is hardly shocking since if a PS3 so much as has a fart near someone you practically cry about it.

Because dredging up year-old arguments from threads that are now unfindable on the site's search engine OR on either of our content history pages is a REALLY mature and grown-up way of dealing with someone else's perspective on your opinion, right? To be honest, I wasn't calling Sony "cunts" more than I was stating that the term "cunt" would be more applicable to them rather than LG - a belief that I still stand by, and am perfectly happy to defend.

Let's face it; it's not like you don't have a legion of people who disagree with me, is it?

[Carbo]

It's becoming worse.

LG has won a court order enabling it to seize all new PS3 across the Netherlands – including those already in Dutch homes – in a dispute that centres on Sony's allegedly infringing use of Blu-ray technology belonging to LG.

The injunction means that LG is tightening the net on PS3s in Europe, having already ordered customs officers to seize thousands of the consoles last week.

Sony will fight to have the blockade lifted at an emergency hearing in the Hague's civil court of justice tomorrow.

LG argues that Sony PS3s infringe a number of its patents relating to playback of Blu-ray discs. The Korean company has been granted an investigation into the PS3's Blu-ray use by the US international trade commission, after seeking a "permanent exclusion order ... excluding entry into the United States" of the games console.

Tomorrow's court battle will be one of the first times the Asian giants have come head to head in patent disputes stretching almost seven years.

LG is likely to apply for the consoles to be destroyed, while Sony will apply for the blockade to be lifted. A court judgment on what happens next could be returned tomorrow or in the coming days.

Customs officials at Rotterdam and Schiphol, the main import points for PS3s for both the UK and wider Europe, are understood to have extended a blockade on two Sony shipments made last week.

Sony, which imports about 100,000 PS3s into Europe each week, is attempting to get all the restrictions lifted.

If Sony is found to have infringed LG patents, it could be forced to compensate the South Korean manufacturer for each PS3 it has sold around the world, which could cost hundreds of millions of pounds.

A spokesman for Sony said: "Sony was notified at the end of February by customs authorities in the Netherlands that an inspection would be made into imports of [PlayStation 3s]. We believe this is due to a petition made by LG Electronics, alleging that Sony may be infringing LG patents related to Blu-ray technologies.

"However, this is only a preliminary injunction, that has resulted in shipments being temporarily withheld. It does not indicate any acceptance of LG's allegations. We consider these allegations unwarranted, and will take appropriate measures including filing a claim of opposition to courts in the Netherlands. We will not comment on any further details."

[Glenn]

*panic*

Damn, I'm getting more and more worried as the weeks pass by, now. I was hoping to have enough money for a new PlayStation3 towards the end of March but, if this continues to get worse, I may not have that long. I truly hope this can be settled soon, either for an out-of-court sum (which would mean Sony were the bigger company) or in the dock itself (which would mean victory for Sony).

All I have to say is that LG are really, really coming across as the villains here. I will personally never buy any of their products ever again. Seizing all consoles in the Netherlands, including from people's homes...? Curse them.

Curse them.

[Badnik Mechanic]

Yeah they're slowly turning from being gits into comic book super villains here. Last week people were going on about Mr Sony coming around and taking your PS3 away, now LG mobile phones are going to come and take them away because they don't like the way it streams blu-ray...

And remember folks they've had around oh 5, 6 years to make this complaint?

It'll get resolved one way or another, theres no way Sony or any other company for that matter will just sit there and not let one of their biggest selling products just seemingly vanish from EU stores.

Edited March 10, 2011 by Hogfather

[Glenn]

It'll get resolved one way or another, theres no way Sony or any other company for that matter will just sit there and not let one of their biggest selling products just seemingly vanish from EU stores.

In the meantime, I hope somebody other than the videogame media picks this story up. It is truly remarkable. Hopefully some mainstream media pressure will put focus on the insanity of the case, therefore forcing LG to protect their corporate image and back down.

I can see a temporary shortage of PlayStation3 consoles being a reality, however, and I'm being purely selfish in fearing that, for which I apologise.

[Dobkeratops]

Sony partially won the case. The patent bullshit still has to be settled but LG apparently cannot seize consoles anymore and will be fined on a daily basis if they don't get that sorted immediately.

[Glenn]

Sony partially won the case. The patent bullshit still has to be settled but LG apparently cannot seize consoles anymore and will be fined on a daily basis if they don't get that sorted immediately.

Are you sure? That's fantastic news if confirmed, and thank you kindly for the update.

At least this means there'll be no financial loss on Sony's part, with regards to selling £250 consoles in Europe (that'll help legal fees if LG win the patent details), and that us gamers won't be hard-pressed to find consoles on which to play.

Happy news makes me happy.

[Glenn]

Apologies for the double-post, but I thought I'd just confirm with a BBC News Online story that Sony did indeed win the legal battle over the import seizure case, but that the ongoing dispute over the patents to Blu-Ray devices is still ongoing. LG and Sony are due to take the fight to the American legal system soon. This new ruling, however, gives early indication that LG has no concrete foundation upon which to base their wildly unreasonable claims, and shows hope for Sony's future victory.

That said, I doubt this is the most important concern for a Japanese multinational corporation at the moment. I almost feel bad making this post, actually.

[Velotix von Skruviktorrius]

I've seen no sign that Sony are loosening the screws on their own dumb lawsuit against LG, let's not forget that crucial detail.

The thing is, as far as I remember (long day) if Sony's lawsuit holds water, so does LG's, so...