General Nintendo sales/business discussion topic (previously: The Wii U Thread)

[KHCast]

Wasn't BBSV2 gonna be a Vita title?

[Jolt_TH]

All in all we don't really know what's happening or what will happen, it's going to the Xbox and Playstation, if the Wii U picks up we might get a version too, we might not, there are tons of possible reasons as to why they haven't done it but the fact is, as of now, it isn't coming to the Wii U

[Autosaver]

I love how we're talking about this "big boom" as if it's factually, absolutely going to happen. Remind me again when the Gamecube boomed?

 

The point is - it's a possible boom. Smash Bros, Mario Kart, Mario 3D World, X, Bayonetta, Wonderful 101, Donkey Kong, Epic Yoshi, Pikmin 3, Sonic Lost World, Wii Party U, Wii Fit U, etc. No one is saying it's going to do PS2 numbers, but it will definitely increase sales by a load. It would squash the Vita by miles.

 

 

Also, I'm not saying KH3 is going to be ported, calm down. I'm just saying a Vita Kingdom Hearts game would likely pay off far more than a WIi U game.

 

I know, but what I'm saying is that it's wrong. Power wise and sales wise it wouldn't make sense to make a Vita version. May as well make a Wii U one instead.

[Sami]

The point is - it's a possible boom. Smash Bros, Mario Kart, Mario 3D World, X, Bayonetta, Wonderful 101, Donkey Kong, Epic Yoshi, Pikmin 3, Sonic Lost World, Wii Party U, Wii Fit U, etc. No one is saying it's going to do PS2 numbers, but it will definitely increase sales by a load. It would squash the Vita by miles.

 

I know, but what I'm saying is that it's wrong. Power wise and sales wise it wouldn't make sense to make a Vita version. May as well make a Wii U one instead.

 

Again, not saying a Vita version. I'm talking side-games/exclusives here.

 

I suppose a Wii U game would work simply on the basis that it could be ported to PS4, I guess. So whatever. I'll retract that. All I was trying to say is that it makes sense to spend less money on a platform with a bigger install base, not the opposite.

 

And sure. We'll see. I don't see it doing better than the GC at this point.

[Autosaver]

Again, not saying a Vita version. I'm talking side-games/exclusives here.

Same difference. Sales wise and power wise, Wii U might be the better choice.

 

All I was trying to say is that it makes sense to spend less money on a platform with a bigger install base, not the opposite.

 

AFAIK, the install bases for both platforms are almost identical. Sure there may be a small difference, but it's negligible. And by 2015, I guarantee the Vita will be lagging behind. Vita Petz is not going to make it sell 30 million units.

 

In all honesty, I could see a 3DS remake of 358/2 Days happening. It's the only game that hasn't been made and it would be easy to make using the 3D engine.

[Sami]

Regardless, the Vita is much cheaper to develop for. If it's exclusive, it would very likely do better sales wise.

[Autosaver]

The Vita while not as powerful as a PS3, is still kind of powerful. The development costs for an HD Kingdom Hearts game would not be close to cheap (or that much cheaper). Especially with the fact that there is no HD engine available. If SE would go cheap, it would either be a multi-plat title or a 358/2 Days remake on 3DS. Has Square Enix even released any Vita games? They seem to be attached to the 3DS and PS4 at the moment.

Edited August 17, 2013 by Autosaver

[Sami]

The Vita while not as powerful as a PS3, is still kind of powerful. The development costs for an HD Kingdom Hearts game would not be close to cheap (or cheaper). Especially with the fact that there is no HD engine available. If SE would go cheap, it would either be a multi-plat title or a 358/2 Days remake on 3DS.

 

Neither of those is "Wii U exclusive", which is the comparison I'm making here. But fine, I won't argue this point. 

 

How did 3D do, anyway? Didn't it perform poorly compared to the other games in the series?

[Autosaver]

Neither of those is "Wii U exclusive", which is the comparison I'm making here.

