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goku262002

Classic Gameplay - What needs to be Fixed

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Sega should just watch this video. It addresses most of the things they need to fix.

His voice annoys the hell out of me, really portrays that self-entitled nerd schtick that's so popular thanks to Linkera and Angry Video Game Nerd. But he has some valid points, namely way too many damn automated sections and the way too damn good spindash.

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What should we do? Should we wait for a more up-to-date demo or just keep critiquing this one? It's possible the problems we're having with this demo could have been fixed already.

This is the demo SEGA gave us to try, so this is how we provide feedback. The build is about a month and a half old (May 11th). If problems X and Y have already been fixed or are on the agenda for the team already, fantastic! But maybe they weren't aware of problem Z? In which case, we keep providing critique.

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This is the demo SEGA gave us to try, so this is how we provide feedback. The build is about a month and a half old (May 11th). If problems X and Y have already been fixed or are on the agenda for the team already, fantastic! But maybe they weren't aware of problem Z? In which case, we keep providing critique.

Good point. We'll cover all bases in case Sega misses one. A very sound plan.

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Bwahaha! Ninja'd you there, matey. But seriously, that needs to be fixed. And good Lord, the scripted ramps. I'm sorry, but they completely undermine what the Classic Sonic gameplay is all about.

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This. The number of scripted segments in a Classic Sonic physics engine is supposed to be absolutely zero.

Ummm, aren't there scripted tubes in S2 and S3&K? =/

Anyhoo, I noticed that the S-tubes in Generations were scripted long before the demo came to light, but I didn't know that the ramps and other things were too. That's kind of underwhelming. I wonder, though: Isn't it actually more work to define all of these events than it would be to simply stick with a nice physics engine and let the level design have its way with the character?

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Ummm, aren't there scripted tubes in S2 and S3&K? =/

Anyhoo, I noticed that the S-tubes in Generations were scripted long before the demo came to light, but I didn't know that the ramps and other things were too. That's kind of underwhelming. I wonder, though: Isn't it actually more work to define all of these events than it would be to simply stick with a nice physics engine and let the level design have its way with the character?

The physics engine is there and works fine. However, the ramps and such are scripted so you play the level the way that Sonic Team wants you to play it. Rather than design the level with physics in mind, they designed the level and undermine the physics with scripted behaviour so it can be played.

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The physics engine is there and works fine. However, the ramps and such are scripted so you play the level the way that Sonic Team wants you to play it. Rather than design the level with physics in mind, they designed the level and undermine the physics with scripted behaviour so it can be played.

My thing is, they're making an effort to put some divergences in the main path, and there's also only going to be so many divergences through these levels that you can reach at one time. For example, if you go off of a ramp and there's a forking, you're either going to hit the top level or the bottom level, maybe a middle level if they're creative, all depending upon your speed. There's no point in adding guidance to that; in fact, it's counterproductive. I can understand scripting something like the whale running in Cool Edge, but ramps? Again, seems like more work that's ultimately in opposition to the level design we've actually seen so far, and completely unnecessary work for the team. =/

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Ummm, aren't there scripted tubes in S2 and S3&K? =/

I don't remember how they functioned in Sonic 2 and S3&K, but in Sonic 1 they weren't scripted and were completely down to momentum. You could walk through either end of the tubes at low speed and it would turn you into a ball automatically, but it'd still have momentum applied to it. This was a good thing because it would prevent you from operating the tubes in reverse in a way that wasn't accidental. It also feels just completely awkward to approach a tube in zero speed but shoot up to max.

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I don't remember how they functioned in Sonic 2 and S3&K, but in Sonic 1 they weren't scripted and were completely down to momentum. You could walk through either end of the tubes at low speed and it would turn you into a ball automatically, but it'd still have momentum applied to it. This was a good thing because it would prevent you from operating the tubes in reverse in a way that wasn't accidental. It also feels just completely awkward to approach a tube in zero speed but shoot up to max.

Oh, I understand that plenty well. But in industrial and base levels, I'm pretty certain there's been some automated set pieces in S2 and S3&K regardless-- Death Egg's tube thingies and Launch Base Zone's swiveling Eggmobile knock-off come to mind for me. The poster made it sound as if any automation whatsoever was some kind of travesty to the classic physics engine, and frankly the tone kinda irked me. xP

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This guy pretty much sums up everything in one video. While it can't be for certain that Sega will actually sit and read this entire thread due to tl;dr reasons, could we maybe get OP to re-post this video and the rolling video into the original post so we know Sega sees it? I for one would appreciate it greatly.

