Classic Metal Sonic?

[Blue Wisp]

So we can stop off-topicing the Sonic Generations forum.

Minor details? You're joking, right?

Can you see a difference between the supposed "Classic" Metal Sonic and the design used in later games?

Frankly, I can't see a difference. They are the same except for the shoulderpads.

GO.

[Preston]

The torso is different and there are more joints, but that's it. Metal Sonic's appearance has been largely unchanged next to Knuckles.

[Blue Blood]

Uh, I don't really have much else to add beyond what I've written in the picture. So...

[Diogenes]

The torso is the main difference; like Sonic, it's gone from spherical to more elongated, and he's got a separate bit for his hips instead of his legs just going into toaster-slots on the bottom. The rest is mostly a matter of increased detail.

[Blue Wisp]

Are you kidding me?

I was expecting changes like from Classic Sonic to Modern Sonic. This is all minor details! Doesn't count as a Classic and Modern.

[Diogenes]

I was expecting changes like from Classic Sonic to Modern Sonic. This is all minor details!

Most of it is minor, but the added pelvis certainly isn't. And the changes between the two Sonics aren't nearly as huge as some people make them out to be.

[Mega]

Minor details or not, they count as a redesign. Added joints, a pelvis, and a different head/eye shape is different from leaving the design untouched.

His head also had a sharper shape, and his eyes looked a lot more cold and emotionless with the circle pupils. He's easily one of the least changed characters between classic and modern, but there is a change.

And I definitely find Modern Sonic more drastic because... those quills. Which in and of itself is one drastic change, but it's more than Knuckles and Tails got other than color and stylistic changes. :|a

Though nothing is as drastic as Amy's redesign, which actually makes her unique compared to Sonic.

Edited June 11, 2011 by Mega

[Blue Blood]

Are you kidding me?

I was expecting changes like from Classic Sonic to Modern Sonic. This is all minor details! Doesn't count as a Classic and Modern.

Okay.

The changes between C.Sonic and M.Sonic are the same as those between C.Metal and M.Metal.

Edited June 11, 2011 by Blue Blood

[Mega]

More images to compare with. I think it's even more obvious in the 2D art, personally.

Edited June 11, 2011 by Mega

[Indigo Rush]

I honestly can't see how you can equate the two. Sonic has had a bigger design change than Metal Sonic has.

[Blue Blood]

I honestly can't see how you can equate the two. Sonic has had a bigger design change than Metal Sonic has.

A more noticable one perhaps, but they were give the exact same treatment. Knuckles received a modernisation exactly the same as Sonic did, but it's just less noticeable. The same is true of Metal.

[Blue Wisp]

The changes between C.Sonic and M.Sonic are the same as those between C.Metal and M.Metal.

No. Because with C. Sonic and M. Sonic you can actually notice the rather obvious changes that makes them DIFFERENT.

C. Metal and M. Metal are the same thing with minor details.

[Blue Blood]

No. Because with C. Sonic and M. Sonic you can actually notice the rather obvious changes that makes them DIFFERENT.

Whether or not the difference is noticeable is a moot point. The change is there. He was given a new design to match the rest of the cast.

[Mauro Fonseca]

... Are people seriously saying the design is the same?

Jesus Mary and Jehoshaphat. The changes were minor, yes, much like how Eggman basically just changed coats, but they exist and are there, much like how Flicky had a Sonic 1 design and an Adventure design.

[Emerald Chaos]

More images to compare with. I think it's even more obvious in the 2D art, personally.

A large part of the reason why it's more obvious in 2D art is because the two pictures are drawn in different styles.

If the same artist drew the two designs in the same style I'm fairly certain the differences wouldn't stand out quite as much. Which is why the 3D models are a better comparison.

Edited June 11, 2011 by Emerald Chaos

[Diogenes]

Ah, another difference between the Metals that I just spotted: Classic Metal's "shoes" curve around the ankle/foot joint, while modern Metal's leave more space for the foot to bend.

[Mauro Fonseca]

If the same artist drew the two designs in the same style

[Aquaslash]

Sonic has way less changes in comparison to Metal. In short, he had a growth spurt, grew out his quills, lost weight, and put in contacts.

Meanwhile, Metal Sonic has been completely rebuilt from the ground up, and they are relatively just now settling on his modern look. Like, everything on modern Metal is changed. Different head shape, different arms, different legs. Hell, he actually has thigh joints now, which if present at all were invisible on the classic model.

I recall Phos once saying that the changes to Metal Sonic are comparable to the changes to Optimus Prime for the movies. I think that's a pretty fair assessment. Metal Sonic has been made into a much more believable machine now. You can literally see every point of articulation he has, and can believe that he could move as freely as he does. Meanwhile, classic Metal is damn near a brick in his appearance. Very limited on articulation. Even the OVA had him moving in ways that just shouldn't be possible.

[Phos]

New Metal Sonic's hips are kinda silly. They put that buldge right there, but then the legs are just attached with hinges mounted on bearings. They look like they'd snap right off. For a 3D Metal Sonic, I'd mount his legs with ball in socket joints. That keeps the moment arm passing through his body.

Most renders that I've seen of new metal sonic have very different proportions when it comes to his head. Take that one winter games trailer where he was ice skating, for example.

[Emerald Chaos]

Huh? Are those both drawn by Yuji Eukawa? And was this supposed to support or refute what I said?

If you were to give classic Sonic the same colour effects and shading as modern Sonic in those pictures the design differences wouldn't be obvious at all. Heck, those pictures definitely make the differences in design seem small. No bigger than Metal Sonic's anyway.

Edited June 11, 2011 by Emerald Chaos

[goku262002]

Okay.

The changes between C.Sonic and M.Sonic are the same as those between C.Metal and M.Metal.

For some odd reason, i really want you to do a knuckles comparison. think you could whip one up?

Honestly it doesn't look like they did too much re change metal's design. Like 'Slash said they just made the design match modern and injected a bit of realism into him instead of a cartoony robot look/feel.

Now if your comparing Classic Metal to Neos Metal, then you got a comparison to work on!

Edited June 11, 2011 by goku262002

[Mauro Fonseca]

They were both by Uekawa, he did some SA-style Classic Sonic in Sonic Jam and Japanese Sonic 3D Blast.

I took the liberty of colouring it Adventure style, if it helps:

And it's not supporting or refuting, you said you'd need them in the same style to be able to compare so I gave you both on the same style.

Edited June 11, 2011 by The KKM

[Indigo Rush]

Okay, here's how I refute the silly "same amount of changes" argument.

I have a plain beef-and-frank chili dog, and I have a plain ketchup and mustard hamburger.

With the chili dog, I will add some onions on top, make the frank a little longer and maybe add some cheese, fluff the buns up so they're slightly bigger, and put it on a fancy plate. This is Metal Sonic.

With the hamburger, I will turn it green and give it arms. This is Sonic.

Which one looks the most different from the original? The hamburger you say? But didn't I give it less changes than the chili dog?

Metal Sonic may have as many features changed as Sonic did, but Sonic's were more noticeable and major.

Metal's were not noticeable enough to upset anyone until just recently. He's had a different design for a while, now. Don't you think people would have taken notice?

Edited June 11, 2011 by Indigo Rush

[Blue Blood]

For some odd reason, i really want you to do a knuckles comparison. think you could whip one up?

Edited June 11, 2011 by Blue Blood

[Indigo Rush]

Done

Really, the same basic adjustments happened to every character, except Amy and Eggman who went under more significant overhauls.

Point missed. It's not the amount of changes, it's that the changes are the same.

Edited June 11, 2011 by Indigo Rush