 

Rubbing it in my face? (I kid, I kid)

 

It sold 1.2 million copies. Days and BbS both did 1.9 Million. Sure it's less, but I'm pretty sure BbS and PSP were released when the systems were in their prime time. Considering the sales of the 3DS at the time, it did pretty well.

[RK64]

The Vita while not as powerful as a PS3, is still kind of powerful. The development costs for an HD Kingdom Hearts game would not be close to cheap (or that much cheaper). Especially with the fact that there is no HD engine available. If SE would go cheap, it would either be a multi-plat title or a 358/2 Days remake on 3DS. Has Square Enix even released any Vita games? They seem to be attached to the 3DS and PS4 at the moment.

 

There using FF X/X-2 HD as a buffer to see if its worth developing for Vita if they sell well, with the success of those games leading into a remake of FF XII and potentially the KH HD Collections. They did have a launch game for Vita (Army Crops of Hell) but I'm not sure if that was even good...

 

A KH Vita tittle would really sell the system as KH is more attached to Sony much more than Nintendo/Microsoft and all they have to do is take the Birth By Sleep engine, spice it up, and ether put the Collections or a spin off tied to KH III (maybe a side story focusing on Riku's actions during KH III or something).

[Autosaver]

There using FF X/X-2 HD as a buffer to see if its worth developing for Vita if they sell well, with the success of those games leading into a remake of FF XII and potentially the KH HD Collections. They did have a launch game for Vita (Army Crops of Hell) but I'm not sure if that was even good...

This is really stupid. I hate how publishers are using ports to tell if a system is worth developing for.

[RK64]

This is really stupid. I hate how publishers are using ports to tell if a system is worth developing for.

 

It is stupid, but that's the most cost effective way to gauge the potential success you could get out of a platform. Not saying its right, as Square could have done a lot to support the Vita (they could of at least put Birth By Sleep and Crisis Core on the dam PSN Store....) but they done practically nothing for the system

 

Sadly that same principle happened with the Wii U (many of the launch line up were ports of old games like Batman Arkam City GOTY, Mass Effect 3) which was one of the many potential reasons (weaker hardware compared to the X1/PS3, many 3rd party games not complementing with Nintendo products, history of not selling on Nintendo hardware, ect) that third party's aren't supporting the Wii U as of now.

Edited August 18, 2013 by RK64

[Conando]

Wasn't BBSV2 gonna be a Vita title?

Who knows. Nomura said making Kingdom Hearts games for Vita was pointless when asked about it last year.

[The Kid]

Because it's easy and cheap.

 

I swear I've said this over ten times now. If the same applied to Wii U it'd have gotten the game too, but sadly Nintendo just does whatever the fuck they want and are suffering the consequences as a result.

 

 

Yeah, I know why it is getting the game, I just mean it can be considered a strange choice regardless, something that a number of people would ask. There has never been a Kingdom Hearts game on any Microsoft console, and they're getting the final game in the respective storyline. People are going to go "Wait, really?"

 

Regardless, the Vita is much cheaper to develop for. If it's exclusive, it would very likely do better sales wise.

 

A Vita exclusive versus a Wii U exclusive? I don't know... that is a pretty big guess. Saying that hypothetically it would likely do much better sales wise is stretching it.

Edited August 18, 2013 by The Kid

[Sami]

Yeah, I know why it is getting the game, I just mean it can be considered a strange choice regardless, something that a number of people would ask. There has never been a Kingdom Hearts game on any Microsoft console, and they're getting the final game in the respective storyline. People are going to go "Wait, really?"

 

I guess, but if they might as well do it, why the hell not. I'm sure there have to be at least a couple thousand Xbox gamers who played the PS2 games. 

 

A Vita exclusive versus a Wii U exclusive? I don't know... that is a pretty big guess. Saying that hypothetically it would likely do much better sales wise is stretching it.

 

I'm just assuming based off of these facts -

 

• The Wii U is selling even more poorly than the Vita right now
• The PSP line has distinguished itself as being very good for RPGs, and as such there's a high attachment rate for RPGs to the system.
• Kingdom Hearts is, primarily, a Playstation franchise. While the lack of a Wii U version for KH3 is annoying for many, it's not all that surprising. No PS4 version? That announcement would make jaws drop. 