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Been messing about with the controls, got a few complaints: Seems very unwilling to let me roll sometimes, particularly off springs or speed from environmental circumstances. Trying to jump right after releasing a spin dash is tricky, you tend to just do a normal jump for some reason. The B button only seems to function when you aren't moving.

The above was cross posting from another thread. the rest is new:

Sonic has a Sonic CD style airborne speed cap for some reason, which is especially strange considering he can go faster just by running.

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Actually in Sonic 1 walking through an incline like the one posed in the demo, Sonic would be able to eventually reach the top. It only din't work on quarter convex curves.

I'm fairly sure that video wasn't an unintentional effort however, I just wanted to post it somewhere.

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My very first run on the Sonic Generations demo i fell through a rope bridge enuf said. Some serious things need to be addressed. Delay it to 2012 give it another year in developmenet make sure it comes out the other end of the tunnel running at full speed like sonic would.

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I'm not sure how it happens, but sometimes I phase through the Buzzers. I'll restart the stage a couple times to work on my speed run, and you need to destroy some Buzzers to get the faster routes, but I phase through them. The cam still hurt me with their attacks though.

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Oh yeah, I forgot a complaint because every game since Adventure 1 has been doing this: The springs work on contact with any side rather than just the top.

You may do that but whenever I play as C.Sonic in this game I just have the urge to jump on the springs like the classic games even though I can run into them but I guess that just shows how much I've played Mega Drive Sonic's over the years XD but it's a nice addition to C.Sonic so it can keep the flow going in the game which the designers have intended since Adventure I don't see it as a flaw or a issue.

Edited by Esperance

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I'm not sure how it happens, but sometimes I phase through the Buzzers. I'll restart the stage a couple times to work on my speed run, and you need to destroy some Buzzers to get the faster routes, but I phase through them. The cam still hurt me with their attacks though.

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I'm tired of waiting for the sega forums to go back online, damn hackers, so I've registered here to talk about this issue.

I know there is an unpaid betatesting thread, but I feel this specific issue (imo the most important issue of the game) deserves it's own thread.

So here's hoping this does not get merged.

As a big fan of the MD era games, and someone who has not really enjoyed any of the modern Sonic games that much, bar Colours, I have been very excited about SG.Finally getting my hands on the demo on Sonic's b-day further excited me but at the same time was dissapointing.

As you guys know, the basic physics of Sonic are correct and the gameplay is a MASSIVE improvement over S4 but there are a few important aeras of the gameplay that need to be fixed.

ROLLING / UNCURLING- Sonic rolls correctly on flats and does not uncurl, but when he rolls downhill his speed decreases and he tends to uncurl. In the original games, whenever the player rolled Sonic downhill his speed would greatly increase and his momentum build dramatically, also he would not uncurl unless he came to a stop or the player pressed jump and he landed back on the floor. ST needs to fix the rolling so it works how it did in the original games.

JUMP- I don't expect Classic Sonic to feel EXACTLY like he did in the MD games- his jump does not have to have the same hangtime, tho it would be nice, but he DOES need to be able to jump slightly higher as a lot of the time it is a struggle to reach platforms with the jump as it is in the demo. So I think Sonic's maximum jump height needs to be increased by half a hedgehog.

BOASTING RAMPS- The distance/angle that Sonic flies off the edge of ramps into the sky should only be the result of his own momentum and the angle of take off and nothing else. A number of the ramps in the SG demo have weird and un-needded boosts built in. The best example of this is after the two s-bends there is a big ramp that sends Sonic rocketing skywards for the ringgrab. But if you go back to that ramp, after the s-bends, and stand in front of it and spindash through it, Sonic will shoot the same 100ft or whatever into the air off the ramp as if he had come through the two s-bends because that ramp has a ridiculous boost which is activated if Sonic flies off it in a ball. THIS IS WRONG. NONE OF THE RAMPS SHOULD HAVE BOOSTS.

Sonic Team- You have done a great job so far with this game, the level design, graphics and basic physics of Sonic are all spot on.

But these three issues are very important and will be the difference between how well this game is received by the fans and the press.

Please rectify these issues.

All the best.

Edited by Dangerous

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