 

I'm merely speculating of course, but I'm just saying.

[Autosaver]

The Wii U is selling even more poorly than the Vita right now

 

 

Didn't the Vita get back to back big titles? Of course it increased.

 

Vita has been out for 2 years in Japan - 1.7 Million Sales.

Wii U has been out for 8 months - 1.1 Million Sales.

 

Somehow the Vita is selling better or something? 5k units more a week? That's going to become laughable in the coming months.

[Conando]

I think it's stretching a bit to say Sony is the primary platform for the franchise when it's mostly evenly split between Nintendo and Sony at this point, just saying.

[The Kid]

I guess, but if they might as well do it, why the hell not. I'm sure there have to be at least a couple thousand Xbox gamers who played the PS2 games. 

 

 

 

 

I'm just assuming based off of these facts -

 

• The Wii U is selling even more poorly than the Vita right now
• The PSP line has distinguished itself as being very good for RPGs, and as such there's a high attachment rate for RPGs to the system.
• Kingdom Hearts is, primarily, a Playstation franchise. While the lack of a Wii U version for KH3 is annoying for many, it's not all that surprising. No PS4 version? That announcement would make jaws drop. 

 

I'm merely speculating of course, but I'm just saying.

 

- The difference in sales at this point is largely insignificant. They're both dead.

- Isn't the PSP known for more traditional turn-based RPGs? KH is more of an action game with RPG elements. I could be wrong, but when I think Kingdom Hearts, I don't think of the same genre as something like SMT (again, partially opinion).

- If you're saying because of the numbered games, then possibly. But if you're talking in terms of exclusives, then no. Playstation has 4 games (1, 2, BBS, Re:Chain), Nintendo has 3 (Re: Coded, 358/2, 3D). KH3 is counted as multi-platform. 

 

 Also, just because a game isn't numbered doesn't mean it isn't important or part of the main series. Many series nowadays have titles in between the "numbered" releases yet are still considered "main games". And when you look at all the shit that has happened in the storyline between 2 and the upcoming 3, well... the games weren't just side stories. Kingdom Hearts is made for different systems depending on the game. 

Edited August 18, 2013 by The Kid

[Marcello]

I don't understand why you're counting Re: Chain of Memories as an exclusive, but not the original?

[Sami]

Didn't the Vita get back to back big titles? Of course it increased.

 

Vita has been out for 2 years in Japan - 1.7 Million Sales.

Wii U has been out for 8 months - 1.1 Million Sales.

 

Somehow the Vita is selling better or something? 5k units more a week? That's going to become laughable in the coming months.

 

Sure enough, if Sony doesn't do anything counter-act that. While I'm not particularly hopeful that Sony will put too much effort into saving it at this point, it is still possible. Its issues lie much less deeply than the Wii U's. There's a rumored price drop and possibly a redesign coming at Gamescom and TGS, so we'll see.

 

 

- The difference in sales at this point is largely insignificant. They're both dead.

- Isn't the PSP known for more traditional turn-based RPGs? KH is more of an action game with RPG elements. I could be wrong, but when I think Kingdom Hearts, I don't think of the same genre as something like SMT (again, partially opinion).

- If you're saying because of the numbered games, then possibly. But if you're talking in terms of exclusives, then no. Playstation has 4 games (1, 2, BBS, Re:Chain), Nintendo has 3 (Re: Coded, 358/2, 3D). KH3 is counted as multi-platform. 

 

 Also, just because a game isn't numbered doesn't mean it isn't important or part of the main series. Many series nowadays have titles in between the "numbered" releases yet are still considered "main games". And when you look at all the shit that has happened in the storyline between 2 and the upcoming 3, well... the games weren't just side stories. Kingdom Hearts is made for different systems depending on the game. 

 

- Fair enough, lol.

- Not really? Some of its biggest games are Crisis Core, Dissidia, Birth By Sleep, Gods Eater, and Monster Hunter off the top of my head.

- I'm talking about their place in the series.

 

I've been following the series since 2005, lol. I know that a game doesn't have to be numbered to be important. But let's say you take two gamers who love Kingdom Hearts, okay? One only buys Nintendo systems and the other only buys Playstation systems. The Playstation guy gets Kingdom Hearts 1, 2, Birth By Sleep, Re:Chain of Memories, and 358/2 Days (in movie form). This is, of course, assuming 3D isn't bundled into 2.5 somehow. The Nintendo guy gets Chain of Memories, 358/2 Days, Re:Coded, and 3D. 

 

Literally all of the Playstation games are extremely pivotal to the series storyline. If you don't play them, you're going to be extremely confused when the next game comes along. While some important plot elements are introduced in Chain of Memories to be elaborated upon later, playing it is not completely necessary to know what's happening in Kingdom Hearts II. I would know, I never owned a GBA. The same applies to 358/2 Days, which is really just a spin-off to elaborate on a popular character's backstory, and Re:Coded, which is literally completely inconsequential. Even then, the most important of these games later got ported to Playstation anyway, so the PS2 owner who missed out on Chain of Memories the first time later got to play it regardless.

 

The 3DS got Dream Drop Distance, a game that actually is important to the main plotline, is the only exception here. Time will tell if it gets ported to Playstation, but if that doesn't happen before KH3 (I'm still betting it'll be included in 2.5 in one way or another), then I'll give you that one.

 

So that being said, who is more "ready" for Kingdom Hearts 3? The guy who played all of the main game sans one? Or the guy who played all the side games and a single main game?

 

The point I'm trying to make is that it really doesn't matter. I think complaining that it's on Xbox because "they wouldn't know what's going on anyway" is a ridiculous argument, especially when it's paired with "and that's why it should be on the Wii U". If it can be on an extra console, great - more people get to play. If it isn't on a certain console for very legitimate reasons, then don't get a "well if I can't have it they shouldn't either!" attitude.

 

Xbox makes more sense because there will most likely be an exponentially larger install base, and it's a much cheaper port-job. That's really all there is to it.

[The Kid]

Oh, I forgot the original Chain of Memories, my bad.

 

Who is more ready? My point is that each Company has received the same number of exclusive titles in the series, all of which do have a place in the overarching story. I really wouldn't call any of them insignificant (possibly 358/2 but even then you could argue otherwise).

 

I really dont care if the Xbox One gets KH, it'll most likely do super poorly anyways.  My point is that "Kingdom Hearts is a Playstation franchise" is bullshit.

[Chooch]

It's not a PlayStation franchise but it is a franchise that is primarily associated with the PlayStation brand and all of the major titles have been on PlayStation stuff originally or ported later to them with additional content.

 

Really tho', why is Kingdom Hearts III not coming to Wii U still even a thing?

Edited August 18, 2013 by Chooch

[Komodin]

Really tho', why is Kingdom Hearts III not coming to Wii U still even a thing?

 

The same reason why some people are bummed out that Sonic Lost World is a Nintendo exclusive: because people find it disappointing that the next main title of a series that they like is not gonna be available on a console that they like.

[PSI Wind]

It's not a PlayStation franchise but it is a franchise that is primarily associated with the PlayStation brand and all of the major titles have been on PlayStation stuff originally or ported later to them with additional content.

 

Really tho', why is Kingdom Hearts III not coming to Wii U still even a thing?

Like I said, I'm more confused that KH3 is on the Xbone. I was expecting it to be a PS4 exclusive when the trailer showed up, which was fine to me.

[KrazyBean]

Like I said, I'm more confused that KH3 is on the Xbone. I was expecting it to be a PS4 exclusive when the trailer showed up, which was fine to me.

 

More platforms = more money.

 

Low sales on a platform with will cost almost nothing to port it over to due to its architecture = PROFIT!

Edited August 18, 2013 by KrazyBean